Attitudes changing?

[CathyandHeathcliff]

Has anybody noticed attitudes changing over the past few days?

It seems to have gone from Facebook comments on articles calling for a stricter lockdown and so on, to calling for lockdown to be lifted sooner rather than later, comments about the economy failing and weighing up the balance.

@ACertainSupermarket
Dentists are self employed, so not on full pay. Desperate to get back to work! There will be several practices that don’t get through this financially.
The masks dentist wear are splatter and fluid resistant, but will not stop aerosolised particles. It’s such a high risk area and the risk of spreading the virus to other patients is also very high as for obvious reasons patients can’t wear masks! The shortage of PPE and specifically FFP3 masks has effectively put a stop to dental treatment.

My private Dentist is pissed about the closures as he feels they could safely carry out non aerosol generating procedures and he has had to close his whole business. He claims NHS dentists are getting some cash but he is private only. He also says he has adequate ppe for what he needs to do.

my sil was posting every day about closing schools and needing to close schools. I am Spanish so I knew schools closure wasn't enough and a lockdown would come sooner or later (Something she was denying)
Now she posts about schools opening asap ... think she thought this was an extra holiday and has realised that it was going to have consequences (what I kept telling her and she kept refusing to understand)

My attitude is definitely changing- primarily from the information that hospitals are not overwhelmed.

The original message was to flatten the curve so the NHS can cope. I may be incredibly naive, but it seems from the statistics that we are at the peak or have passed it of this current wave,and the NHS has coped. So surely it's now time to think about our go forward strategy- perhaps not right now as I can understand a cautious approach, but at least share some inkling of what it might be and what it is based on.

In our household we think we've had it - can't get tested of course, even my neighbour who was in hospital with classic covid-19 symptoms couldn't get tested - hospital staff said it wasn't worthwhile as so many false negatives. So whilst we dutifully obey the rules , I do start to wonder if it would be such a dreadful thing if I was to go for a walk as well as a run on one day ( live in countryside so very little contact with others) or meet my friend for a walk provided we stayed 2 ms apart and wore masks.

My getting fed up. I'm not a rule breaker though, so I will follow the government guidelines for as long as I'm asked to, and I'm lucky that I live in a lot of space and I am not finding the physical or mental load of lockdown too challenging.

But I have a six week old baby who my family haven't seen since 12 days old when the lockdown was imposed. I'm just desperate for my mum and a bit of support with the baby and also my toddler. My husband is a farmer and is working very long hours at the moment - I hadn't ever anticipated parenting like this in the early days because my mum is such a constant in my life.

I think the thing drawing on my mood is that we haven't been told a plan and so this all seems to go on indefinitely. I imagine for people who are really battling with this, the uncertainly will overcome some of them.

You still see people shouting for a stronger lock down

Mental Health / financial worries / parenting struggles have all been stifled for too long as the voices call for a stronger lock down have been the loudest. Those naming and shamimg their neighbours for going for a walk. Those constantly stressing that traffic is getting busier etc etc.

I am not even saying I want lockdown lifted - we still have some time in lockdown but I am happy for that.

But people need to be able to have a voice again. We need to be able to say we hope schools reopen soon and not be accused of wanting all teachers to die. We need to be able to say we are struggling under lock down conditions and that we are worried mental health. We need to be able to say we are worried about our kids. We need to be able to say we are worried about the economy.

I hope the tide is turning. We need other voices to be heard too and do h
What is right for the whole country, whilst saving as many lives as possible.

People who want lockdown to end are not selfish; they are just realistic. There is no cure for Covid and no vaccine. The govt 5 criteria are about making sure that the nhs can cope. Then people have to get on with it. Everyone is going to get it just like everyone gets a cold at some stage. To say otherwise is a nonsense ..... there may never be a vaccine.
People in this country aren’t used thinking like this ....for some reason it seems to have missed them that every winter they have a chance of catching flu and that there is a chance that they may die from it .... corona is not flu but it’s the same principle. You probably will catch it; you might die from it. In other countries that risk assessment is more part of day to day life but in Western Europe we aren’t used to that so we are struggling with the concept. I grew up somewhere where there were several diseases that you could catch just getting in with daily life that could kill you but you put on your mosquito repellant; wore closed shoes; didn’t drink anything that wasn’t from a bottle etc but you got on with life. We will have to change our mind set to do the same. This isn’t going anywhere.

Whilst I don't think we are ready to end lockdown it really isn't helping the public's perception of the NHS not being able to cope with some hospitals posting videos of doctors & nurses doing choreographed dances whilst at work in uniform.

But people need to be able to have a voice again. We need to be able to say we hope schools reopen soon and not be accused of wanting all teachers to die. We need to be able to say we are struggling under lock down conditions and that we are worried mental health. We need to be able to say we are worried about our kids. We need to be able to say we are worried about the economy.
@Hadenoughfornow

I agree. To be brutally honest, we make a calculated decision based on our own perceived risk. There is far far greater risk to my family if we sink into a recession than there is from Coronavirus. I know that doesn't apply to everyone, but it does to us. We are compliant people, so we are still following the rules to the letter, but of course there will be others who have made the same assessment and have decided now to relax the rules for themselves. I don't want to get it, (same as i don't really want any nasty virus that makes me feel awful) and I don't want my kids to get it, but it's unlikely that we won't, seeing as the government both wants and needs people like us to get it: young children and fit, healthy adults. My Dh is very worried about the implications of a recession and as a person who has genuinely not been ill in 10 years I've known him, I can understand why people like him are hugely frustrated. He still wouldn't flout the rules though, but I can understand why others would.

I live in quite a well to do area and yesterday saw people sunbathing on the beach, the lawns, my neighbour had her son and grandchildren visiting. My other neighbour who is a public figure and has been quite outspoken in the press about staying home has been going out a lot the past week in his car with his family. There are people and cars moving freely whereas last month it was deathly quiet. I can’t see people complying indefinitely.

I think people are also seeing the news in Sweden of how they are managing without lockdown and their deaths are falling so why would they need to isolate here if they aren’t needing to there?

The lack of information from the government about next steps is bizarre and as far as I know the only country where this is happening.
We need to look at risk(real risk) I'm in my kid 40s my kids are 16 and 18 the risk to us is minimal and we're ok taking it.
My kids have been great,but have had enough they are young adults whose lives are on hold.
My mum who is in her early 70s has said she'd prefer to take her chances,her mental health is really suffering,I'm worried for her. For her this isn't worth it,I need to weigh up the risk and go and see her soon.

I’m 36 weeks pregnant and starting to struggle mentally too

I had been counting on spending these last few weeks with help from my parents with toddler to help me get some muvh needed rest

I’m also anemic so struggling more than normally would when pregnant.

At this rate with no sign of it ending I’m starting to be tempted to just say fuck it now

Depends entirely on personal circumstances, surely?
Youngish, fit, healthy, no vulnerable loved ones, of course most will want restrictions lifted. Older, or with vulnerabilities or fragile loved ones, probably a very different perspective.
Not sure those positions will have dramatically shifted since the beginning.

I'm finding opinions are divided. There are some people who still want a stricter lockdown and are still having hissy fits over joggers killing everyone.

The sensible rational people are getting fed up of the government treating us like idiots.

Toffee, go on the daily mail comments page today. Lots of people want this to be over sooner rather than later and have done for a while.
I can understand the restlessness and how employers expect people with little babies or children to wfh and do a long 8 hour day amazes me but I've no doubt they do and don't get how hard it is to parent and work! Not to mention expecting them to home school as well.
Also the ones that can't go to work and have no income at all coming in.

I'm not in favour of lockdown ending too soon but I totally get why people do and why attitudes are changing. If MPs stopped getting paid for a month then maybe people might have a bit more time for them!

Even my very law abiding neighbours had visitors yesterday! ( she would report us if we had done this at the start I bet!)
They were in the garden.
Yet I can't see my dad as his in a home! : (

Sweden and the fact that infections in the UK peaked before lockdown - social distancing & hygiene was enough to stop exponential growth & prevent the health service being overwhelmed. And that was the aim before people started to get the idea that lockdown would stop the virus & save every life.

We’re so screwed now - we have non existent immunity because people complied so well, we can’t keep this going for much longer & we’re kicking the peak over the autumn/winter which will be a disaster. That’s what I was saying a month ago and nothing has changed.

There are still enough people who think hiding at home waiting for a vaccine is a solution - even in the face of a cancer ‘epidemic’ as the tip of a massive public health crisis - that the government are paralysed by public opinion. Following the science? What a load of bollocks!

Chillipeanuts my attitude has changes over the past week or so. At the beginning I was very supportive of a full lockdown - after all who would want a situation like Italy with dead bodies galore and health service unable to cope - but I have changed as the numbers have come out.

NHS is not overwhelmed- and this is not based on anyone dressing up and dancing which is irrelevant- and we appear to be reasonably in control. People have died because it is a virus with no vaccine - but we do not appear to be overwhelmed by it currently. Also stats suggest that much of the drop was caused by the introduction of the hand washing and social distancing guidelines that everyone poo pooed at the time, rather than the more draconian measures.

This may be a bit controversial but whilst I'm glad the government has supported those who have lost income, they seem to be almost flinging money around for some people and I'm very conscious that our future tax will be paying for this, so I don't want it to go on forever.

In hindsight- which is of course a marvellous thing in this situation- if the government had stopped mass events like Cheltenham, Crufts and football matches a bit earlier and restricted incoming flights from affected areas - we're in Edinburgh and still remember the absolute hoards of French people over for the rugby when they had high infection rates in their country - I think we could have avoided some of the more draconian economy stopping measures. And whilst I'm happy to support a wait and see strategy until start of May when next lockdown is reviewed, government needs to come up with at least some steps in an exit plan to be executed at that point if numbers continue to drop.

Once the stories appeared of millionaires getting money for their businesses and the thread on here of empty hospitals I thought then that attitudes will swing towards ending lockdown. Once schools go back then we will know that the restrictions really can't carry on as they are now. I heard that Nicola Sturgeon is laying out Scotland's timetable today so I guess we might know more today.

Certainly changing here. We have gone from being optimistic to total despair. People are barging us out of the way in shops, just as before, walking at you in the streets, letting kids run about all over the place as if nothing has happened.

Because no-one seems to be able to make a decision regarding lockdown or actually help in a useful way with the 'help for businesses' it looks as if the chance to hold on to a business will soon be gone and we will be left with nothing.

The rules have not been clear from the start. There has been too much waffling, disorganisation. No-one has a clue what is going on, and if something doesn't change I can see huge unrest building.

Promised help with business rates, great but only if you work from a shop, offices don't qualify.

Promised help with a grant, yes you qualify, oh no, we got it wrong, no you don't.

You can't run your business because you can't have more than 5 people in a room.

You can't sell your house because no-one can view it, just wait for it to be taken away instead because a mortgage holiday will only delay the inevitable and increase the payments due at the end of it, so you can't pay it anyway because you can't get a grant and have to pay the rates and you still can't work.

I am making plans, I am going to try to sell all my belongings that I am able to post because no-one can collect, then I am going to go off quietly and sleep until I die because everything I have worked for my entire life will be gone and I am too old to start again.

Yes there is unrest because the entire situation has been a complete and utter cock up. It has left me with no hope of a life that is worth living because it is going to be too late for me 'if' the government ever get off their backsides and do something to help.

When people have worked their entire lives to have a roof over their heads and an income, not a lavish lifestyle and to ask no-one for anything and in just a few weeks the entire thing has been taken away there is going to be bitterness, and despair, annoyance, rebellion - how long can we be expected to continue without having a clue what is going on? Either bloody lock us up completely or let us go back to work, stop fannying about and destroying futures and well as lives. Keep the vulnerable safe, let people keep their homes and jobs.

I see no way out of this for myself, maybe my partner will get through it if I am gone, he can wait it out and start again. I can't.

I suspect the suicide rate will exceed the Christmas figures due to this, not the virus itself, but the way it has been handled.

I'm sick of our government pooh-pooing masks for the public, simply because they haven't even organised enough for the NHS. Its evident many of the public have made their own mind up about thus, having looked to countries with lower death rates.
Yes I don't understand why they don't say it is a good idea to use masks but only homemade, police could stop people wearing medical grade masks rather than worrying about Easter eggs.

am getting tired of whinging teachers, with their 2 children per class, working 1 week in 4. And don't start with 'they're busy setting work' because most of it is the homework they'd be sending out anyway and that's not even being marked.

It varies you know, I have 3 GC at different schools and I think it goes from schools doing a brilliant job, and teachers at those schools have told me they are working more hours than normally, to schools where there is no contact, no marking, just a few work sheets. Lets not blame the good with the bad.

I am getting irritated that dentists, who could quite safely continue wearing face shields, gloves and masks, are doing nothing, presumably on full pay. The problem for many dentists is they can't get enough PPE because there is a shortage and some have donated stuff to keep GPs/hospitals going. I think they must have thought it would soon get replaced but that hasn't happened. Some dentists are working in hospitals helping on wards.

I don't think sweeping judgements are much use as there will be many variations.

I live in Devon, our Chief Constable doesn't agree with the new police guidelines and is quite vocal about it. So down here we are getting much tougher policing than many other places. His argument is if local people can do a short drive to do a country/beach walk people could come from outside the area. I would have thought it was simple for a police officer to ask people how far they have travelled, they can easily check registration numbers. I'm not sure all his officers agree with him, I've been on beach walks with police hanging around but haven't seen anyone being asked why they are out.

If your ok for money etc etc then of course you will be in favour of lockdown for a few more months. If your waiting for the government to pay you and have nothing with mounting bills then you won't be in favour. It's not rocket science, even with the best will in the world to stop the spread of this virus. Some would rather take their chances.
We need clarity.