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Conflict in the Middle East

Hamas embedded in Gazan society

124 replies

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 09:36

I found this an interesting read. How hamas is deeply embedded in the fabric of Gazan society. Its an older article, not one Ive seen shared and helps to explain why Hamas hasn't gone.

https://themedialine.org/top-stories/how-hamas-still-holds-power-in-gaza-more-than-2-years-into-the-war/

How Hamas Still Holds Power in Gaza, More Than 2 Years Into the War  - The Media Line

Nearly two years after Israel launched a war […]

https://themedialine.org/top-stories/how-hamas-still-holds-power-in-gaza-more-than-2-years-into-the-war/

OP posts:
likelysuspect · 31/05/2026 11:04

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 11:01

So with your views what happens next then? How do you see a future looking for the Palestinians living in Gaza?

No idea. Why would I have any idea?

JacknDiane · 31/05/2026 11:08

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 11:12

likelysuspect · 31/05/2026 11:04

No idea. Why would I have any idea?

I was actually asking your opinion rather than fact as you stated clearly and very negatively that any future Palestinian government would have the same ideals as Hamas. Do you think a two state solution is in the future?

Mantanora · 31/05/2026 11:15

I could call the Israeli government a lot of things but stupid isn’t one of them. They know that Hamas are not a single group of people. To many Palestinians, Hamas is not simply a government or military wing, they are a symbol of resistance and the Israeli government know that is something that can’t be killed with a bullet or a bomb. Anthony Blinken said in January 2025. “Indeed, we assess that Hamas has recruited almost as many new militants as it has lost.” As long as Hamas exists in Gaza, Israel has an excuse to carry on its offensive, calling it self defense, where it appears the real reason is to eventually depopulate the whole of Gaza of the Palestinians. An intention numerous Israeli politicians are not shy about declaring.

likelysuspect · 31/05/2026 11:26

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 11:12

I was actually asking your opinion rather than fact as you stated clearly and very negatively that any future Palestinian government would have the same ideals as Hamas. Do you think a two state solution is in the future?

No I dont think its a solution that is readily agreed by either side. Its been a shit show from the start and will continue to be. Thats as much of an idea as I have. Im not a politician!

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 11:37

likelysuspect · 31/05/2026 11:26

No I dont think its a solution that is readily agreed by either side. Its been a shit show from the start and will continue to be. Thats as much of an idea as I have. Im not a politician!

It has been a shit show from the start and continues to be that's most certainly in no doubt.

It just frightens me with the language being used regarding displacement of Palestinians over the next couple of days that instead of a two state solution we might have a one state like Netanyahu promised at the UN convention nearly 3 years ago.

Twiglets1 · 31/05/2026 12:06

likelysuspect · 31/05/2026 11:04

No idea. Why would I have any idea?

It’s such a complex situation, even politicians haven’t been able to come up with answers all these years.

It’s a depressing outlook in my opinion. I would like to see a two state solution one day but that day doesn’t seem to get any closer. I don’t see it happening while the Hamas military wing are there and they won’t leave.

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 12:08

Twiglets1 · 31/05/2026 12:06

It’s such a complex situation, even politicians haven’t been able to come up with answers all these years.

It’s a depressing outlook in my opinion. I would like to see a two state solution one day but that day doesn’t seem to get any closer. I don’t see it happening while the Hamas military wing are there and they won’t leave.

And until Israel respect ceasefires and yellow lines and elects a more moderate government that stop settlers taking over land violently.

Hopefully when both of these happen things can move forward.

Twiglets1 · 31/05/2026 12:13

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 12:08

And until Israel respect ceasefires and yellow lines and elects a more moderate government that stop settlers taking over land violently.

Hopefully when both of these happen things can move forward.

Yes that too.

A more moderate Israeli government is something that could be coming this Autumn.

But will Hamas ever be voted out/leave Gaza, that is unknown.

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:32

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 10:30

Governance will, or should, stay the same. Policy can change though, without government, or embedded government systems, changing.

If Netanyahu loses his election, then the government of Isreal won't change, but it's policy might. MPs or reps change of course, but the civil service and military don't.

The USA done that government sacking thing in Iraq. And that did not go well.

I'm not sure you can compare Gaza to Iraq, maybe compare Irag to Iran though.

If Hamas could change policy to not want to attack Israel and strike a peace deal. I'm not sure the sides are at a position to talk. So a change of governance but who? If anyone pops up against Hamas they would be killed as others were after the ceasefire agreement.

OP posts:
Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:35

localnotail · 31/05/2026 10:45

I think its a very interesting subject, OP, and one that is being supressed for some reason - as you can see on this thread, if you try to discuss the role of Hamas in Gaza society you get instantly shouted at being pro-Israel aggression and shame on you etc etc.

If we move away from what is going on between Gaza and Israel, I think its important to understand how much ordinary people in Gaza support Hamas ideology. Hamas have taken over every part of Gazan life - they not only in government, they also rule and control education, healthcare, media - everything. Its a bit like what was happening in the USSR - you had no opportunity to know what is really going on as there were no ways for people to speak freely, or for anyone to get any information other than official account. But there were dissidents - and I know there are dissidents from Gaza, who speak against Hamas - but for some reason their voices are not prominent.

What I'd like to know is what the ordinary Palestinians think of Hamas, and how much they support it. There seem to be a LOT of support, but is it willing? Is it all people, or just some?

I do feel very sorry for people of Gaza as sadly I can't see how their situation can improve, its been going on for so long, billions and billions pumped there as aid, negotiations, initiatives - but nothing is changing. I do believe, however, that people who can change the situation are not Western countries, but rather immediate neighbours - who seem to do fuck all and quietly fan the flames of conflict, using it for their own gain.

Edited

This. I think it's important to discuss everything and not supress discussion but understand that some might not wish to take part, (up to them).

I'd love to know what the ordinary Palastinians think of Hamas, I suspect they might be too fearful to speak out so say nothing so impossible to say how many really support Hamas and how many don't.

OP posts:
Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:37

"I do feel very sorry for people of Gaza as sadly I can't see how their situation can improve, its been going on for so long, billions and billions pumped there as aid, negotiations, initiatives - but nothing is changing. I do believe, however, that people who can change the situation are not Western countries, but rather immediate neighbours - who seem to do fuck all and quietly fan the flames of conflict, using it for their own gain."

Totally agree with this. Why the immediate neighbours don't do more. Billions in aid and nothing changes. It feels like it needs a group of middle eastern countries to come together and find a solution together.

OP posts:
Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:38

Martymcfly24 · 31/05/2026 12:08

And until Israel respect ceasefires and yellow lines and elects a more moderate government that stop settlers taking over land violently.

Hopefully when both of these happen things can move forward.

I agree. This is needed together with change in Gaza.

OP posts:
Mantanora · 31/05/2026 13:02

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:37

"I do feel very sorry for people of Gaza as sadly I can't see how their situation can improve, its been going on for so long, billions and billions pumped there as aid, negotiations, initiatives - but nothing is changing. I do believe, however, that people who can change the situation are not Western countries, but rather immediate neighbours - who seem to do fuck all and quietly fan the flames of conflict, using it for their own gain."

Totally agree with this. Why the immediate neighbours don't do more. Billions in aid and nothing changes. It feels like it needs a group of middle eastern countries to come together and find a solution together.

What exactly do you want them to do? They had nothing to do with this and according to Egypt, they warned the Israelis on more than one occasion that Hamas were up to something big just before October 7th. As much as they might see what’s happened to Gaza as appalling, this is not their fight and has nothing to do with them.

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 13:22

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 12:35

This. I think it's important to discuss everything and not supress discussion but understand that some might not wish to take part, (up to them).

I'd love to know what the ordinary Palastinians think of Hamas, I suspect they might be too fearful to speak out so say nothing so impossible to say how many really support Hamas and how many don't.

How are you going to define ordinary Palestinians ?

You know what I am going to say now. Pick me an ordinary Brit. Or a dozen. How many of them are going to agree on stuff.

There does appear to be a thing where some peoples are all lumped together. Hamas do terror, Hamas runs Gaza, therefore all Gazans are terrorists.

And yes, Gaza is a single party authoritarian state. Except it is not a State. Now we insert "freedom fighter" rather than terrorist. Then someone says " but freedom fighters do not bomb busses or rape women". And that is fair enough, esp the latter. Except of course, pretty much all wars of independence have involved Guerrilla warfare. So it all gets confusing. Lets throw in the West Bank too.

But yet the picture is painted by many that all Gazans are terrorists.

Ordinary Palestinians? I suppose the first step in finding any of them is to have an ordinary country for them to have the luxury of being ordinary in. Even with an ordinary country, good luck defining who is ordinary.

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 13:50

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 13:22

How are you going to define ordinary Palestinians ?

You know what I am going to say now. Pick me an ordinary Brit. Or a dozen. How many of them are going to agree on stuff.

There does appear to be a thing where some peoples are all lumped together. Hamas do terror, Hamas runs Gaza, therefore all Gazans are terrorists.

And yes, Gaza is a single party authoritarian state. Except it is not a State. Now we insert "freedom fighter" rather than terrorist. Then someone says " but freedom fighters do not bomb busses or rape women". And that is fair enough, esp the latter. Except of course, pretty much all wars of independence have involved Guerrilla warfare. So it all gets confusing. Lets throw in the West Bank too.

But yet the picture is painted by many that all Gazans are terrorists.

Ordinary Palestinians? I suppose the first step in finding any of them is to have an ordinary country for them to have the luxury of being ordinary in. Even with an ordinary country, good luck defining who is ordinary.

Ordinary. I imagine many people define it differently.

Ordinary definition - commonplace or standard, usual.

So again who knows what the commonplace or standard individual thinks. Society is a collection of individuals. I'd imagine most don't want endless war and death and destruction. Without voting or opinion polls then who knows. Would Hamas actually allow voting or people to express their free will though.

OP posts:
RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 14:23

localnotail · 31/05/2026 10:45

I think its a very interesting subject, OP, and one that is being supressed for some reason - as you can see on this thread, if you try to discuss the role of Hamas in Gaza society you get instantly shouted at being pro-Israel aggression and shame on you etc etc.

If we move away from what is going on between Gaza and Israel, I think its important to understand how much ordinary people in Gaza support Hamas ideology. Hamas have taken over every part of Gazan life - they not only in government, they also rule and control education, healthcare, media - everything. Its a bit like what was happening in the USSR - you had no opportunity to know what is really going on as there were no ways for people to speak freely, or for anyone to get any information other than official account. But there were dissidents - and I know there are dissidents from Gaza, who speak against Hamas - but for some reason their voices are not prominent.

What I'd like to know is what the ordinary Palestinians think of Hamas, and how much they support it. There seem to be a LOT of support, but is it willing? Is it all people, or just some?

I do feel very sorry for people of Gaza as sadly I can't see how their situation can improve, its been going on for so long, billions and billions pumped there as aid, negotiations, initiatives - but nothing is changing. I do believe, however, that people who can change the situation are not Western countries, but rather immediate neighbours - who seem to do fuck all and quietly fan the flames of conflict, using it for their own gain.

Edited

Quote : "Hamas have taken over every part of Gazan life - they not only in government, they also rule and control education, healthcare, media - everything."

That is what governments do. Even in the UK, the guv sets the school standards and rules for the news media. The guv sets policy for the NHS.

Yes, you can say Gaza is a single party authoritarian entity ( It's not a state). As such it's control is going to be stricter than in the UK on many things no doubt. I would argue that Gaza is in a state of emergency. And usually that does mean stricter governance.

Twiglets1 · 31/05/2026 14:32

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 13:22

How are you going to define ordinary Palestinians ?

You know what I am going to say now. Pick me an ordinary Brit. Or a dozen. How many of them are going to agree on stuff.

There does appear to be a thing where some peoples are all lumped together. Hamas do terror, Hamas runs Gaza, therefore all Gazans are terrorists.

And yes, Gaza is a single party authoritarian state. Except it is not a State. Now we insert "freedom fighter" rather than terrorist. Then someone says " but freedom fighters do not bomb busses or rape women". And that is fair enough, esp the latter. Except of course, pretty much all wars of independence have involved Guerrilla warfare. So it all gets confusing. Lets throw in the West Bank too.

But yet the picture is painted by many that all Gazans are terrorists.

Ordinary Palestinians? I suppose the first step in finding any of them is to have an ordinary country for them to have the luxury of being ordinary in. Even with an ordinary country, good luck defining who is ordinary.

It's a strange thing whereby no one on the pro Israel side ever says "all Gazans are terrorists" on MN but it is often said by those on the pro Palestinian side speaking for those on the pro Israel side.

It should be something we can all agree on - all Gazans are not terrorists.

Doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss the fact that Hamas is deeply embedded in the fabric of Gazan society and this makes peace/reconstruction/a 2 state solution harder.

Twiglets1 · 31/05/2026 14:33

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 13:50

Ordinary. I imagine many people define it differently.

Ordinary definition - commonplace or standard, usual.

So again who knows what the commonplace or standard individual thinks. Society is a collection of individuals. I'd imagine most don't want endless war and death and destruction. Without voting or opinion polls then who knows. Would Hamas actually allow voting or people to express their free will though.

I can't see Hamas allowing a fair vote or for people to express their free will.

Would love to be proved wrong, obviously.

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 15:18

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 13:50

Ordinary. I imagine many people define it differently.

Ordinary definition - commonplace or standard, usual.

So again who knows what the commonplace or standard individual thinks. Society is a collection of individuals. I'd imagine most don't want endless war and death and destruction. Without voting or opinion polls then who knows. Would Hamas actually allow voting or people to express their free will though.

Quote : "Would Hamas actually allow voting or people to express their free will though."

Do you mean if an amazing thing happened and the whole of Palestine become a state etc ?

I think the international pressure on them would be massive. For sure there will be factions that will remain. Some will want an Islamic state, but I can't see the international community being ok with that.

There might even be HAMAS V HEZBOLLA factions develop. Sunni v Shia stuff, but they will be small, and decrease over time.

There will be "Anti Israel no matter what" factions too.

But whatever is predicted, removal of the root cause has to come first, So two states first. Get the factions into a decreasing size cycle, rather than non stop bombing that can only feed an increase in resistance.

Good Friday rather than more oppression.

ETA. When I say removal of the root cause, I don't mean the removal of Israel. I mean the root cause of the Palestinians having no state.

TheBlueKoala · 31/05/2026 15:31

I understand both sides tbh. They both feel repressed by the other side. I think they will never be able to live in peace next to each other.

Mantanora · 31/05/2026 15:46

TheBlueKoala · 31/05/2026 15:31

I understand both sides tbh. They both feel repressed by the other side. I think they will never be able to live in peace next to each other.

They used to a while ago.

Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 16:13

RedTagAlan · 31/05/2026 15:18

Quote : "Would Hamas actually allow voting or people to express their free will though."

Do you mean if an amazing thing happened and the whole of Palestine become a state etc ?

I think the international pressure on them would be massive. For sure there will be factions that will remain. Some will want an Islamic state, but I can't see the international community being ok with that.

There might even be HAMAS V HEZBOLLA factions develop. Sunni v Shia stuff, but they will be small, and decrease over time.

There will be "Anti Israel no matter what" factions too.

But whatever is predicted, removal of the root cause has to come first, So two states first. Get the factions into a decreasing size cycle, rather than non stop bombing that can only feed an increase in resistance.

Good Friday rather than more oppression.

ETA. When I say removal of the root cause, I don't mean the removal of Israel. I mean the root cause of the Palestinians having no state.

Edited

I agree with this, start with 2 states but hasn't this been proposed and turned down several times before? So keep proposing it until the controlling governance of Gaza ie Hamas agree to finally try it. Also, getting the governance of Israel to agree now (they have agreed before) after such a large terrorist attack won't be easy. A new government might wish to look at a longer term solution.

Why wasn't the international pressure massive before to work to a 2 state solution. Why has the situation been allow to fester, with no solution and Gazans reduced to living on aid for a lifetime or more.

I'm sure you are right, there will be factions and some terrorist groups will fight it out with other terrorist groups as appears to be the way.

OP posts:
Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 16:13

TheBlueKoala · 31/05/2026 15:31

I understand both sides tbh. They both feel repressed by the other side. I think they will never be able to live in peace next to each other.

I hope you are wrong.

OP posts:
Ihatetomatoes · 31/05/2026 16:14

TheBlueKoala · 31/05/2026 15:31

I understand both sides tbh. They both feel repressed by the other side. I think they will never be able to live in peace next to each other.

Various contries around Israel went to war with Israel after it was formed. They have worked towards peace for the good of themselves and Israel.

OP posts: