How/when did the tide turn on schools?

[LaceCurtains]

In the beginning the mood here was almost desperate calling for schools to be closed.

In the last week or so there's been a marked shift to getting them open (from peope here).

Is it the same people who wanted the closed, now calling for them to get back to normal or have the original campaigners gone quiet/new people got louder?

FWIW I always thought schools closed as early as they did because of public pressure and it seems to me that "other" things are getting back to normal more quickly than originally planned/expected (because of DC and the need to distract?) but schools don't seem to be included in that.

I'm at a loss as to why schools are being treated so differently. I'm SLT in school, if that makes a difference and the government guidance is a shambles. Changes daily but doesn't seem to have any clear aim.

Ah...and not to forget parents becoming quite tired of reading comments on MN suggesting that they are useless and belligerent if they can’t teach their own child, or that it’s their responsibility, or that they would be basically murdering their grannies by going back to school.

I hope the teachers on MN aren’t representative of the teaching profession, however I’m in. WhatsApp group containing some primary staff, who are openly referring to their pupils as ‘the bloody kids.’ I think there is a whole army of hysterical (and frankly not very bright) teachers out there who are determined that they know better than anyone else and that their opinion should be final.

Schools closed themselves down initially before the government said to. We had no staff left and were already opening to one year only by the time school closures was announced. Also parents had stopped sending their kids in.

I know user but why?

The virus isn't rife in the population anymore and the WHO have now said asymptomatic spread is very rare. So why do schools need to be so restricted still? Provided people with symptoms stay away, where's the great risk?

Myself and other key workers are also now unable to take up key worker school places due to the insistence that they remain apart from their year group once they return.

I am amazed that more key workers don’t just go off sick. An army of doctors and nurses off sick with stress would focus the mind.

@Nihiloxica

I am so angry about the way our children have been treated. I don't think I've ever felt so politically angry about anything.

Me too and me neither.

Me three. Wrote to my MP for the first time ever yesterday. Please do this if you haven’t already done so; I don’t think they have any idea how angry people are about it.

A true scandal in my eyes is how this lengthy period of time has not been spent experimenting and improving the virtual learning experience.

To me, the local school made the decision not to bother investing in learning / improving, believing they’d be back soon enough.

Well now it’s August until first pupils go back under strict social distancing, with online learning for all well after that.

There is a difference between transmission from those who are totally asymptomatic and remain so (and the WHO is saying that is less common than first estimated, but not impossible) and with transmission from within the incubation period (before symptoms show, including from those whose symptoms remain mild) and that is is definitely possible.

Are you aware of the research from the Southampton paediatric infectious disease professors? Every cluster they looked at showed minimal risk from children having or spreading. The child in the Swiss alps had normal contact with another 100 odd kids. Not one got it. Schools need to open

I wanted them closed as I felt that the government were locking down too late and it would result in a long lockdown with lots of deaths. I would absolutely love them to be open now but, in England at least, the too late and half arsed approach means that we haven't got case numbers low enough and track and trace isn't established. I know people are desperate for lockdown to be over but if we rush out of it we'll end up rushing back into it again.

It does seem unfair that facilities for adults are opening before those for children but I understand that children cannot socially distance in the same way as adults so opening things for them needs to take that into account.

@LaceCurtains

I know user but why?

The virus isn't rife in the population anymore and the WHO have now said asymptomatic spread is very rare. So why do schools need to be so restricted still? Provided people with symptoms stay away, where's the great risk?

Because people didn’t grasp that that’s NOT what the WHO actually meant. Reuters covers it accurately:

"The WHO agrees that pre-symptomatic carriers are infectious, and adds that there is also a possibility - although little evidence so far - that people who are asymptomatic may also transmit the virus."

www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-asymptomatic-expla-idUSKBN23A21S

No spread to adults either. Schools remaining closed is indefensible now

The evidence also shows that children do not spread this virus.

The risks of opening schools is tiny and of leaving them closed is enormous.

This is a type of mass hysteria.

I never wanted them closed in the first place, I wanted them to stay open. I sent DS in until they closed.

Dissimilitude, initially schools really had such a lot to do there was no time (or energy) to organise that properly. First all keyworkers and vulnerable children had to be accommodated and them it was only those who really needed to be in school, leaving a lot of vulnerable children to be "safeguarded" remotely, which of course was all new too. Then there was the fsm fiasco, I can't tell you how many hours went into that.

Then we were reopening after half term and planned for that, which also took enormous time and it was nearly all over and investing resources in proper online learning was unecessary/wasteful.

Plus of course pushback from the unions at every new idea.

I accept that early on it was necessary to shut the schools. And as I'm in Scotland, I accepted that it would probably be until the new term in August.

However, I really thought that school would step up and actually provide some sort of education, which hasn't been happening. Sorry teachers, but a few worksheets and links to Sumdog aren't good enough.

Also, even with 0 deaths in Scotland for the last two days, the scottish government are still banging on about part time school for the next academic year.

it's not good enough.

I agree if we'd just been told remote learning for the vast majority until September, we'd have done it much better.

It isn't as simple as some seem to have thought of "oh well, summer holidays soon", the problem is that nothing else is open for children either. If there were sports clubs, museums, playgrounds etc then children could socialise and entertain themselves much better. It seems like some local authorities / unions / teachers are refusing to go back yet, so maybe the answer is opening up all the other options that would usually be available in summer months, and the government giving a number of childcare credits to anyone on benefits to allow wider participation. With a raft of extra DBS checks, surely provision can be expanded taking on ex-hospitality/travel staff. With offices largely working from home, the shared office companies could be called on to provide extra space for clubs along with outdoor activities. The biggest difficulty will be toilets.

It’s a disgrace and il be livid if they don’t go back to normality in September.

I am so angry about the way our children have been treated. I don't think I've ever felt so politically angry about anything.

Me too.

I am shocked at how many people thought schools would just be closed for a couple of weeks, we knew in March that Wuhan had been in lockdown for a couple of months already. Why anyone thought we'd be any different I'm not sure. I'm actually surprised my Y6 has gone back at all.

If we want the economy to get back on its feet schools need to be open for children whose parents can't WFH. Much as I'm not enjoying juggling work and home education DH and I do have the space and resources for it and the schools should prioritise the children most in need who don't have our advantages.

@Speeding201700
@Nihiloxica

No they haven't said that it isn't spread by asymptomatic people, if you read the whole thing.

They've simply repeated what the scientists have been saying all along. asymptomatic people are less likely to spread it. Hardly surprising if they're not coughing!!

Asymptomatic spread is common in households and carehomes is shared indoor space... now, remind me what classrooms are...that's right - shared indoor space!

I’ve been shocked at how poorly my local school has adapted to online teaching. My kids are done with their daily assignments inside of an hour. There’s zero real-time teacher interaction, and they’ve abandoned new content teaching.

Very similar to what has been delivered to my younger secondary kids. Y12 is ok as they self direct more in A level and lives their subjects.

@BlusteryLake

Our children have been thrown under a massive bus and it makes me angrier every day. All this money thrown at the furlough scheme yet not a penny on getting our children back into education. It is a disgrace.

What would you have preferred? Their parents losing their jobs, so they lost their homes & had no food? Furlough helps children as much as adults.

@IncrediblySadToo no, they haven't, they say it's "very rare".

Lockdown happened to late. We failed to adequately track and trace. We failed to prepare. Look at New Zealand...

Now we are living with the virus but if we are to do so without careful planning we risk the situation imploding again. Now is the time for huge reinvestment in education. The government who bled the system dry must now reinvest so that we can provide smaller groups, PPE, more sanitation facilities, better tracking and tracing and a confidence from everyone that schools can be opened more safely.

We need action and planning to rest I'll confidence.