For those who want schools to go back..

[pfrench]

.. tell us how you think it should work. Primary or secondary.

In your ideal world.

How would social distancing be adhered to?
How about drop off and pick up?
How would classrooms operate?
How about lunchtimes and breaktimes?
What about after school childcare provision?
What about staff who are sheidling?
What about children who are sheilding?
What about staff who have family members who are sheilding?
Should only some children go back? Who should they be and why?

So many education and school experts on here, it will be interesting to read your safe solutions.

For those that need some sort of childcare provision to keep their jobs.

-Tell us how financial commitments work.
-Tell us what happens if you don’t pay your rent/mortgage.
-Tell is what child poverty looks like.

So many economic experts on here, it would be interesting to read your safe solutions.

I am not 'one of those' posters at all but I would say on a few points -

children who are shielding will be a minority and we cannot wait to send schools back until it is safe for them (unless a vaccine is found soon) - imagine they have to shield for 12 months, should all children have to stay off?

As for staff who live with a shielding relative - there are HCP's frontline who have shielding relatives, what makes teachers so special?

I don't want my kids going back too early but they will have to go back at some point.

I just hope it’s a choice when they do return so those who want their children kept off longer aren’t fined

As for staff who live with a shielding relative - there are HCP's frontline who have shielding relatives, what makes teachers so special?

Are teachers going to be given alternative accommodation away from their family to they can protect them?,

Don’t fine those who feel the risk is too great for their personal circumstances. Give schools budget for bank/supply teachers (I’m sure there are plenty of low risk younger teachers available) so that teachers who are at risk can stay home. Kids to bring packed lunch/or school provide one and to be eaten outside if possible. Staggered drop off/pick up. Lots of hand washing for kids.
I’ll be sending my kids back as soon as possible.

BriefDisaster so when do you think they should go back? And everyone at once or phased? And I guess you think all teachers unless shielding is that right?

Are teachers going to be given alternative accommodation away from their family to they can protect them?

I dont know are Tesco workers? Care home workers? NHS cleaners?

@WhyNotMe40

I don't want to speculate. I would like my son to go back in august but it will be the Scottish Government who decide not me.

As for teachers then yes if other people have to go back to work in the interim then why not them?

I think they should go back when schools can individually say that they can be safe.

Some thoughts:

Children do a week on, week off to minimise class size

Same staff are with group 1 and group 2, but groups in separate rooms, with TA and non teaching staff (SLT) support.

Keyworker children in full time but in a separate group as they are the ones at highest risk of picking up the virus from their parents

Children bought to the gate but no adults allowed past the front gate.

Staggered collection times.

One way in and one way out from school gate by parents to minimise crossover (this is school specific as ours is at the end of a cul de sac)

I spoke to my sons schools today. They said they expect kids back in September at the earliest (NI) and even then they have no idea how to do it safely. Old school - small classrooms. Exam kids in first.

So do we disband state education then?...remember we do not know we will ever have a vaccine so if those in education say we cannot run school in a world where we have the virus then we cannot run school at all for the foreseeable future. To me those are the options

• social distancing in school
• no school

I don’t like the second option so think we need to try the first. And trying the first on a limited basis in June with the natural break of the summer holidays of it goes wrong seems sensible - get it wrong in September and a rise hits the winter flu season!

Unless as an expert you can tell me what is impossible in June will be possible in September or January or next March or whatever date in the future you would open schools with the virus still present?

How would social distancing be adhered to?

Space between seats. Packed lunches eaten at desks. Or staggered meal times. Realistically social distancing isn't going to be possible in playground but risk of transmission outside is low anyway

How about drop off and pick up?

Drop them off as usual but with no gossiping at the school gates 🤷‍♀️

How would classrooms operate?

Same as usual with space between seats

How about lunchtimes and breaktimes?

Staggered

What about after school childcare provision?

See above

What about staff who are sheidling?

This shielding thing was for 12 weeks during the peak - that will be up in a few weeks time. They can't expect to shield forever - if you expect to wait until a vaccine or until cases reach zero you'll be out of a job

What about children who are sheilding?

Same as above

What about staff who have family members who are sheilding?

People in the NHS are still going to work and they are much more exposed than teachers....

Should only some children go back? Who should they be and why?

By age group

All pretty logical and sensible really it's just that the hysterical quarters of MN will be calling for the schools to be shut for the rest of the year

I think schools going back will be incompatible with work for a while - I think parents will be shafted even more if there expected to be back in work but they only have school provision for one child, or two days a week, or whatever else gets worked out.

Yep I’ve just read in the paper that our schools aren’t due back now until Sept (NI), and it will apparently be a phased system. So I have a current P1 who will have missed out on and will continue to miss out on the basic fundamentals of maths/English, and a child due to start nursery, but will be completely confused being in and out.

I’m actually really quite cross at the minute.

So should teachers and students be given the protection given to other workers?
For example shop workers and transport workers - 2 m distancing, adequate hand washing facilities or hand gel, plastic screens, not hours exposure in the same room.
Or like care workers who have up close exposure to people who may or may not be infected - gowns, adequate hand washing facilities, masks and gloves?

Or the same protection offered to office workers - no hot desking, 2 m distancing, adequate hand washing?

Will any of those work in schools where teenage purposeful cough on each other for a joke , young children just have no concept of keeping away from their friends, and neither should they.

Or do we just wait until community transmission is lower enough and we have effective trace and trace going?

Don't forget that parents will send poorly children to school as they need to work, and fail to pick those children up when asked as that happens all the time, even in the week before lockdown.

And don't forget that schools are run on a string staffing and budget wise. There are no spare classrooms or spare staff to split classes up.

I'm just glad it's not my job to decide!

I’m a teacher. I would answer your questions like this...

How would social distancing be adhered to?
It won’t. We can move tables apart a bit and reduce numbers coming in, but children won’t be able to social distance from one another. I’m in a hub a few days a week and the amount of surprise hugs I get is rather concerning. In high school it’ll be worse as there is more often defiance from teens who know best or think they’re invincible.

How about drop off and pick up?
Either buses will have to run at half capacity, or parents or people within your ‘bubble’ will have to do it.
Again, I’d love to see the children police themselves to social distance on the bus.

How would classrooms operate?
Horribly. Kids sat in the same place all day. Limited movement. Limited break time. Limited choice of food. Lessons lacking interaction and creativity. Mostly learning from the completion of worksheets; watching videos and listening to the teacher.

How about lunchtimes and breaktimes?
Staggered. Policed by a lot of staff. But probably still chaotic. Again limited social distancing and staff resigned to not really being able to do much about that.

What about after school childcare provision?
In secondary, after school clubs are unlikely to run. No teacher will want that continued responsibility and with lessons being so prescriptive and seated, the kids will be ready to go home.
After school clubs possible for key workers in primary perhaps, with limited spaces.

What about staff who are shielding?
Staff asked to come back following the 12 weeks of shielding.
If they cannot, long term cover supervisors brought in.

What about children who are shielding?
Parent given choice initially as to whether they want to keep their child home or send them in anyway. Can’t see attendance being compulsory prior to September. But after this, unless you get further doctors letters, all children expected back at school.

What about staff who have family members who are shielding?
Nothing at all. Expected to work and just take ordinary hygiene precautions. As it is now.

Should only some children go back? Who should they be and why?

Initially-
year 6 for transition. Possibly all of the primary school children as there is a need for childcare. I anticipate many parents will opt out of sending kids back that soon, so numbers many be low enough to manage.

Year 10 and 12 for exams in secondary.

I don’t have an opinion on when we should go back. I just know I will be back sometime fairly soon.

Mine is childcare not school. Social distancing at the setting will be impossible for under 4s. And nor should it happen. This will damage the children mentally if it were to happen. At the setting we go to, one member of staff is shielded so she probably won't be working.

We will be social distancing outside of childcare and work, to reduce the risk to ourselves. This is our personal risk assessment on the situation.

We can WFH for a while but not forever as I rely on engagement from students for my role. WFH with a 3 year old is impossible. And I am so tired from trying to do it.

If you want to stay at home until vaccine is found, then do it. But don't bleat on at others that don't have the choice to stay at home for that amount of time how we are killing people. You have to take personal responsibility for your situation. You don't need to be told what to do by the government. Home school for months or years, knock yourself out.

How would social distancing be adhered to?
class sat 1m apart (what the WHO reccomend) teachers generally staying at the front of the classroom when they can. Could wear masks possibly if they wanted to?

How about drop off and pick up?
No parents in classrooms, maybe staggered pick up and drop offs for each year by 10 minutes? Only 1 parent / carer in the playground waiting
How would classrooms operate?
isnt this the same as question 1?
How about lunchtimes and breaktimes?
possibly staggered again, each class using their own classroom to eat?
What about after school childcare provision?
this needs to exist if anyone is ever going to go back to work, adults staying 2m apart wherever they can... not sure what else you can do about this to be honest
What about staff who are sheidling?
they can elect to take sick leave?
What about children who are sheilding?
they wouldnt be required to go in, should be supported with home learning
What about staff who have family members who are sheilding?
again could elect to take sick leave... live somewhere else... make their own risk assessment?
Should only some children go back? Who should they be and why?
perhaps to start with this will have to be the case.
They should be the vulnerable children, the children doing exams next year and id possibly say those whos parents work FT

A lot of parents are saying they wont send their kids back until a vaccine or until september, so schools might not be as full as we think anyway.

My son's special is still open. Pupils have gone back by priority of need of emotional and mental health. No child has had to go back. There is no social distancing within classes ( although many naturally do this) but are small classes. Very few shielding staff as most are young and physically fit. Different classes are not mixing and some indoor facilities such as soft play are not used. Children are on transport ( seems all individual currently) or brought in by parents. PPE that has always been used is worn but not masks. Classes are going in at slightly different times for lunch and having outdoor time at different times.

Very small class sizes will be the only way to implement social distancing.

That will mean some parents will be on here daily objecting though that they can’t get back to work as normal and it’s not fair.

It won’t be fair if I am unable to pay my mortgage, no. Honestly, do all these people who think schools should remain shut indefinitely have no financial commitments?

Honestly, do all these people who think schools should remain shut indefinitely have no financial commitments?

my best guess is yes. When i have raised that previously, i have been told to be inventive in solving my childcare issue. Hire a nanny (i dont earn enough) get an au pair (how the hell does anyone think thats gonna happen right now and you cant use them for FT childcare anyway!) work weekends (Well i have applied for a weekend job but its not even half of what my usual salary is!)

From my point of view, school can't be entirely safe, but that isn't a reason to avoid it forever. The shops aren't entirely safe. NHS workers aren't. Binmen aren't. Care workers aren't.

All we can do is make it as safe as possible and see what happens with the second wave. Or never open again.

These threads are becoming pointless.

So many people lack the imagination or intelligence to work out for themselves how teaching is different to working in an office or supermarket that it seems pointless explaining it.

Again...