Population of Germany 83.02 million, coronavirus deaths 4,098

[ChicChicChicChiclana]

Population of UK 66.65 million, coronavirus deaths 13,729

To me this is the most amazing statistic of the pandemic so far.

If our Government have questions to answer, surely this is the big one!?

'I thought our politicians were following "World leading" scientific advice and evidence? if so, why should it matter what background a politician has? '

Being a scientist helps you interpret 'scientific advice'.

Understanding was the problem our politicians had.

(That and a tendency to pick the scientific advice that fitted in with political requirements of the time.)

Boris was treated in the German way. (Whisked into hospital at around 8 days when it appeared that he still had symptoms and therefore might worsen. He didn't have to wait to go blue first. If treated in the British way... he probably would not have made it.)

Boris had oxygen at an early stage so I think this may be key

So they know what works but have decided not to offer this to anyone else... and he was treated by the NHS not the Nuffield.

Sadly, this is the time the true competence/incompetence of a government really comes to light.

And 68% of the population think oud gvmt is handling things well!

I suppose they must have got so used to people dying unnecessarily that they believe it's just the way things are.

I take this to show germans follow rules.

So many posts on here and I’ve seen it in real life about friends and family visiting each other, people shopping in groups and pretending they don’t know each other.

Just my opinion, I may be incorrect.

The key question is what is different between Germany and every other major European country (including UK).

I've not seen any answer to that. Any arguments about UK vs Germany politics, demographics, health care systems, lockdown speed/extent, PPE provision, health procedures etc doesn't answer that.

I'm just not seeing good enough reporting on other European countries which enable me to answer to that question.

But there must be one

We don't need higher taxes to fund the NHS, we need people to take responsibility for their health, everyone to pay nominal insurance like in Germany and the NHS to be restructured so it isn't run by the idiots who run it now who haemorrhage money like a leaky watering can.

Non essential procedures need to be covered by insurance and it needs to be a service that runs 7 days a week too.

England is more densely populated than Germany.

Not a government apologist by any means, but worth bearing in mind

Early intervention is probably a factor. People are being treated and given oxygen as soon as they experience breathing difficulties. We're telling people not to ring 111 until they're turning blue and can barely speak.

I suspect it's many things but I do really wonder if this is playing a role.

Look at the difference between Ireland and England. Our Irish reaction was very different to the British one and we have way fewer cases. Interesting article on the difference here
www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/13/experts-divided-comparison-uk-ireland-coronavirus-record

Early intervention yes, most Doctors involved will confirm this, absolutely & LuckyMarmiteLover, I believe he did.

I saw a news report where Germany was receiving covid patients from Spain. This and their attitude to refugees makes me take off my hat to them. Thier leader does seem to get it right. True they do follow rules and it is less densely populated. Also they are natural preppers so no need for germ spreading toilet roll buying scrums.

Yep 4 points all covered.
•Lots of testing and tracing.
• Early medical intervention
• Mass gatherings discouraged and events cancelled before the UK had even acknowledged a pandemic was on the way.
• A superior more capable medical system due to higher funding.

@BamboozledandBefuddled has it.

We had friends and family members returning from Asia in February and symptomatic and refused testing as they couldn’t possibly have it. Then told it was fine for their partners to keep going to work in schools when they self isolated and partners only needed to stay at home when they got sick. We knew the spread then and this wa sheaf was being told

I also read a study that receiving a BCG vaccine was a significant predictor of the disease being mild. I think Germany still has a universal BCG vaccination programme, similarly many Eastern European countries do, but it is rare in Western Europe - I had to go private in London.

I’ve just looked at the stats for Canada (where I live). We have a population of 37 million (so just under half of Germany’s population) and 1195 deaths. So we’re doing well too. I’m guessing that early intervention plus the distance between cities means we’re able to contain outbreaks to particular regions better. Plus we love our rules (in general, any rules at all).

I’m pleased to see we’re doing so well, it’s reassuring to know our medical system is this robust.

Germany is recording deaths differently to us,if a person with an underlying health condition has Coronavirus and dies,the underlying health condition is given as the reason for death!! Opposite to us.

Know someone who is a hospital doctor in Germany,they are struggling the same way every other Country is.She is worried that it will get to the point there where she has to choose who to treat.

Sorry folks but nothing special about Germany whatsoever.

Germany has a much larger manufacturing industry than we do and so had the capability of producing a large amount of tests early on.

I think the German approach to this needs to be talked about more in the press etc. I know that the figures are reported but there does not seem to be a lot of questions etc about why their curve is different etc.

Unfortunately, I know quite a few people (and see posts from others) who seem to have seen that Germany is now relaxing it's lockdown measures and are saying we should follow suit. They don't seem to have understood that they took measures earlier than we did, seem to be better at preventing deaths than we are, and have more testing in place. The message they seem to have picked up is 'I want to go out and meet friends etc. Germany clearly think it's OK to relax the rules- and they must be right as they have fewer deaths than other countries- so we should open up our schools, shopping centres, pubs, parks etc and it will all be fine'.

I agree with TheLastSaola -- Germany is the exception. It has less deaths per 1 million of population than 12 other european countries.

Germany is recording deaths differently to us,if a person with an underlying health condition has Coronavirus and dies,the underlying health condition is given as the reason for death!! Opposite to us

Not true, deaths are reported in exactly the same way, this done under WHO guidelines, however, it is in the UK where hospital deaths are being under reported, according to an investigation by Ch4.

Germany has a much larger manufacturing industry than we do and so had the capability of producing a large amount of tests early on

Germany's economy is 24% manufacturing, ours is 15% Merkel ordered Roche to start making testing kits in January, having designed said tests with the UK, we didn't tell our Pharma to do the same, indeed we still haven't.

jasjas so are you saying that it is not true that Germany had a much higher manufacturing capacity for tests? I did not know that this has been challenged.

According to my family in Germany, they started physical distancing much earlier than us. Gyms, pubs, and all shops except supermarkets were closed down earlier than ours & before they went into lockdown. So they were seriously physically distancing about 10 days before us.

And they have Frau Merkel - a trained scientist - as their national leader, rather than a PM flying a kite about herd immunity.

And they are testing.

We had a week of grace in which we could have followed Germany ...

My good friend in germany has commented that it's very well known that huge numbers of elderly are dying. She and many of her family work in the medical field.
It's hard to know. Eventually we will need to compare overall death percentages not just of covid to get a final idea I feel.
Perhaps that germany is paid for system rather than state makes a difference? It feels much more like a private system there too. If you turn up yo a&e there with a spurious injury, drunk, cold etc. They treat uou but give you short shrift and people not to be repeat offenders possibly neaning better use of facilities not time wasting and over xsoavity hor medics. Drs seem to be open late and work as a business where you give your insurance or pay and people are told they must go there ir a+e freeing hospital facilities, they all di routine bloods etc all the time which means general capacity is better overall rather than more central testing labs here being overloaded. Ultimately the more you are I'll or the older you get the higher premiums you pay. The model is do different to the NHS u dan see why there is a difference.

with an underlying health condition has Coronavirus and dies,the underlying health condition is given as the reason for death!! Opposite to us

That was what I've been told by german medics I know too. Ultimately we will have to compare overall deaths for the period I feel and consider statistical differences between average and current death rates to give a final answer I suppose.