Worried About Coronavirus- thread 38

[TheStarryNight]

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@RedToothBrush Great summing up. I always look for your summary of things to save time when I am catching up. You're a star!

Ian DS is advising caution on the story. Passing the book blaming the Who.

It got into a bit of a shouty rant. 🙈

I was listening to Prof Sarah Gilbert from Oxford University this morning talking about the vaccine trials they are starting. I was half listening so may have misunderstood but I was surprised at how the trials are bring done. They are giving half the young healthy people the new vaccine and the other half again young and healthy a meningitis vaccine. Then sending them away to contract the virus via community transmission over the Summer. Scary thought as they are so confident that they will see results meaning they expect the virus to again be circulating freely. I don't know why bus I assumed the trials would be controlled in a laboratory. I don't know what to think and this is the vaccine that the press are headling could be ready by September? It does go on to say that trials would move to older age groups etc.

Well as I'm a sad person I've just spent some time calculating the rate of infection. In different areas of the UK (basically dividing the Guardian's reported no of cases by the population).
Out of the top ten with the highest rate of infection, only Sunderland and Cumbria are outside Greater London, Richmond upon Thames and the City of London have the lowest rates for Greater London.
And the bottom three includes Knowsley which seemed to me odd company with Rutland and the Isle of Wight.

mrshoho so if it doesn't work those young people will potentially die?!

Hopefully one of our more science experienced mumsnetters may understand it and I could have it completely wrong. But it seems they will monitor them for symptoms and test them regularly. What really concerns me is that they expect the virus to be in full swing in the community over the Summer so everyone is at risk. Will they all be based in one high risk area or spread out? so much for long term social distancing??

www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30796-0/fulltext

This is the article but I was watching on BBC this morning.

www.rte.ie/news/world/2020/0418/1132381-covid-montreal-care-home/
Awful news another care home abandoned in Montreal, similar reported in Spain. I fear it will happen here and the UK. It is unfair to expect care staff to deal with all the deaths.

Yes-as in my care home, staff are basically being left to deliver palliative care. It's complicated and distressing and should be way above their pay grade. Between that and the high sickness and short staffing, the fear of getting sick and the lack of PPE it's not surprising that care homes are in perilous positions. I'm lucky in that my team are, frankly, amazing. But in lots of care homes, especially those with high staff turn over and lots of staff vacancies that's not the case-lots of staff will decide they don't need the £8.73 an hour and added stress more than they need to stay well and be with their families if it goes on much longer I fear.

That Sunday times article hasn't surprised me a jot unfortunately. It's a shambles and I'm sick of being told that's its unhelpful to criticise the response at the moment. Fuck off is it. People are dying needlessly. And I think more will if the government aren't held to stricter account.
The bit about us sending PPE to China in February... Jesus Christ.Did they assume we were somehow immune?? It's arrogance and a willingness to sacrifice people they don't see as important-that can be all it is surely?

Mm not too sure about the under 10 as 234? Isnt that big a sample size. Were the kids on half therm there ?
Ny had an under 9 die out of 5489 deaths.
And i saw a thing about kids being hospitalised. (could have been older kids though).So yes would like to see hospitalization records for all these countries re covid by age group.
Im sure babies have died here to and a 5yo?

Also i disagree about the conclusions re asthma.
How many are being hospitalised with asthma.
Just because there are more people dying od xyz doesnt reduce the risk it may just mean there are also a lot of unhealthy people and older ones.
So for eg maybe Germany might see more asthma involvement as they stsrted with younger heslthier people getting ill. Or in other populations that havent had many deaths. So of the younger people under say 50 what was wrong with them.
Possibly asthma treatment helps in some way - seriods reduce immune systerm.
I guess im saying you need to compare to healthy adults not unhealthy ones. Not take the deaths and divide them into what was wrong with them.

Also looking at deaths by age sometimes that is broken down out of total deaths. Which doesnt seem right. A 20yo chance of death should be versus its own age group chance of dying.
So death, hospitalization, ill at home, asymptomatic.

@MurrayTheMonk I've been following your story on the thread, the residents in your care are very lucky to have you.

Thankyou Emerald. Though maybe not today. I've hit a bit of a wall I think and I'm dreading going in today. Not feeling too positive for the last few days-probably just tired. Need to work on my game face for staff whilst I drive in I think.

Have got a big and tricky bit of work to do adding up all the extra costs for staff and PPE and everything else that Covid has cost us so far, and my brain feels like mush so I don't like my chances, whilst also having to be on actual shift as it were.
If and when we ever go back to normal it will feel really weird to go back to my usual 9-5 mon-fri and predominantly desk based job in service that's for sure-I'm only needed to do the odd bit of care here and there usually.
(Will probably still do most of the cooking for the clients though as I've secretly been enjoying that-and I've been teaching the staff lots of new recipes as well so it's been quite fun).

new york from daily mail

Roughly 1.7 per cent of the coronavirus cases reported as of April 2 were patients under the age of 18. Some 147 children have been hospitalized, including 59 that are under the age of 1. Three children have died from the virus.

But Dr Hes believes that the real numbers of children with the disease are much worse, blaming the lack of testing for why more accurate figures aren't available.

'I don't mean to be rude, but the numbers are totally wrong,' Hes said. 'I think that probably 80% of the children have coronavirus. We are not testing children. I'm in New York City. I can't get my patients tested. And we have to assume, if they are sick, they have coronavirus.

'Most of them, probably 80 to 90% of them, are asymptomatic. So, these numbers are so skewed. I think that the mortality rate is way, way less than 0.5% for children who have it because it is so prevalent. You have to remember thousands of kids die from flu a year. This is much, much less virulent in children.'

The pediatrician said families should just assume their child probably has the coronavirus if they start showing symptoms. '

Though its true he doesnt know the kids have it as no testing for them...
But basically went on to say the kids are spreading it.

@MurrayTheMonk Good luck today, it must be very difficult.

I know nothing about this makes sense

But if the Daily Mail article has any truth in it, the oddest thing woukd be GCSE and A level students going back? Isn’t the system for their grades already set - why would they want to go back? I mean, fine if they do. But at that age I’d be thinking I’ll stay home.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8233761/Traffic-light-lockdown-schools-weeks.html

But if the Daily Mail article has any truth in it, the oddest thing woukd be GCSE and A level students going back? Isn’t the system for their grades already set - why would they want to go back? I mean, fine if they do. But at that age I’d be thinking I’ll stay home.

I thought it meant y10 and y12.

Gavin Williamson is supposed to be doing the briefing.

Riga I just thought it meant all of them.....perhaps I’m just being thick.

Riga I just thought it meant all of them.....perhaps I’m just being thick.

Who knows? That does seem pointless. But y10 are GCSE students.

The only hope we have is to use that times article to avoid repeating the same mistake. We're in a position now where the government can either learn from its negligence mistakes in January or repeat them. Premature ending of the lockdown means we'd end up with a similar article sometime in June or July about the negligence poor decisions taken in April/May. I do hope the government bears in mind who is being most affected by Covid. It's disproportionately affecting our BAME communities (as well as men and the elderly). Ending lockdown too soon could be construed as lack of concern for certain sections of the population.

I was always shocked by our shielding list. Back in January/early February the worldometer site figures clearly showed the highest mortality rates were conditions including diabetes, cardiovascular, and hypertension. Definitely indicating Covid is a vascular as well as (or possibly more than) respiratory illness.

The care home situation is dreadful, shameful. I'm so grateful for people like you Murray You should never be put in such an awful position without the support you all need and deserve. Spain has started a criminal investigation into its care home situation. We should do the same. It really is criminal.

https://t.co/I78j3LNOYl?amp=1
This is hopefully a link to a pretty thorough article showing all the way s this virus attacks..

Have caught up with the UK side of figures for the chart, today. Total UK deaths are at 16.060 (but again, just the hospital ones, I presume, otherwise there would be quite a jump in numbers and we haven't seen that.)

As for the vaccine, I still can't see it being ready by September. I listened to that Oxford researcher and they have a series of trials to get though, not just one, so the end of Autumn seems more likely and only if everything goes well!

IDS has probably been suffering from IBS from the thought of so many workers at home.

Hes blaming WHO. Now many people are starting to realize what disabled people have been saying for years.

They are giving half the young healthy people the new vaccine and the other half again young and healthy a meningitis vaccine. Then sending them away to contract the virus via community transmission over the Summer.
This is a very slow method of testing. It also seems a bit hit and miss.
I guess the young healthy people are students who will be away for the summer and then return to Uni in the autumn.