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Is anyone else angry and embarrassed right now ?

728 replies

Sapphiresunrise · 03/04/2020 15:16

For the developed and resourced country that we are, we are potentially going to be overtaking Italy and Spain by the looks of things.
Australia and other nations have death rates in double figures. They were smart to close borders and even close regions. Canada the same. Denmark, etc. The list goes on. South Korea have the situation under control.
We were warned about this. I feel like majority of those deaths could have been avoided.

OP posts:
Blossomad · 03/04/2020 18:23

PicturesOfCats

Not sure you can blame any government for a novel coronavirus, tbh. It’s an unprecedented pandemic.///

It’s not unprecedented and this govt modelled it in 2016. They were told exactly what would happen. Boris loves bringing up history to justify his waffle, we’ve had 4 pandemics this century, they were expecting this and were warned.

Alsohuman · 03/04/2020 18:23

@LesLavandes and @olivehater, even The Telegraph - that Tory mouthpiece - is openly critical of the government. You’re defending the indefensible.

mochajoes · 03/04/2020 18:24

@Cam77 no i categorically do not want to be more like China.

NewYearNewTwatName · 03/04/2020 18:25

olivehater
on the contrary I believe the since the U turn on herd immunity. I think the government have tried bloody hard to implement financial packages and build hospitals....... under the circumstances and probably against a lot of their fellow Tory mp they are trying.

But this is a thread about the fact the circumstances could have been slightly better and slower if they hadn't fuck up earlier.

Is that ok? we discuss so many things on MN why is it upsetting to discuss this?

UYScuti · 03/04/2020 18:26

We should focus more on the number per million of the population imo.
The only prepared countries were ones who'd had similar in the past ...surely?

SingingBabooshkaBadly · 03/04/2020 18:28

@mochajoes

So what should we have done in Jan/Feb?

Well for starters we could have made sure the NHS had proper PPE in sufficient quantities and started sourcing more ventilators, including committing to the EU procurement scheme.

GivenchyD · 03/04/2020 18:29

There is a global pandemic, people are tragically going to die.

Critical care has been massively expanded and is coping with the numbers, there has been massive financial help for businesses and employees. Nightingale hospitals have been developed in a matter of days.

Staying indoors saves lives and look how people are struggling to do just that.

I am angry and 'embarrassed' with China who apparently are continuing to have wet markets and seem to be profiteering from selling their PPE stuff to the rest of the world.

P1nkHeartLovesCake · 03/04/2020 18:31

Shoulda, woulda, coulda isn’t hindsight wonderful...

I feel like majority of those deaths could have been avoided Nobody can say that, we simply don’t know enough about this virus to say that statement.

Fact is we are dealing with an unknown situation, our government and us are going in to this blind.

Why are our government to blame...This come from China if anyone has blood on there hands it’s China!

DarnedSocks · 03/04/2020 18:32

Of course Labour is as much to blame. They brought in the disastrous PFI iniative, which has financially crippled the parts of the NHS. We also wouldn't have a Conservative government if we'd had a decent Labour party to vote for.

@cantata I'm sorry I must have missed that post. I suspect many others did too. The thread moves so fast. I hope the poster feeling like that gets some help and support. If you're reading whoever you are, please reach out either in Mental Health here or somewhere else. It's terrifying facing a pandemic but all is not lost. Mistakes have been made yes, but by taking about them we have a chance to learn from them. There is hope. Drugs are in advanced stage trials, a vaccine is being developed, the virus might eventually mutate to a milder form. We can still take action now. Get the extra PPE to frontline staff, take precautions, social distancing.

Dressingdown1 · 03/04/2020 18:33

It's far too early to say that China did the right thing. I have friends over there who are convinced that their government is covering up the second wave and believe that everyone will catch it, if they haven't already had it. Also many schools are not open yet and won't be until at least 20th April.

Blossomad · 03/04/2020 18:34

Has Nightingale Hospital treated one patient yet?
I haven’t seen any? Meanwhile my stepfather with dementia has been denied life saving medical treatment as he is considered disposable. Anyone in a care home will be denied treatment and are being pressured to sign DNRs without family consultation. Over 75s are already being classed as not worthy of treatment.

PicturesOfCats · 03/04/2020 18:34

It’s not unprecedented and this govt modelled it in 2016

They modelled this exact virus, with the exact symptoms and exact rates of infection?

No worries then, they’re obviously fortune tellers, and we can sit tight and wait for them to consult their crystal ball.

You can model a lot of things, but you can’t be prepared for every eventuality at once, and I’m sure that there’s a million other pandemics and emergencies they’ve modelled and theorised.

mochajoes · 03/04/2020 18:36

@SingingBabooshkaBadly I already said the gov made mistakes with that 😴😴

Why is there such a lack of critical thinking on this thread? I've never said the gov have turn things perfectly & could do no more. My point has always been that I don't believe we could have engineered a lockdown earlier on as it's essential to have the population on side & compliant, we needed to see the deaths in Italy & here. Unpalatable as that may be, it doesn't mean it's not true.

I also don't believe an earlier lockdown would have been particularly beneficial.

PicturesOfCats · 03/04/2020 18:36

including committing to the EU procurement scheme

They don’t have enough as it is.
Fuck the Italians, they’re pretty much done for, so let’s take all their ventilators off them as well, eh?

GivenchyD · 03/04/2020 18:36

It hasn't even been 2 full weeks since lockdown, and people aren't coping. If they'd done this a month ago people would be breaking rules now just as we are heading towards the peak which would have increased the acceleration massively.

From what I understand deaths are not preventable, but overwhelming the NHS is, which at the moment is working.

Buttybach · 03/04/2020 18:38

As close as the 15th we had estranged family members who went on a week long cruise, made friends with several Italian couples (who could have been carriers) then they managed to swan back into the country unchecked and untested and went to visit lots of friends and family. They are utter numpties.
There should have been testing at the borders and advice for people to isolate.

SynchroSwimmer · 03/04/2020 18:39

I am beyond angry at our government and the lack of dynamic organisation from the outset.

I honestly don’t know why we didn’t get the heads of the Military - RAF/RN/Army in on this with emergency planning at the outset - all that professional expertise, all well versed in exercising, initiating and delivering dynamic actions and all manner of disaster planning and decisive decision making on what we, the the country and we the public needed to do.

I honestly expected them to all be round a table with the government early on, each talking through their ideas before formulating the best joint dynamic plans for the way ahead for the country.

(I guess because my background, (in decades past), was military - and I expected a short bullet pointed plan of what we all as citizens should do....not the wishy-washy way that information has I feel been presented to us)

Yes we had that advantage of being an island - and we messed that up.

I absolutely can’t get my head around the lack of appropriate PPE for medical staff at every level - I sit in utter disbelief and despair at the scenes we are seeing in the media where our clinical and front line staff seem to have no option but to carry on, directly in the face of oncoming fire, putting their own and their families lives at risk regardless - just through the inexcusable and shocking lack of PPE materials.

Again military planners would have been “on” this from day one, getting UK companies on board to start immediate mass manufacturing at that stage.

(I suppose I am relating it to old military service - where you would never simply “assume”, in a slapdash manner, that a situation was safe - until proved otherwise. Rather, you would dress with appropriate PPE until such time as it was actually safe to remove it, not the opposite way around)

We as a country should have been proactive.

The lack of organisation for testing and shockingly low levels of testing offered to medical staff so far leaves me beyond speechless at the incompetence of it all.

Everything seems slow, reactive and un-dynamic, I lack confidence in what is being done.

I suppose, on balance, it is hard to even realise that most of this pandemic so far, has happened for this country in the short space of just one single month - at the beginning of the the month I was carefree, in the sun on a beach somewhere in the Canaries - not knowing that in the space of 3 weeks we would all be home, fearful and in total lockdown.

Randomschoolworker19 · 03/04/2020 18:39

We've known about this since January. They have been too slow in:

Getting PPE and ventilators for NHS.
Locking down
Shutting schools
Stopping mass gatherings
Not testing enough

They have been incompetent by:

Sending mixed messages: herd immunity then no herd immunity, masks are useless, now they're not?

Only testing people from affected areas when it was clearly being spread in the community. Now only testing in hospitals.... Not enough tests full stop.

Our boarders are still open and there are no checks taking place.

The lock down and enforcement of it are not strict enough...

Honestly just feels like we are playing catch up all the time.

MadameF · 03/04/2020 18:41

I'm in France and have the (possibly incorrect) opinion from what I hear that the population are being treated a little like children, and being asked to PLEASE stay at home. Here in France you have to fill in a certificate every time you leave the house with the reason why, there are lots of police controles - today in Paris 8000 were deployed to ensure Parisiens didn't leave Paris for the spring holidays. Restrictions are also tougher here. I think something stronger than please is needed. The UK have overtaken France on the level of deaths and they were originally a week behind. Nothing to do with testing as in France there haven't been many done, it is confinement which seems to be making the difference.

Blossomad · 03/04/2020 18:42

GivenchyD

It hasn't even been 2 full weeks since lockdown, and people aren't coping. If they'd done this a month ago people would be breaking rules now just as we are heading towards the peak which would have increased the acceleration massively.

From what I understand deaths are not preventable, but overwhelming the NHS is, which at the moment is working.////

So we are stuck indoors “to protect the vulnerable and the NHS”
Meanwhile NHS staff don’t have enough or the correct PPE, and anyone over 75 or with considerable frailty levels are being told they won’t be treated? It doesn’t make sense.
If we are staying in to protect the vulnerable, they should be being treated and the NHS staff should be properly equipped.

Random18 · 03/04/2020 18:43

The govt have made many mistakes.

To me the biggest one is the PPE.

BUT we really don't know yet which country is handling things best.

Ok other countries have lower death rates than us now but who knows what death rates will be like at end of the pandemic.

What I am sure of, is that the world can't lock down for 18 months.

So we either need to accept the hard immunity and just pray it is true, or we have economic ruin.

I'm not saying any is the best option and our govt have incredibly difficult choices to make.

Whatever choices are made will cost lives, be that from corona virus or be that because of the economic tsunami that we are facing.

The govt can only finance us for so long. A d other countries are not as wealthy as us and the consequences of a lockdown will possibly be more severe than CV in some places.

Am I embarrassed to be British - no. Do i like the government- no. Will I look at every other country and think that they are doing everything correctly just because they aren't the Britisg government- no

Do I hope long term the Tories have to pay the price for their austerity - absolutely

mochajoes · 03/04/2020 18:46

@SynchroSwimmer Sorry why with your military background & knowledge were you on holiday 3/4 weeks ago?

NewYearNewTwatName · 03/04/2020 18:47

GivenchyD point is if they hadn't let everyone returning from north Italy to carry on as normal had mass gathering, and tled people to keep shaking hands, we probably wouldn't actually be in lock down now

I'm not saying we wouldn't have had to go into lock down at some point. But the government decided to let it spread. Now it is out of control and we are already in lock down with deaths spiralling.

When they stood there with their graphs showing a flatten curve and high fast curve. Whilst saying carry on don't self isolate, shake hands, go to mass gathering, they were right there and then putting us on the high fast peak. Experts about the world knew this and many MN who took note of the global experts knew this and said so at the time too.

Blossomad · 03/04/2020 18:47

I honestly think that there is definitely going to be a lot more angry people after we start seeing more of our friends and relatives dying. You can’t spin that with a “Level Up” catchphrase ffs

Ffsnosexallowed · 03/04/2020 18:48

I'm not embarrassed, I'm feeling really proud of the partnership efforts that we're making locally. We've been testing staff for weeks, we've pretty much sorted out our ppe, we've set up new wards and replied staff, we've put new community supports in place, our communities are volunteering to help the most vulnerable, most people are staying at home. I'm proud to be part of the fight against coronavirus. If you're angry about a lack of action, then do something.

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