How long can we carry on like this for?

[Pseudosudocrem]

Anyone else starting to wonder just how long we can carry on like this before everything irrevocably falls apart?

How will we ever recover as a country?

Cafes and restaurants will reopen

How do you know that? How can they survive months of closure? There are to ms of beer going off as we speak, just one example. Who will pay for that?

Some current ones will close, new ones will open. Because people working will still want to go out and eat.

Well good for them, that's okay then isn't it? Except DH works for a small company which has problems with staffing levels due to shielding/isolation. And being a small company, they tend to use small builder's merchants, which are also having problems with staffing levels, supply chain and cashflow. So now what does my DH do? And if you're going to say 'Get another job', he's 61 with physical and mental health issues AND we have the mother of all recessions approaching at speed.

This thread took of into orbit at least an hour ago and has clearly now landed on another planet I'm going to bed.

There will be some new jobs. For example more people will be employed in online businesses.

What sort of businesses? Doing what? Can’t be selling, because that needs production, can’t be services, because who will pay for something that’s not necessary?

Because people working will still want to go out and eat

Upthread you said people wouldn't because they'd be too scared. Make your mind up.

@BamboozledandBefuddled That is tough. It gets harder as you get older to get a job. I hope he is okay.

They'll be paying us my DH's full wage will they? Could they start immediately? I'm very grateful for the furlough scheme no but the furlough scheme that is keeping so many afloat will be paid for by people working, as will other benefits. It might not be the amounts you are used to, but hopefully it will keep a big enough proportion ok so recovery is possible.

I think the reason they only treat you in hospital once you are blue lipped and desperate is that at that point hospital admission is unavoidable. Those that get desperately ill but not to that point survive at home but don’t use any hospital resources, eg medical staff, ppe, drugs/oxygen. Leaving them for the more desperate. We KNOW these things are in short supply.

@BamboozledandBefuddled I am talking about when it is safe to do so.

No @alloutoffucks he isn't okay. But as you accused me yesterday of 'sacrificing' him because 'I want to socialize', when I said he wanted to get on with his life in spite of being high risk, you'll have to forgive me if I'm not particularly appreciative of your sympathy now.

I just think some people don’t like working and some people don’t need to work, but they think everybody else is just like them.

"If catching the disease won't give you immunity, how would a vaccine even work?"

That's explained here:
mobile.twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1251816551709278209

Ultimately, I think we are the biggest threat to our own survival as we'll start fighting each other when we realise we can't beat coronavirus. The war rhetoric will become self fulfilling. It'll keep going wave after wave and if reinfection really is happening and we lose the race to a vaccine, it's all over for most of us.

Ultimately, I think we are the biggest threat to our own survival as we'll start fighting each other when we realise we can't beat coronavirus. The war rhetoric will become self fulfilling. It'll keep going wave after wave and if reinfection really is happening and we lose the race to a vaccine, it's all over for most of us.

I don't think so. I think if it became endemic, we'd get used to it just like we get used to loads of other shit. It's only very recently in history we've been able to be relatively disease-free in the West; even last century infection diseases with serious risk of death were just a part of life. We'd just get on with it like people before us did.

But that's doom and gloom, we have tens of thousands of drugs already, of which some must help against the disease even if not to prevent it.

Bamboozled “ No @alloutoffucks he isn't okay. But as you accused me yesterday of 'sacrificing' him because 'I want to socialize', when I said he wanted to get on with his life in spite of being high risk, you'll have to forgive me if I'm not particularly appreciative of your sympathy now.”

Quite right too.

Haplap “ The war rhetoric will become self fulfilling”

Yes, the war rhetoric is dangerous.

@buttermilkwaffles thanks, that's quite interesting. Apparently BCG is another vaccine that produces a strong immune response that's hypothesised to help with CV.

No one is going to starve. After the second world war the country was nearly bankrupt, we did not starve.

The country wasnt exactly enjoying fine dining either, was it? Rationing was in place for years after the war.

Some of us are still earning and ‘okay’ during this but still want the economy back up and running because we care about other people having enough money to eat and pay the bills, not just because we miss eating out and going on holiday.

What do you mean by the “war rhetoric”?

I want to be able to go out and on holiday as well you know? I am not one of those on the thread saying I love lock down.
DP is busy at work at the moment, but the chances are he will have less hours after this. I work for a company that was struggling but seemed to be on the up, I have no idea how this will affect its long term survival.
Terrible illnesses have ravaged the population before. We have fought back. First we get better treatments, then if relevant vaccines and then we lessen the number of people who get infected. At one time lots of British people died of TB. Now a tiny number of people in the UK die of TB. The idea that lots of us are going to be killed every year by this virus for ever more is not borne out by history.
And history shows that getting infectious illnesses under control is important not just to protect lives, but also to protect the economy.

I don't think the lock down will lift after 3 weeks but by the end of May provided deaths and new cases are much lower and in decline I think garden centres and DIY stores may open. I think the government are going to open up lock down in stages. I don't think schools will open before parliament goes back. I don't think schools will return until September. Williamson said today there is no plan to make kids go back to school in summer holidays. I honestly think anyone who is lucky enough to have a job after this pandemic will pay more tax and possibly more NIC. I would not be surprised if many, many people who are now furloughed lose their job after end of June.

So a country where a lot of people are too afraid to go out to concerts, shows, restaurants, cafes and pubs is not going to have a thriving economy. People need to feel safe to go out, and to achieve there has to be a low risk that they will catch something that could either make them pretty ill or kill them.
Food poisoning that is publicised happening at a restaurant kills that business. Nobody has to die, just people being ill. The same if people think by going out for a meal they could spend a week in bed ill afterwards. And a lot lot more people get ill enough to be in bed feeling shit with covid 19 than die.

All “ Terrible illnesses have ravaged the population before. ”

Exactly! AFAIK, we’ve never quarantined the majority of the population as a result of an illness. It’s not a rational response to a new illness.

@caringcarer It depends. Some of those furloughed by million dollar companies will have jobs to go back to, although maybe not all. Some of those companies could weather the downturn, but are choosing the best option for them financially. I am furloughed and will have a job to go back to. Without furlough we would still have been employed but had our hours very reduced. Some on furlough will lose their jobs. I certainly would not volunteer to be furloughed like some people have.

Ok Woodchuck I'll give you high education as something that can go on completely in lockdown without people having to actually be out doing stuff. Lecturing can go on to a point but how does that work for the actual exams? But then if lockdown goes on too long they'd be no jobs for graduates, no point in paying the fees for uni.

You missed my point about insurance needing people doing stuff to generate work. 1000s of people have cars on finance options type deals, if people are in lockdown and the car is up for renewal are they going to be taking out a new car or hand the existing car back and walking away. I know we won't be replacing our lease car while still in lockdown, so saving on the payments, road tax, and insurance.

BTW many construction sites have closed because of the lack of social distancing. And as others have pointed out the supply chain is drying up.