Omg. The next step in the strategy. And if we all stick together it may work

[Bool]

Next step in UK strategy. Lock down all the over 70s (and other immunocompromised - kids / adults) for 4 months. Lock them down. Then make it illegal to close schools. That means we gain immunity to the virus as a population and keeps the beds open for the unusual cases that are not foreseen.

@Lweji posted this link, and I am going to post it everywhere.

www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/world/corona-simulator/

The moderate distancing is 1 in 4 still moving about. The extreme is only 1 in 8 moving.

It’s pointless saying care homes are in lockdown unless the staff are isolated in there too.

but what would the death rate be if there was a complete collapse of the global economy?

The economy will be in an even worse state if there are hundreds of thousands of people dying in a short space of time. You need to take the short term pain for long term gain. That's the logical conclusion that literally everybody else except the UK is coming to.

Sakura7 - millions died in the 1918-19 flu pandemic, at a time when that was a far higher proportion of the global population than it would be now - and in that case, it was people in their 20s-40s most at risk. There is only one certainty: global pandemics happen and this is the first pandemic of its particular kind, so nobody knows for sure how best to deal with it without causing all sorts of unforeseen consequences.

Can someone explain this to me.

If schools stay open and coronavirus spreads through the schools, kids will no doubt take the virus home to their parents.

OK, grandparents may be isolated and safe...but...

Won’t health worker parents then have MORE chance of catching the virus?

• Carers
• Nurses
• Doctors Etc

They will either then take that virus into our hospitals or have to self isolate anyway.

so nobody knows for sure how best to deal with it without causing all sorts of unforeseen consequences.

There is a broad expert led global consensus on how to deal with it though. The UK is literally the only country in the world that thinks it knows better.

Also - and possibly not the most important consideration - but how bloody boring would self isolation be?! Even if only for 5days not months! I've recently been ill (not covid) and off work all week, and at home for 4 of those days. I'd got cabin fever and had to go to the cinema yesterday. I'll be going out today too. Being stuck at home just makes you feel worse. When you're ill you don't notice the boredom but when we'll you do

My brother will be self-isolating for 2 weeks when he lands in NZ early Monday morning. Why is our country taking such light measures in contrast?

Sakura "The economy will be in an even worse state if there are hundreds of thousands of people dying in a short space of time."

I thought it was the other way round. Lots of people dying in a short space of time will be better than stretching it out.

They are trying to save your life! daisypond they really aren't, if they were then they would have stopped The Cheltenham Festival, they'd have stopped big crowded football matches, thank heavens the sporting association have more sense and the balls to do the right thing.

Could you just explain how saying they will stop NHS care for the over 65s is saving my life? How about while I'm isolated with my 70+ husband one of us falls and breaks a hip? No ambulance, it's NHS, no paramedic, they are NHS, no doctor/nurse etc all NHS.

Do you think we are all stupid because we are 65+?

Yes it is Boris's "Kill a Granny Scheme".
If you are old or ill you are expendable. Because it is too hard to try and contain the virus like other countries are doing.

I have no idea how they can police it. That’s not my concern. My concern is for the elderly that are capable of going shopping etc and do so on a busy Sat afternoon. I know plenty of people you probably call elderly who work so they go shopping on non working days just like you do. Do you think they should just starve?

@Madein1995 Yes it is boring. But this is about people living or dying.

Is is only the elderly being self isolated or is it anyone with an autoimmune or health condition?

I know people 70 plus who work. In fact whenever there is a discussion on MN about pensions there are always plenty ready to say 70 is not old.
But suddenly 70 is ancient and so it does not matter if you die.

@Justyou I have no idea. Under vulnerable pre-existing conditions that would mean an awful lot of over 50 year olds.

I think it's a logical strategy. At some point most of us are going to get this. It doesn't appear to be too serious in the young and healthy. So protect the vulnerable and let the rest of us get it and build up some immunity.

I take immunosuppressant meds and it’s so confusing what to do

@Sakura7
That’s right. We have known of dozens of cases in several European countries since the middle of February. More than four weeks ago. But our “government” carried on with the flights, the football, the concerts, etc etc ... right up until this day, except in cases where the organizers themselves (eg The Premier League) pulled the plug because they could take it anymore. And now, NOW, they have the gall to tell people “it’s too late to stop it, guys”. Well it is now you utter incompetent/evil fuckwits.

@Cam77 they modelled all this. Shutting flights down would have delayed the spread by 1-2 days. It had already spread when we found out about it. Being in outdoor spaces at mass gatherings doesn’t have a huge impact on spread. What has the biggest impact is washing hands and not going out with a fever or a cough. Next part of the plan is to protect the vulnerable. But if you don’t wish to take part in protecting the vulnerable then fine. Luckily there will be enough other people who will do so.

Well I’ve just spoken to my mother and her Tin Foil Hat wearing partner who are both in their mid 70s and have underlying health conditions and they seem to be determined to carry on as normal. 🤦🏻‍♀️🤷‍♀️

Their lifestyle is one of semi self isolation anyway and they are of the opinion that’s most of the information in scaremongering and hysteria and most people who have died have been about 90, already in hospital anyway and probably died with CV rather than of it.

She says she’s going to be ‘sensible’ about not going on public transport or going anywhere crowded if she doesn’t have to. But that doesn’t seem to extend to missing her village quiz night this week, nor using the small local village CoOp rather than going to the busy big supermarket.
I said well that’s fine as long as you are willing to accept that you are both in more than one risk category and it’s your own outcome you are gambling with.

She was mainly miffed that her local Morrison’s was full of Roma people, whole extended families bulk buying trolley loads of chicken and shouting at the tops of their voices for some reason, while videoing everything on their phones,. Apparently one small child walked up to her and coughed in her face for a laugh, egged on by his older relatives.

*pieceofmaria I am sure once she has seen other vulnerable people protecting themselves she will digest it all and come round. Also more horror stories will come out of Italy and Spain over the next few days. What a horrible thing for that small child to do.

The virus has been contained in some countries. Lots and lots of scientists are saying it is still not too late here.
We have had nearly 2 months warning this was coming. Of course we could have stopped us even getting to the stage we are now.

Instead Boris has decided to test out an unproven theory of herd immunity that is disputed by lots of scientists. And to kill half a million people in the process.

I honestly don't understand anyone who can blindly support this. How can you look at how every other government is doing the exact opposite to the UK, that a few hundred scientists have written to the government saying they are wrong, that WHO are saying they are wrong - how can you look at all that and blindly have faith that the UK government is doing the right thing?

@Bool
it had already spread when we found out about it
Oh come on. Well by that logic China should have 1 million cases right now instead of 12,000.
“Oh no it’s already spread, 50,000 have got it!”
“Oh well fuck it, business as usual”.

And what do you mean “before they found out about it”. Did this virus just appear from nowhere? Or was it, er, headline news for about six weeks before it popped up in Europe? I guess it’s totally unreasonable to expect our government to keep a firm eye out for a deadly disease spreading westward that had already upended the world’s 2nd biggest economy.

I have no idea how they can police it. That’s not my concern. My concern is for the elderly that are capable of going shopping etc and do so on a busy Sat afternoon.

I know plenty of people you probably call elderly who work so they go shopping on non working days just like you do. Do you think they should just starve?

@1forsorrow

What is your point? Makes no sense as a response to what I said.....

So how many over 70’s do you know that work full time? Monday to Friday, thee fire can only go on a Sat afternoon?

For the context of this post, your example is not great. Given the fact the vast majority of 70 year olds will be retired or at the most work part time, therefore will have several days to chose to shop if they must.

I wasn’t even taking about that particular group anyway. I was talking about the once’s that’s do not work and have no reason to go at peak times.