DH’s friend needs social interaction. MH. What to do?

[QueenofmyPrinces]

My husband has a very good friend who has been depressed for many years. He won’t see his GP because he thinks it’s a weakness, but he’s such a worry to us all.

He has in numerous occasions spoke about ending his life. His brother committed suicide 7 years ago and he has never really gotten over it.

He has a sister but they are estranged. His parents live in Europe and have no idea how fragile he is.

He is not married and does not have any children. Nor does he have a partner.

My DH, and other friends, do all they can to try and help, they phone him regularly, visit when they can, include him on outings and holidays etc. They are worried about him and tend to keep a close eye on him.

When the lockdown came into force we were all very worried about how the friend would cope because the thought of him being shut away from everyone left us uneasy.

Anyway, my DH called his friend yesterday who was very down, says he can’t cope with being on his own 24/7 with just his thoughts and my DH is worried his friend is going to try and harm himself.

At the end of the phone conversation the friend asked my DH if he could come over next weekend. He said that by then he will have been self isolating for long enough to know he’s clear of the virus (his words) because he doesn’t know how much longer he can go on for without seeing somebody.

My husband is anxious about this but what do we do? Can we really turn away his potentially suicidal friend?

The effects of this lockdown on people with MH issues must be so, so hard.

I have told DH that if he lets his friend come over then they are to stay in the garden, be completely away from each other (ends of our garden are about 12ft apart) and that me and the children won’t be joining them.

I feel very conflicted about it, as does DH but we feel like we have no other option.

If his friend was to harm himself then we would forever have it on our conscience.

Any suggestions?

He’s vulnerable, so visits would definitely be allowed. Maybe a regular visit would be helpful.

However. If he decides to kill himself, it will not be on your conscience, or your DH’s. That is his decision to make. There are lots of ways to talk to him about suicide that can help you assess how big the risk actually is, which might help you decide how best to support him.

Happy to go into this further if it’s helpful OP.

Yes he’s currently working from home - which although is giving him a focus of sorts, he does miss the social interaction of work.

We have previously asked him if he would talk to his parents about how he feels but he said he can’t put them through that again after they lost his brother through depression.

We both wish he would see his GP, in fact I thought it would be something he’d want to do after what happened with his brother - but how can we ever know the logic (or not) of people’s thinking.

Thank you for all the really good ideas suggested about about how to include him in more things and give him activities to do that involve interactions of sorts but doesn’t actually involve social interaction.

He lives a 25 minute drive away and because he’s working from home we know that if he did want to visit regularly only weekend days would allow for that. I assume he wouldn’t ask to come every weekend but who knows?

Me and DH both know that in the bigger picture, nothing we do, or his friends do, is going to ‘fix’ his state of mind but we feel like we just have to help him as much as we can in the difficult time’s.

I don’t know much about antidepressants but from reading various threads on here the theme seems to be that they take a good few weeks to work anyway? Or does this vary from drug to drug? I’m just thinking that even if he did see his GP and got a prescription he would still need our support whilst they kick in, which would probably include social interaction.

I’m thinking I might suggest that my DH goes over there instead of his friend coming here.

My friend has MH problems and was very recently diagnosed with cancer. She moved in with a friend and his partner, and will remain there for the duration of quarantine. Could your DH friend do the same? Move in with one household for the duration?

Yes I think your DH meeting him at his garden would be better. Your DH is less likely to push the boundaries whereas the friend might. We found with my brother that the back garden didn’t work at all but standing at the gate in the front does work.

It’s really awful times

By the way OP, he’s lucky to have good friends around him like your DH.

I'd let him. In my mind I'd be thinking what's do you have the biggest chance of - him killing or seriously harming himself, one of you dying from coronavirus, one of you catching mild coronavirus and being fine after a few days.

Obviously I don't know any of you or your medical backgrounds but I'd say the chance of him harming himself is very real whereas the chance of two separate households who've been isolating for two weeks infecting each other is much smaller.

Invite him to dinner, virtually. Set up a Zoom or Skype for your normal dinner time, set the laptop up on the table and eat together.

I don't think this is an automatic no. Because you need to weigh up the risk of possibly spreading the virus between two households, and the possibility of him committing suicide. It sounds like this is a genuine risk.

I would take advice from a MH charity. I am sure there must be others in this situation and there must be advice.

This is obviously a massive suggestion but would you consider having the friend live in your household for eg 3 months? That way you could look after him and once the initial risk of spreading has passed there would be no greater risk than to another household with 3 adults in it

Agree with OohPee.
It also hints of emotional manipulation.
Sounds like he had everyone running round after him pre corona while not looking to seek help.
Make a GP assessment a condition of the visits.

If he is self isolating, has no symptoms and has not been in contact with anyone else then he poses a very small risk to you and your family. I think these are special circumstances and you should do what you can. I think in these hard times we need to use a little common sense. Weigh up the risks and make a decision. CV is not the only way to die and we shouldn’t stop preventing other deaths just to save ourselves from CV (although the risk of a healthy person die-ing of CV is low). Personally I would do all I can to stop someone hurting themselves.

Has this man ever tried to seek help? GP? Mental health services? Charity organisations?

To me it appears he is relying too much on his friends that you now feel responsible for his wellbeing. This is not your weight to bear and it does NOT help him.

If I was you, I phone the council and get numbers for support groups he can phone, there are many charity organisations who will have a chat with him. I would also advise him to see his GP.

You need to distance here. This is not healthy for any of you. You are both playing the rescuer role and acting like he is the victim. Let's try to change that mentality.

I'd say the chance of him harming himself is very real

With respect, you don’t know that.

Whether he gets anti-depressants or not, that isn't going to change his circumstances. He's not suddenly going to become happy with his life and find lockdown easier.

In fact, he'll potentially be at increased risk of suicide if he starts anti-depressants. It's well known that when depression starts to lift, suicide risk can rise due to increased energy, motivation and clarity of thinking.

The problem is that I’m not self isolating as I leave the house to go to work twice a week (a nurse) so there is always the risk I could pass something on to him.

Obviously the risk is always there with my DH and children, but I still feel like I shouldn’t be near anybody else unless it’s necessary.

It will also be hard if he comes here because my children adore him, so if they see him in the garden then they’re going to want to be out there with him. My eldest son is old enough to understand why he couldn’t but my youngest son would probably be standing at the back door and wailing and asking to see the friend.

I think that’s another reason why his friend likes to come here - in the absence of not having children of his own he loves ours and I think the fun he has with them probably really helps - he definitely smiles a lot more when our children are playing with him and his laughter seems genuine rather than forced.

Such a difficult one. I'm such an advocate for the lockdown but self isolating must be so hard for people on their own, especially when they have MH problems. Your DH must feel so torn and full of what ifs...

I'll probably get flamed for this but could he stop by your house and talk on the doorstep, 2m apart? Don't even come in, just stand at the end of your drive/path or something? Or could they go food shopping 'together'? So arrange to get groceries/essentials once a week or fortnight at the same time? Maintaining distance at all times, but having that date in the diary when he'll see a friend might just keep him focused.

I agree it's best your DH goes to him and visits him in his garden observing the 2 meter rule, or meets him in a public open place for a walk. Your DH should take his own flask of coffee if he visits.

That way it's under your DH's control and you're not placed in the position of denying him a visit to the toilet inside your home or another cup of coffee/ glass of water, or him not wanting to leave.

It's difficult but depression does make some sufferers behave in ways that if they didn't have mental health issues would be selfish - the fact it's the illness making them behave that way makes it wrong to judge but nevertheless doesn't change the practical consequences for those who care about them.

I think daisypond suggestion of a walk is a very good one as that is within the guidelines (no more than 2 unless same household) and only puts your husband with him

I'm with @Francesthemute on this one! He needs help, he's vulnerable! At a safe distance I see no wrong in helping this chap. If he were my friend and I was concerned for his MH I'd be checking in daily and finding every which was to make him feel safe. It's such an uncertain time, people of all walks of life locked up and feeling anxious.. including me some days! We really need to look out for each other guys.

Can you not whats app him every day? If needs be, get him a phone and post it through door so he can whats app you.

I think there is long and short term solutions. If the risk is high and a visit reduces it then fine but...he also needs to find other ways of getting help because what happens as one visit becomes daily ones from you, you then get sick etc? So reducing risk today maybe ok but needs alternative solutions as well - it cannot be all on you at all.

I think I’d let him, under these circumstances, make sure he knows there’s no food or drink on offer and no trips to you loo before he comes, you don’t want any awkward requests when he’s there.

I would consider trying to persuade him to speak to his GP over the phone, MIND or Safeline.

If he works, has he got a support system there? I’m a Civil Servant and we have a number we can ring and speak to people in confidence, they can also arrange counselling for us if we need it. Might be worth asking.

It could save his life. Stay safe, keep your distance.

Gosh I’d do it in a heartbeat. The lockdown is to prevent the widespread of this virus and to protect the at-risk groups.
In this case the benefits far outweigh the risks imo

Isolation is of the mind not body, it is horrible. I was v low yesterday. What helped me was Video Chat. It stimulates the mind much more than a voice down the phone. I told my Dad ONLY video call me. What I want is TIME. Not a 5 min chat while a friend is in the car and her partner is in the supermarket or they are out doing their family exercise. A meandaring chat. I suggested we could watch tv together over zoom/whatsapp video. What about doing an activity together like cooking?

Also carers can visit people, so maybe do it as his carer?