How long can we carry on like this for?

[Pseudosudocrem]

Anyone else starting to wonder just how long we can carry on like this before everything irrevocably falls apart?

How will we ever recover as a country?

It shouldnt end now and maybe not even in 3 weeks but by June we are going to have to start (China did).
China r is still now just at the very beginning of reopening - lots of kids are only going back to school from this Monday - with facemasks. Our timeline is a full two months behind China - their peak was mid Feb.

Also, people are only able to infect others if the "others" are also walking around freely. If people don't want to be infected, they can choose to stay at home.

How can you guarantee their safety when they obviously need to come into contact with delivery drivers, tradesmen, family, friends, etc. Or do you want to lock them in a cell and put food though a door flap?

@user1497207191, I don't necessarily agree with that argument precisely because no-one chooses cancer or old age; it was just a counter argument to "people can do whatever they want to themselves, but not to others". It was just an example that what you do to yourself/others is not that simple, because everything affects other, and discussions of "rights" are quite nuanced.

For example we could buy no clothes/consumer goods because of lockdown and save lots of lives here by not spreading it in shops; but then factory workers on the other side of the world might starve.

That people on here think they know better than the world health organisation is laughable. We need to tackle this together across the world. It is a pandemic! Those who talk about a lower risk for younger people are missing the point that it still is killing people who are younger with no known pre conditions. If it is you or your loved ones who are affected then it is worth staying in lockdown for as long as it takes. Perhaps you think older people should just be let die? Look at all the people who have already died and the great talent that has been lost to the world

Everyone was begging for lockdown now where in one everyone wants it over??

This yes!

The lockdown is over where I live (urban metropolitan county, north of England), or might as well be. No one social distancing, not that they ever tried anyway. Loads of people in shops, parks, streets full, more cars on the road than there was even before the lockdown . People visiting each others houses all the time. People having parties and some people even going to the pub (I wish I was joking). If it wasn't for the shutters on some of the shops, you wouldn't even know there was anything wrong at all

Anne Frank was in hiding in far worse conditions for two years.
Terry Waite was held for four years in solitary confinement.

We’re struggling to do a few weeks in relative comfort and freedom. Have we really become so egocentric or hedonistic?

Over 850 people died in hospital today. We’re on a worse trajectory than Italy. Much harder to watch those we love dying unnecessarily than watching too much television or missing a latte with friends.

@lightsoul

Do you not see that lockdown also kills people?

Abused women
People with mental health issues
People who don't seek treatment for non covid conditions
Economic poverty shortens lives

A vaccine could take 12 months from now. We cannot stay in lockdown until then.

@woodchuck99 are they though at a significant risk? That is the thing we know how many people have very sadly died from this. We know how many people have tested positive, we dont know how many people have had it to come up with such a figure.

I think 8% have been under 60 years and the risk is higher between 60 and 65 so yes significant number in that age group will die and even more will be seriously ill with it. A couple of my work colleagues in their 50s have been hospitalised. Our own Prime Minister nearly died.

Cherry they are single individuals, not a whole population.

The economic effects of coronavirus will be felt for years. Many businesses will fail, won't take on new staff, won't be paying tax and suddenly we have no money for the NHS.

850 people is a very small percentage of the whole population. If you know any of those people it's very sad, as it is any time anyone dies. But we cannot live like this for much longer without lockdown having serious ramifications.

We may have to. Not always as strict as it is now but certainly social distancing.

Our own Prime Minister nearly died.

No he didn't.

He went into ICU (probably before reaching the level of illness that most people get to before needing ICU).

He wasn't ventilated.

I don't think the amount of money that has been put into lockdown has been spent to turn around and undo it in a few weeks. We are paying this back for the rest of our lives irrespective.

850 people is a very small percentage of the whole population.

Do you understand the concept of exponential growth?

Also, @Flaxmeadow, gosh...am really shocked by what you say. Where i live everything is so different. The roads are quiet, I have not personally observed anyone (other than cylcists and runners coming too close to people) doing anything outside the 'rules'. It's like being in a different place, hardly recognise some parts of it. Why do you think your area is so bad?

850 people is a very small percentage of the whole population.

That's just 1 day. Multiply it by 365 and you have 310k in a year. But, unchecked, there'll be almost exponential growth. So a year without serious social distancing etc. and without a vaccine, and it could easily be several million dead.

Those who talk about a lower risk for younger people are missing the point that it still is killing people who are younger with no known pre conditions. If it is you or your loved ones who are affected then it is worth staying in lockdown for as long as it takes.

This "as long as it takes" attitude is ridiculous - and we don't have it to any other risky things. The risk to young, healthy people is tiny. There is probably a comparable risk of dying in an RTA, dying of a sports injury, or from cancer/heart attack from smoking, drinking, drugs or eating red meat. Yet people are fine to do all those things. We don't take this "no risk at all" approach to any other part of our lives, so why should we now be prepared to lock down for an infinite amount of months for something that actually has quite a small risk of death. Look at the stats from countries that have been testing properly, like Germany, Denmark and Iceland.

Someone said this a few ago on MN - why are lives so cheap abroad, where most people won't even give £5 to buy some mosquito nets that will save hundreds from malaria, but prepared to completely trash the economy and possibly kids' future to save one person?

Of course I recognise those things, Hercwasonaroll. But we are not in a position to go it alone. Abused women can leave and support is available for them and those with mental health issues. Gps are still available to treat people with other conditions. Lockdown or not people will avoid hospitals. We have to follow WHO recommendations. We have a global responsibility and a responsibility to look out for each other until this time comes to an end.

Also my DM lives in a completely different part of the country to me and she has said that the roads and town centre are almost deserted, only the odd person passing, often in a mask.

... it's 4.6% of the people who die that are under 50. Not 4.6% of all people under 50

I hope you don't mind me bolding this, but it seemed worth doing
Worth pointing out, too, that current death rate is just 1 in 4385 overall, the vast majority being far in excess of 50 and with siginificant additional health issues

We all recognise that each and every death is a huge sadness for those involved, but quite frankly most are probably at more risk crossing the road to the shop (if only it was open)

He went into ICU (probably before reaching the level of illness that most people get to before needing ICU).

I would count being in ICU as "nearly died". He certainly might not have lived without medical intervention.

That's just 1 day. Multiply it by 365 and you have 310k in a year. But, unchecked, there'll be almost exponential growth. So a year without serious social distancing etc. and without a vaccine, and it could easily be several million dead.

That's faulty stats - we are in the peak, so it won't be peak forever. We also have no idea if this is the biggest/only peak, or what the true death rate is. Countries that have been testing extensively have found a high proportion of asymptomatic cases and a death rate closer to 0.4%, so it would never be millions.

We all recognise that each and every death is a huge sadness for those involved, but quite frankly most are probably at more risk crossing the road to the shop (if only it was open)

I'm pretty sure that 15,000 people did not die crossing the road last month.

That's faulty stats - we are in the peak, so it won't be peak forever.

We are at the peak because of the lockdown. If the lockdown stops now the peak will be higher.

Of course we should be testing. It is disgraceful that we are not testing

There are people not getting treatment for a variety of things. Most surgery has been cancelled, most scans etc the same. This cannot carry on because these people will die in 12 months. We're talking about care above GP level.

The WHO aren't always right. They said that it couldn't be transmitted human to human at the start of the year.

You are incredibly naive to think there is support for abused women. It's difficult enough for women to leave when not being isolated. 15 women and children were murdered in the first 3 weeks of lockdown. The equivalent figure last year was 5.

He did nearly die @Hercwasonaroll

I know from a friend of his.