‘School will have to look different from now on’....

[Starrynightsabove]

‘With a mix of home schooling and in-school learning’

So said Nicola Sturgeon.

So how does this work for a single parent trying to work full time from home with a full on job who needs to pay the mortgage. Literally how does this work?

Re toilet issue, first off unless there is a medical issue most people and kids can hold 2h. There are times when you missed a chance to go at break or genuinely need and moat teachers are fine with this because it's not regular and theyvare also human and sometimes need to run.
The reason why kids can't just come and go to the toilet as the please is the same as in any place of work.
So, you are having a team meeting before startingbyourbcore work, it's only 5-10 mins, lots of info everyone needs to be there. Only Bob needs to pee, so Bob runs off, then Jill. They get back as the briefing ends, they missed it all. Bob figures he knows it so just cracks on, Jill checks with collegues, the team leader has moved on to do work with other groups. Jill finds out what to do but gets into a wee chat with a few collegues, nothing majorbbut productivity down for 15 or so mins times 3 people. Bob however he is on task doing his thing. Only he missed the brief and is doingbit all wrong, no one notices for 3 or 4 h now 2 people need to spend 1/2 day undoing Bob's mistakes.
It's the same in the classroom 5-10 min direct teaching, interupted 3 ir 4 times for the toilet becomes 30 mins teaching. The other 2 groups due to get direct teaching miss out. People have missed instructions and understanding there is no time to check on this because we are late from everyone going to the toilet.
So to avoid thia constant interruption and missed learning we ask that kids usebthe toilet preferably during breaks, so roughly every 2h. Unless there is a health issue this is manageable for most. There are timesbthey need out during lesson times, when it is only 1 or 2 children it is manageable.
Add in the kids who go out to mess about, pee in the bins, stick toilet roll with poo on it back into dispensers, catch up with their mates, dealing with this takes more time away from meaningful teaching. Suddenly a very different looking scene from the simple one if a home schooled child able to meander through their own house.
Toileting is not draconian, it is not cruel it is managing an environment for safety and allowing work to take place. After saying that my class can go when they need and self sign out. But I teach in a different emotional environment than most.

I'm a bit bemused by the posters who are saying it's draconian to keep children in rooms and not let them leave, or not allow them out to use the toilet whenever they want. It's not like we're locking them in! Can you not imagine the chaos if children were free to roam the school when they wanted, toilet trips or otherwise? You'd have a core who would be in class pretty much the whole time, accessing the learning, getting input from the teacher etc. Then, of course, you'd get those who just sat outside on the wall having a laugh the whole time, occasionally popping in to class if something interesting was going on and then disappearing again.

And how far do you take this "human right"? We have a school fence and gates that are locked. Should these also be left wide open so children can assert their right and wander out of school whenever they want?

So said Nicola Sturgeon...

I stopped reading after this point...

My children are primary aged. Both set daily work. Eldest around 4 pieces, youngest more but teacher doesnt expect a certain amount daily iyswim. Both get marked each evening. Eldest gets feedback and any incorrect work gets pointed out. Teachers are lovely. I'm a carer for mum so can keep children off school to give place to child eith working parenting needed. I feel greatly for working parents atm, especially working single parents. I'm a single mum, but I'm fortunate to not have to work atm. It's all a mess, but we will all get through, somehow.

As a teacher, I cried. How the hell are we going to get them through GCSE next year or even the year after.

Well said, SallyLovesCheese

@choc71 why would you cry ? England might do something completely different

Both my two primary DC are absolutely hating their homeschooling so far even though they do have lovely teachers who are trying their best to deliver the learning remotely. They find the workload overwhelming with the zoom calls every hour stressful in itself. It's so frustrating and it seems there simply isn't the same motivation to learn at home in the same way students learn naturally at school in a social setting, surrounded by their friends.

I honestly don't know how we will get through the next 7 weeks...it's a battle everyday to get them to do any work set, (the older one has additional needs as well) and when they finally get round to it, they just do it half heartedly. I'm starting to wonder if this online learning is even an effective substitute in the first place. Maybe for secondary or older kids, online work can work but for my two DC I can't see any benefit whatsoever.

I had no choice but to quit my part time job in sales to help my DC in homeschooling. DH works in healthcare and is the main breadwinner. We still have to pay the private school fees as there is no state schools, to add insult to injury .

I feel so sorry for DC as the youngest especially, used to love going to school and had no previous issues completing school work. I'm worried if they have to keep learning remotely this way, it will put them off learning for good. It can't be good for their mental well being (or mine!)

We are abroad in the Middle East and now in week 7 of home learning, still another 8 weeks to go before the school holidays. The Education Ministry in early March, just simply announced that schools will be closed until September without even attempting to consider or discuss social distancing or any measures to safeguard children when/if schools open. No help for working parents, no support whatsoever.

At least they are thinking of solutions for the school issue in England, which is way more than I can say for the education sector here!

Before the pandemic, I remember the arguments about being entitled to holiday in term time. How missing 10 days of education in a year was nothing.
Now...they have missed 24 so far and they are being sacrificed?

No...the people who are being sacrificed are the frontline nurses and doctors who put their life on the line to care for others.
By all means send kids back to school next week because them spreading a virus and increasing the number of deaths even more over the 30,000 mark is ok as long as they continue to get their education.
This pandemic wasn't a choice, it wasn't expected. It is hard for many and it isn't fair but we have to do what we can and protect what we can.

Before the pandemic, I remember the arguments about being entitled to holiday in term time. How missing 10 days of education in a year was nothing.
Now...they have missed 24 so far and they are being sacrificed?

You didn’t hear it from me. Mine have never been off school in term time for a holiday, and nor will they ever.

Plus it’s 24 days so far. How many more days will it end up being? Education of kids in high school who are our future and will be paying all our pensions in years to come is actually important and at some point will have to become an increased priority. Maybe if your children are only in primary or not high achievers it’s not so much of big deal, but it is to me.

My son wants to be one of those front line doctors. Hardly going on to be able to if his education gets stuck on the back burner for an indefinite length of time.

Well if he’s bright enough to be a medic he’ll catch up quickly won’t he

Brainstorming solutions....As far as primary goes, what ultimately matters is that they learn the maths, reading and writing skills they need to do secondary level work. Too many kids don’t have access to devices to allow them to work online, but almost every household has a tv. I think there needs to be some new school channels where core subjects are taught for each year level. The kids could be set work daily and the parents drop it off at the school at the end of every week. The teachers spend their week marking the work from the week before and telephoning/zooming children to give them feedback and any extra help needed.

This would also have the advantage of it giving an opportunity for more vulnerable parents to touch base with someone from the school every week. The parents could share any concerns, ask for any support (eg with food) they might need, and if no one ever showed up from some homes, the school staff could follow up and see what support they needed.

The government could also publish workbooks for the core subjects and distribute them to all primary pupils.

It’s not ideal and it doesn’t solve the problem of how to both work from home and teach/look after your children, but it makes the children a little more independent from the parents, it means everyone is getting the same basic standard of teaching, and it’s not relying on technology that not everyone has access to.

Perhaps also something could be set up where half a class comes in in the morning and half in the afternoon, and that time is primarily spent doing exercise outside or in larger areas such as gyms or cafeterias, to give parents a couple of hours a day at least where they could have the house to themselves.

Something similar could be set up for secondary but obviously covering more subjects. The kids themselves could drop the work off daily and be allowed to spend a couple of hours at the school doing physical exercise, using computers if they don’t have them at home, catching up with friends in a supervised social distancing kind of way, talking to teachers about work they don’t understand or any problems they’re having at home.

By releasing teachers from setting work, this approach would free them up a little bit to give extra help to the kids who are struggling, either academically or socially/emotionally.

ChrissieKeller61 a child that is bright and self-motivated enough to be a doctor will be able to self-teach through this period and 'catch up' quickly afterwards. You are being overly dramatic.

I missed December - April of my Upper 6th year, at a previous time when A-Levels were 100% terminally examined, due to severe glandular fever. I still got 4 As and went to Oxford- and then it wasn't the case that everybody had missed school. It has not ruined my capacity to be a socioeconomically functional adult.

Sorry, that was to SodukoBook

they have missed 24 so far and they are being sacrificed

It's not about the number of school days being missed though-it's about the total period of time elapsing over which the students have no contact with school. They will forget huge, huge amounts. Students forget a lot over the summer vacation. This is going to be the summer vacation on steroids-half a year with no school at all.

Analyses of students affected by previous school closures in the past have shown that big gaps appear and do not get filled in, even long-term.

@reefedsail I’m really not, I agreed with you 😉

@ChrissieKeller61 I know, sorry, I named the wrong poster!

I don't use the actual knowledge content of my A-Levels day to day, or even my degree for that matter.

What I do use is my ability to be autodidactic, my capacity to adapt to new paradigms, pragmatism, emotional resilience... All of which the current set of pupils have an opportunity to rehearse.

Thing is, pretty much all kids will be in.the same position so presumably every thing will end up adjusted. They will spend fresher's week one day laughing about how shit their parents were at remoteschooling and comparing how much Xbox time they wrangled. Gcse content is different to 20 yeArs ago. We're we disadvantaged? Those kids who had school disrupted for years by war did ok. Not only that, but learning shouldn't just be 5 hours in a school. But that's a different argument.

And back to school in June won't magically put it right. Ds is going into yr 6. I fully envisage a final year without school plays, trips and probably another lockdown period. He'll cope. He won't know any different and I don't intend projecting my nostalgia onto him.

How do you meet safeguarding and security requirements if you use village halls? What is to stop someone walking in or a child walking out? Where are the adult and child loo blocks?

Longer days would not work for the children, why should a five year old do 'office hours'? Plus, as a teacher the children go home at 3.20 but we don't! There is lots of work to be done after school hours, when would that happen? Most teacher are on site for the equivalent of an office day.

The last thing I need is for schools to be open only two hours a day. DC school is an hour round trip on public transport - and double that (at least) if walking. We would spend longer on the commute than DC would spend learning or doing anything, and I would lose most of my core working hours. Alternate days might be a better option.

I like the idea of making the return to school optional. Different families are in very different situations, with some that would really want to send kids to school so a parent can work outside the home, to others who have a parent home anyway and would want to continue home schooling to shield another family member who is vulnerable. Some kids are climbing the walls, while others are enjoying their chilled out lockdown education. Schools should just ask how many parents need or really, really want to send their kids to school and how many are ok with keeping them home for the rest of the term. I think it would be 50/50 and the problem would solve itself.

Is there any scientific evidence that a couple of hours a day or alternate days will make any difference? Is it about number or children in the classroom? In which case can small rural primaries open full time? What about those with only a couple of families? What about those in deprived areas so smaller classes anyway (and more vulnerable kids who should be in school anyway)?

What about private schools? Can they just decide for themselves?

And how far do you take this "human right"

As a minimum, it needs to encompass human dignity.