So no hugging, mixing households until a vaccine?

[NutellaOnButteryToast]

Hi,

I have been wondering this for a long time and then last week, Nick Hancock admitted that this would likely be the case.....which is horrendous.

If we do manage to keep R under 1 and eventually well below, which I do understand is looking unlikely without more waves, then why won't it ever be safe to mix with our loved ones until there's a vaccine?

I'm starting to feel suffocated by the idea, as I know so many are.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks.

@HeatherIV Absolutely agree with you

I am a Nanny and can go in and hug the children I care for as it is my workplace... I'm not saying grandparents who are possibly at risk should but assess your risk and if you have a relationship that you really need that close contact with then 🤷🏻‍♀️

Most people in my own family and my closest friends, although it's weird purposely staying at a distance from I can see them now 1:1 and that's something.

@Chillipeanuts - yes even if it is a risk to them. People take risks every day! Far greater risks than being seriously ill with COVID. Getting in a car, eating loads of sugar and being obese, smoking, riding a motorbike these are all high risk yet people do them every day!
I can tell you now, I know lots of people who have been visiting family esp this last week. If i know lots (and I am in an area where people in general have been very obedient of lockdown) then millions of others would have too

Fair enough. My husband is shielding so I would tell you to stay away but as you say, personal choice.

I’m taking the calculated risk approach. My first baby was born on 7th April after a long fight with infertility and ivf to get him here. Whilst I haven’t let any Tom dick of Harry meet him. My mum has and my sister. I needed the emotional support after a traumatic birth and it was important. We had been isolating/social distancing 3 weeks prior To birth and they were symptom free and the same. A calculated and considered risk. That is how we will continue. Small numbers reduced risk.

@Chillipeanuts I totally get that. Shielding is a different ball game. My dad isn’t shielding but is very vulnerable. I wouldn’t dare see him any time soon. I hope you are coping ok- it must be so difficult not to be able to go out for walks and fresh air

Hopefully testing and antibody tests will be readily available and effective soon.

We haven't seen anyone else since lockdown began apart from neighbours or people in the street, all at more than 2m distance. We haven't been into a shop for three weeks. DM is the same.

But as of 1st June, DS is supposed to go back to nursery and my cleaner wants to come back to work.

So the sensible thing to me, to prevent spread, is that we do and see DM before any of us get germy.

Social distancing will not be taking place in day nurseries, Preschool’s or at childminders. So there will be young children mixing with others there.

My family have said after the 1st June if there is still no changes to allow mixing households we are doing it anyway. I can’t keep my 3 and 1 year old away from their grandparents any longer, it’s no good for their development to only ever see me.

No one will stick to this over Christmas. Or before that, tbh.
Whatever the rules, you can’t stop human nature. People will be mixing again soon - and I truly believe we should be.

My family have said after the 1st June if there is still no changes to allow mixing households we are doing it anyway

A lot of people are saying this.

People will be mixing again by July.

I'm not bothered about keeping a distance, but I just want to be able to see friends and have dinner.

TBF, I have a friend who lives about 200 yards away and following the change in guidelines she's coming to sit in the garden this afternoon. I'll wipe the chairs down etc first, and we'll stay 2m apart but I am very excited to have any plans at all.

I have a colleague who is a single parent to a child with SEN, she is finding the evenings/weekends incredibly stressful and lonely and she doesn't look well now We spend 40 hours a week together at work, so I'm thinking of saying to her she should come here at the weekends and hang out with my family. If we are already in so much close contact I can't see what harm it would do, and that the risks are surely outnumbered by the benefits to her and her son?! I worry though that militant individuals like we see on here would report us/make her feel bad for doing it (not me, I couldn't give a stuff what people think of me )

Couldnt care less about hugging my siblings or their families but I do miss giving my dad a hug. Most of all I miss my OH - we cant move in together but haven't seen each other for 8 weeks (except for one illicit night together) as we've obeyed all the rules. But in the lack of any announcement concerning couples we are breaking the rules today. And no, we won't keep 2m apart

This is why I like the Irish plan. It sets out clearly when people will be able to meet socially and how. We know we won't see my parents until late July at best, which is a fortnight after our baby is due. But we know there's a plan which makes it much easier to bear. And look! It's the first thing on the list as they know that's what people care about. Unlike Boris not mentioning it at all in his speech.

I think people are much more likely to break the restrictions when they don't have a plan laid out with a date to focus on. I know the dates can change, but it's still helpful to have one imo.

There is no way people will not have physical contact without a vaccine. It’s impossible. They have said there’s only 50/50 chance of a vaccine anyway. So that would mean (if everyone followed the rules) no one would have partners, unless they were already living together. The birth rate would go down significantly for however many years a vaccine isn’t available. Schools would close because there wouldn’t be enough kids to teach (there would maybe only be half as many children). Not to mention the mental health of society would be terrible.

We’ve followed the rules, but I think people are going to start mixing in June. Some rules are just silly in my opinion.... You can now car share to work (announced the other day) if you can’t walk or cycle. But you can’t drive your friend (who has been isolating) to the hospital - they have to get a taxi with someone who is in contact with many other people!
You can’t have someone in your house at a 2m distance for half an hour, yet you can have a cleaner around at a 2m distance for many hours.
The list goes on.

@Catsmother1

My thoughts entirely. I can't work other whether the rules are just designed to make the fearful feel more safe about going back to work; of whether there is somthing more sinester going on. Trying to break social bonds or some form of social control.

The seeing one person in a park is the most stupid. So I can see my mum in a park at a 2m distance. She can then go back to the car and my dad can get out and come see me. Then they both return home in the same car. Pointless. If you're mixing with one person from a household, your mixing with all of them. Because they will cross contaminate each other. You may as well just see them together. And why a park where you could sit on a bench 100s of people have sat on, but not in their own private garden.

I'll only follow the rules if they can come up with ones that make sense. Until then I'll keep taking my kids round to see my mum.

I've already created a bubble with my parents. I've got a toddler and 12 week old, the past 9 weeks have been fucking hard. We all stayed in for a week beforehand then we made the move (we're here permanently now til 1st June assuming there will be some change then). It was the best move for all of us - everyone is so much happier. I think there has to come a time when people weigh up the mental/social implications of lockdown and calculate the very small risk of making a change.

They’re just trying to reduce the number of interactions to keep R0 down ... people interact casually in the community/transport, at work/school, socially in groups for recreation & intimately within small groups of family/friends.

They can’t keep all those interactions low permanently enough to stop transmission so they have to relax the most important ones socially/economically ie getting people back to work/school. Casual community interactions can be controlled by social distancing rules, recreation in groups will be banned for ages (gyms, gigs, theatre etc). Small groups of people meeting is most difficult because it’s what we all want but potentially has the highest risk of transmission & transmission to the most vulnerable people. It’s going to be pretty grim for a while ... work interactions permitted (people sharing cars, nannies hugging their children etc) but social ones banned ... because the risk/benefit ratio is different for very similar behaviours.

For what it’s worth I’ll be breaking the rules this afternoon - I’m going to see my mum & dad in their garden at the same time & I will sit down (on my own chair!) 2m away & chat!

I'm going to go to see my 85 year old uncle and his partner in the next couple of weeks. I'll sit in his front garden 2m away from them on my own chair eating the sandwiches I've made. I won't hug them but I want to see him and he wants to see me and the risk is minimal (I'm probably more at risk from them!) and we're not prepared to wait any longer.

It's Eid in a couple of weeks. I'm hopeful that there will be an easing that allows us to mix with one other household to coincide with that.

I know that a lot of the people I've spoken to are feeling more despondent after the government's announcement last weekend that focused solely on the economy. Particularly the seemingly ridiculous notion that you can invite a cleaner into your home when you have no idea how many other homes/people they have had contact with but you aren't permitted to see your parents when you know exactly who you and they have had contact with.

Some people will willingly self isolate until a vaccine is found; the majority wouldn't tolerate that.

If the government allow mixing of two households, for example, people will be more willing to follow that rule. If they follow a hardline of no contact, people will just think "fuck it" and meet who they like.

It's not sustainable and because I've had enough of not seeing my parents in the flesh I'm driving this afternoon to meet up for a 2m apart walk - the first time I've seen them in three months. I won't hug them just yet, hard as that will be, but if my DD, their DGD, is going back to school to sit in a bubble of 14 other children, which effectively means she'll be socialising her those 14 kids and their families and everyone they're in touch with, I don't see why I can't see my mum and dad, albeit at a distance.

I don't think a vaccine this year is feasible. But if they get their finger out with Test Track Trace then we could get back to normal more quickly. If they could test anyone with symptoms and get the answer quickly, then quarantine people they'd been in contact with, we could reduce the transmission without needing the social distancing. Look at how they've managed it in South Korea.

It relies on the ability to test alot of people which is probably the main stumbling block we have now.

I still think this will be quicker than vaccine though.

I think whether we have social distancing for 18 months will depend on what happens to the death rates as restrictions are lifted. if they shoot up then people will continue to comply, if they remain static or drop then they won't.