Is the penny finally starting to drop about anti semitism and hate marches?

[mids2019]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/may/04/starmer-c al l-society-response-rising-antisemitism

I think we are now seeing the cumulative impact of the anti senitism that has built up over the last 3 years where there has been a permissive environment with politicians hesitant to intervene in events in the streets that have incubated anti Jew sentiment.

All political parties apart from the hate apologist Greens are now waking up to the fact we need better policing and perhaps legislation. I for one will acting a vote for a party that recognises hate marches for what they are and also willing to tackle the vile posts appearing on social media (and Labour have reacted too late too little). Enough is enough for a Jewish community that lives in perpetual fear.

No, I don't.

Do you agree with her that October 7th was proportional, or maybe less than proportional? And that Hamas are resistance fighters who if they succeed in their aim will one day be viewed as heroes? And - as per her instagram post about Anne Frank - what's happening in Gaza is akin to the Holocaust?

I cannot imagine Gaza prosperity as long as Hamas remain.

Hamas are already the leaders in gaza, the terrorists are the governance of Gaza. So yes hamas can be 'leaders'. They can lead gaza into conflict by a massive terrorist attack of rape, murder, torture and kidnap. Didn't help their countryfolk much though, just led them into a massive conflict, I mean who'd support that! Anyone that supports that type of 'resistance' obviously doesn't have the best interests of ordinary people at their heart.

Indeed, others supporting terrorist action have become leaders
However, hamas already govern Gaza.....

Really, it certainly reads like she feels it's 'proportional' or 'not portional enough'. I guess the vote of no confidence tabled would suggest some might not agree with her view.

Personally, I think all students, including Jewish students should feel safe and welcome at Oxford.

She never said it was inevitable. Read her comment more carefully.

For those terrorists who do become seen as freedom fighters or get voted as politicians- they were initially seen are terrorists until they achieved their aims, and then they were lauded - at least by some.

But we know history was previously written by the victors.

Social media equalises the propaganda machine.

Yes - I can completely see that this is awful for Jewish students.

But how does that square with Palestinians wanted to speak about the injustices they see at present and historically?

I don’t know the answer to that.

I have read it carefully.

In a conversation about Hamas she said

Any resistance group will inevitably be deemed a 'terrorist' organisation by the West until they achieve their liberation (by which time, they'll be lauded as heroes, as history has repeatedly proven).

Any resistance group - Including Hamas
will inevitably be deemed a 'terrorist' (in quotes) organisation by the West - Hamas are deemed terrorists.
Until they achieve their liberation
(by which time they'll be lauded as heroes)

If you are going to try to argue that she isn't saying that Hamas are incorrectly categorised as 'terrorists' by the West and will eventually, once they achieve their goal be lauded as heroes, then I don't think you have read it carefully enough.

There's enough of this 'Hamas are freedom fighters not terrorists, just like Nelson Mandela' crap going around that it's fairly straightforward to understand what she is saying.

It is possible to speak about injustices without the need to suggest that 'resistance' carried out of October 7th (rape, torture, murder, kidnapping) is 'proportional' or 'not proportional enough '. It's pretty easy to do so, and really doesn't take much effort at all.

Listen: Palestinians face many injustices, but I don’t condone the terrorist actions of October 7th.

That was very easy.

Are the Irgun regarded as heroes by most people in the west?

I'd bet most people in the West have never heard of them, let alone actually call heroes!

This is her view - using her words:

"I think the severity of resistance is often proportional to the severity of oppression”

Do you think this is controversial? I find this difficult but can see different sides.

"This is not to justify anything, but just to point out that it's quite rich to allow for decades of systematic oppression and massacres, only to act shocked when the resistance movement responds with proportional severity."

She is saying that the attack was awful too.

When she talks about some seeing it as less proportional, perhaps she is seeing it over the historical context- how do you compare the suffering objectively over decades? It’s impossible as suffering in itself is a subjective experience.

”Proportional does not mean 'right' by the way, just that [you] can't be shocked that it happened."

From her point of view - after decades of oppression she feels like people shouldn’t be surprised that something of this nature happened. She’s not condoning it- she’s just not surprised it happened.

Can this not be said out aloud?

She’s not condoning it but she is suggesting that the perpetrators will eventually be seen as heroes….

Maybe they will by some?
I am sure Palestinians have very mixed views about Hamas.

She says by the West. The ones who previously designated them as (quote marks hers) ‘terrorists’.

She’s basing this on historical fact
one significant one is George Washington

During the American Revolution, the British government classified George Washington and American revolutionaries as terrorists and traitors. Upon winning the war, he was celebrated as the heroic founder of the United States

I mean, we know that some already see them as heroes, she’s not talking about those, she’s talking about the ones who previously designated them as ‘terrorists’.

An oppressed population will regard those who seek to stop oppression not a terrorists but as freedom fighters
Irish Catholic’s didn’t view the IRA as terrorists but as freedom fighters.

A terrorist to one is not the same to all.

Like George Washington then
There’s precedent for her comments. It’s nothing new

You know, people who are completely appalled, horrified, and devastated by the October 7th massacre don’t normally drop into conversation how, like George Washington, the perpetrators of that massacre will eventually be seen as heroes.

That sort of conversation is normally reserved for people who kind of think it was justified.

and your only responce is a personal attack. Using the playbook I see

If you don't think there’s precedent
then prove it

Obviously you can’t
Hence the attack
same old same old

of note
I'm talking about the label terrorist. Not any attack. Wonder why you’ve tried to switch that about

Maybe she was speaking hypothetically. If Hamas were successful (seems extremely unlikely) in creating a Palestinian state.

But it’s completely different to say all their past actions would be condoned though.

I’ve already said that there’s a difference between saying that some people who were previously designated as terrorists who were later lauded as heroes (which is obviously true) and saying that any resistance group (including Hamas) is inevitably designated as ‘terrorists’ by the west and then end up being seen as heroes when they ‘win’.

If this Oxford student thinks that Hamas will eventually be seen as heroes by the West when they are clearly murderous bastards out for themselves who torture and kill Palestinians as easily as Israelis then perhaps we have different ideas of what liberation will look like for the Palestinian people. For me it also means being free of Hamas.

I’m not sure quite why you are so keen to squint and see her comments in a way that is entirely different to how this same old crap spouted by many like her.

Clearly she is saying if Hamas win
historically they will be viewed differently
Historically, that’s not an inaccurate statement

You can throw around terms such as ‘murderous bastards’ as much as you like but it’s all very pointless and adds Nothing to the debate

Prove her comment has no weight
Prove it’s never happened before

The Oxford Students Against Discrimination Group added in a statement that the comments were “a failure of basic humanity, and a betrayal of every Jewish student”.

“Arwa Elrayess has chosen to minimise mass atrocities, argue that terrorist actions are proportional and laud a proscribed terrorist organisation”.

It said the union president was “actively contributing to a culture of fear and exclusion for Jewish members of the university”.

Responding to the messages, a University of Oxford spokesperson stressed the Union was an independent society that was not part of the institution.

“The university does not share or endorse the views attributed to an individual student, nor should they be taken as representative of the University or Oxford students more broadly”, the spokesperson said.

“We are unequivocal in our rejection and condemnation of antisemitism and all forms of hatred and discrimination and continue to work with Jewish students and staff to foster an inclusive environment”

This is the predictable young persons political theory triumph over common sense and joined up thinking and real world knowledge.

Hamas aren't George Washington, Nelson Mandela etc. Hamas are ISIS. There may be some within their fringe ideology who continue to see them as freedom fighters but history will remember them as terrorists who started the war that destroyed Gaza and political fuckwits who did absolutely nothing for the Palestinian cause apart from undermine their case for a State.
Her comment just shows she knows the theory but isn't yet able to apply it correctly. And thats the charitable reading. The uncharitable is that she personally thinks what Hamas did was heroic.