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Conflict in the Middle East

Iranian War Is Not The Same As Iraq

211 replies

HappyFace2025 · 02/03/2026 19:01

Some people seem to think the current war equates to the one in Iraq in the 2000s. It manifestly is not the same.
While Saddam treated Iraqis appallingly as the Islamic Republic has done to Iranians, Iran has been exporting terror throughout the Middle East via its proxies Hamas, Hezbollah and Houtis, as well as elsewhere including the UK, where 20 terrorist attacks were foiled last year (announced yesterday.)

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Alexandra2001 · 03/03/2026 09:46

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 07:56

@Alexandra2001 I agree with you that comparison to Iraq is pointless - as you say, different times, no troops on the ground and a very different regime.

To say the outcome will be worse however is just speculation unless you can see into the future.

And we also have to consider that the outcome of not intervening could equally be worse than intervening, if we are speculating.

Edited

Well, its all "speculation" isn't it?

Seeing into the future.... is the whole point of a discussion forum.

A limited strike, such as done earlier on Nuke facilities only, yes... this however is the aim of destroying the regime but of course those 1m soldiers, the clerics and all the proxies will all be there....

Europe/UK will be paying the price of this action for years to come & its not "seeing into the future" to believe we will see a mass movement of peoples from war torn Iran to other countries, inc the UK.

Russia will be rubbing their hands in glee, China India et al will all be buying more of their oil/gas and at far higher prices, its almost as if Trump is acting hand in hand with Putin....

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:08

Cannot be bothered with conspiracy theories or pure speculation.

But yes it’s a discussion forum so you’re right, other people may like to discuss them.

quantumbutterfly · 03/03/2026 10:16

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 03/03/2026 06:06

People talk about plans for after the war - how do we know what plans may or may not be in place after the war? Did Britain have a plan for after the war when they went to war with Germany? Maybe they did I don’t know - or maybe they just felt the Nazi regime had to fall.

Not in the same sense, because the two situations aren't in any way similar and can't really be compared.

The US and Israel clearly want regime change in Iran, and while that was an obvious end goal of war against Nazi Germany, Britain did not initiate a conflict with Nazi Germany for the express purpose of toppling that regime. Indeed, in 1939 when war was declared, and certainly through 1942, there was no real certainty that Britain was going to prevail and have to consider what to do with post-war Germany in any case. WWII was a war of eradication, from the US and Israeli perspective at least, this action against Iran is not. The US clearly and understandably believes that if it had a mind to see it to conclusion it would ultimately prevail in a conflict with Iran, so it can think right now in terms of "what will we do after we win?". That's a wholly different proposition from the situation Britain faced in the first half of WWII or the Soviets were facing in 1941-43, because at those points in time they were fighting purely to survive and not really contemplating what to do post-victory.

From 1943 onwards that changed, and more and more thought was given to what on earth the victorious nations were going to do with the defeated ones, but even through the late 40s there wasn't always a consensus and it led to ongoing occupation, division, and the advent of things like the Berlin Wall and the Cold War.

Interestingly though, at the very first face-to-face meeting between Churchill, Roosevelt, and Josef Stalin, Stalin pitched up and immediately enquired as to what the others planned to do once they had destroyed the Nazi regime 😀

Well TBF he'd had a bit of practice overthrowing an existing regime, his methods involved millions of deaths and some rewriting of history from what I've heard, oh and the holodomor, but he did manage to get people behind his cause
If we want to go back to lessons from ww2 the word appeasement comes up a lot, that allowed the sacrifice of millions of Jews by the third Reich, headed by another chap who managed to get people behind the cause.
I doubt anyone here has the answers.

Alexandra2001 · 03/03/2026 10:21

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:08

Cannot be bothered with conspiracy theories or pure speculation.

But yes it’s a discussion forum so you’re right, other people may like to discuss them.

All your posts are about speculation and what if's.... from how much Uranium to what they will do or not etc etc.

So why reply... but then i recognised the name.

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:25

HappyFace2025 · 02/03/2026 19:01

Some people seem to think the current war equates to the one in Iraq in the 2000s. It manifestly is not the same.
While Saddam treated Iraqis appallingly as the Islamic Republic has done to Iranians, Iran has been exporting terror throughout the Middle East via its proxies Hamas, Hezbollah and Houtis, as well as elsewhere including the UK, where 20 terrorist attacks were foiled last year (announced yesterday.)

But Iraq under Saddam Hussein invaded Iran.
The Iraqi invasion of Iran lasted 8 years and left a million dead.

Saddam also had the Israeli ambassador to the UK assassinated by using the PLO (Hamas is PLO 2.0) as a proxy to give the Israelis an excuse to attack the Syrian Palestinian refugee camps in Golan Heights seizing those Syrian Lands and causing several massacres of Palestinian civilians.

Saddam also armed a Christian militia led by Aloun to destabilise Syria’s occupation of parts of Lebanon,

Then Saddam invaded and annexed Kuwait, kicking off the US war with Iraq over oil.

How is that so different from Iran destabilising the region?

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:28

SharonEllis · 02/03/2026 19:12

Completely agree. People are incredibly naive, at best, about the nature and reach of the Iranian regime.

and you seem to have completely forgotten the nature and reach of the Iraqi regime from 1975-1995

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:31

Bringemout · 03/03/2026 05:55

Also the way Iran is lobbing ballistic missiles and drones at neighbouring countries who absolutely did not take part in the action against them and wouldn’t allow their soil to be used tells you a lot about the IRCG and no it’s not just US bases, it’s hotels, apartment buildings, airports, civilian infrastructure.

What does it tell you? After all Israel and the US have been doing exactly that for years in the region too.

Day before yesterday we hit a primary school and killed 65 mostly young children. We have the technology to not hit schools full of children. What’s that say about us?

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:35

Alexandra2001 · 03/03/2026 10:21

All your posts are about speculation and what if's.... from how much Uranium to what they will do or not etc etc.

So why reply... but then i recognised the name.

How much uranium Iran has comes from the horse's mouth (Iran)

As a reminder: “In that first meeting, both the Iranian negotiators said to us directly — with no shame — that they controlled 460 kilograms of 60% [enriched uranium] and that they’re aware that could make 11 nuclear bombs,” Witkoff recalls in an interview with Fox News.

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:35

BendoftheBeginning · 03/03/2026 07:07

Given there’s been no nuclear response from Iran, it’s blindingly obvious their possession of any serious weaponry has been greatly exaggerated. This is just Iraq (and Afghanistan, and Libya) all over again and it will turn out the same way: quick air victory, long term utter failure with unforeseen consequences we’ll be dealing with for decades.

Completely agree. More extreme, bitter anti-west leaders will replace the ones assassinated. The Taliban rule of Afghanistan before we invaded was a kinder, gentler rule than the new more harsh Taliban rule that has emerged once we abandoned Afghanistan.

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:37

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:31

What does it tell you? After all Israel and the US have been doing exactly that for years in the region too.

Day before yesterday we hit a primary school and killed 65 mostly young children. We have the technology to not hit schools full of children. What’s that say about us?

Edited

Has it been definitively decided which country hit the school?

I've heard different people say it was Iran, it was Israel, it was the US.

Do any of us actually know at this stage?

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:39

Dabralor · 03/03/2026 07:37

There is a similarity though in how the endgame of this is being approached.
The campaign in Iraq was rightfully criticised because of the critical lack of strategy in terms of what came next after saddam was toppled.
There seems to be no defined objective here either so there is the same risk of mission creep and protracted instability.

This is my biggest concern too. You can’t liberate an entire nation by assassinating its leader and bombing it to pieces. We’ve tried that, in the ME with Iran’s neighbours and it’s never once ended better than it started.

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:41

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:37

Has it been definitively decided which country hit the school?

I've heard different people say it was Iran, it was Israel, it was the US.

Do any of us actually know at this stage?

Who else was bombing Iran?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/missile-strike-school-iran-us-israel-b2930011.html

Of course US & Israel are going to say no comment. That’s the same as an admission.

What we know about missile strike on school in Iran after reports at least 165 killed

Unesco condemned the attack as a ‘grave violation of humanitarian law’

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/missile-strike-school-iran-us-israel-b2930011.html

RedTagAlan · 03/03/2026 10:41

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 07:03

The issue with Iran is not that we think they have nuclear weapons now it is that, despite earlier denials, they appear to be actively seeking to develop the capability to build a bomb.

Which would be disastrous for Israel in particular, given they want to destroy the country.

For sure. And that is why we had the 2015 anti nuke deal. The one that Trump tore up.

EasternStandard · 03/03/2026 10:44

RedTagAlan · 03/03/2026 10:41

For sure. And that is why we had the 2015 anti nuke deal. The one that Trump tore up.

Without answering with a reference to anyone else how much do you trust the Iranian regime?

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:48

As if the incoming Iranian regime will be any more ‘trustworthy’ or left in peace.
Syria is still being bombed, civilians massacred and lands are slowly being annexed by Israeli military despite the fall of Assad and that awful regime being toppled.

If ME history is any lesson, the chaos that follows explosive liberation from the skies is often worse than the oppression that came before for the everyday person. It also radicalises another generation to hate the West and sows the seeds for future terror.

EasternStandard · 03/03/2026 10:52

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:48

As if the incoming Iranian regime will be any more ‘trustworthy’ or left in peace.
Syria is still being bombed, civilians massacred and lands are slowly being annexed by Israeli military despite the fall of Assad and that awful regime being toppled.

If ME history is any lesson, the chaos that follows explosive liberation from the skies is often worse than the oppression that came before for the everyday person. It also radicalises another generation to hate the West and sows the seeds for future terror.

Edited

This isn’t an answer on how much you trust the current regime.

What do you think the Iranian people should do?

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:58

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:41

Who else was bombing Iran?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/missile-strike-school-iran-us-israel-b2930011.html

Of course US & Israel are going to say no comment. That’s the same as an admission.

Even Iran are not pretending to know which country did it - they are blaming both the US and Israel though.

The US military's Central Command said it was looking into reports of the incident, while Israel's military said it was "not aware" of any IDF operations in the area.

Secretary of State Marco Rubio said U.S. forces "would not deliberately target a school" which seems obvious but apparently isn't to some people.

Meanwhile, some Iranians directly blamed their own regime for the attack.
One user wrote: "Even if the regime did not directly target schools, the deaths of children in Minab remain the responsibility of the Islamic Republic.
"People have no shelters, the internet is cut, phone lines are down, and there has been no warning to keep children out of school. In these conditions, the minimum requirement should be to stay at home."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1l7rvqq51eo

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 11:02

RedTagAlan · 03/03/2026 10:41

For sure. And that is why we had the 2015 anti nuke deal. The one that Trump tore up.

And that was wrong of Trump.

But harping back to that does not really help solve the problem that despite earlier denials, Iran now appear to be actively seeking to develop the capability to build nuclear bombs.

1dayatatime · 03/03/2026 11:05

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:41

Who else was bombing Iran?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/missile-strike-school-iran-us-israel-b2930011.html

Of course US & Israel are going to say no comment. That’s the same as an admission.

Curious how you know for sure that it was the Israelis or Americans that did this? And how you know that it wasn't for example an Iranian SAM falling back down or a malfunctioning Iranian drone or missile launch.

Can you please share your evidence on this?

Bringemout · 03/03/2026 11:23

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:48

As if the incoming Iranian regime will be any more ‘trustworthy’ or left in peace.
Syria is still being bombed, civilians massacred and lands are slowly being annexed by Israeli military despite the fall of Assad and that awful regime being toppled.

If ME history is any lesson, the chaos that follows explosive liberation from the skies is often worse than the oppression that came before for the everyday person. It also radicalises another generation to hate the West and sows the seeds for future terror.

Edited

Do you remember that time when everyone thought Israel had bombed a hospital carparking lot full of very visible civilians and it turned out to be islamic jihad? By the time the truth came out the lie had already run all over the world.
I wouldn’t be so quick to ascribe blame here given that Iranians are saying that iranian state tv said the iranians may have done it by accident, it’s a primary school besides a military post. The Israelis or the americans may very well be responsible, but we just don’t actually know that yet. I would also point out that it’s a bit hypocritical to be upset about the deaths of children in a school but not the sheer number of teenagers killed by the regime over decades as well as all those who were recently shot in the street and then hunted down in hospitals to be shot there or kidnapped and then raped so badly their bodies had their reproductive organs removed before they were returned to their parents.

Also, syria is riven with sectarianism and tribalism their leader has his hands full of al-qaeda recruits that came to join him when he was head of al nusra (from all sorts of countries) , also the problem of mentalist turks. As I said before Iranians are not arabs, they have their own language and culture, they do have ethnic diversity but they have nothing like the inter communal hostility you see in many other arab countries. Nobody would seriously say Turks are exactly the same as Saudis so why people can’t understand that Iranians and Arabs may be different is a bit bewildering.

Israel annexed land because a man who was literally al-qadea is now in charge if their neighbouring country. It is reasonable to create a buffer zone, also don’t forget a lot of those buffer zones involve druze, who as you pointed out are some of those civilians being massacred, only Israeli help kept some of those people alive. But perhaps they should have just left them to it…. Maybe the wrong kind of civilian to care about?

The difference here is that Iranians have been asking for help, they are singing and dancing in the streets, why do you think the Iranian diaspora is so bloody insistent about this? The messages coming out are things like “ if i die in an airstrike I’m fine with it, don’t use my death to blame the west”. I’m seeing a lot of that on twitter. 30’000 + protesters didn’t die trying to protect the IRCG, only people in the west seem radicalised by the toppling of an autocratic, imperialist, woman hating regime. Your average iranian seems pretty pleased with these developments.

Boolabus · 03/03/2026 11:24

Twiglets1 · 03/03/2026 10:58

Even Iran are not pretending to know which country did it - they are blaming both the US and Israel though.

The US military's Central Command said it was looking into reports of the incident, while Israel's military said it was "not aware" of any IDF operations in the area.

Secretary of State Marco Rubio said U.S. forces "would not deliberately target a school" which seems obvious but apparently isn't to some people.

Meanwhile, some Iranians directly blamed their own regime for the attack.
One user wrote: "Even if the regime did not directly target schools, the deaths of children in Minab remain the responsibility of the Islamic Republic.
"People have no shelters, the internet is cut, phone lines are down, and there has been no warning to keep children out of school. In these conditions, the minimum requirement should be to stay at home."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1l7rvqq51eo

would not deliberately target
That word deliberately is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that sentence....

which seems obvious but apparently isn't to some people.
Agree it seems obvious but I think we disagree on what seems obvious

Bringemout · 03/03/2026 11:31

I would also point out that Iranians are posting pictures of basjis setting operations up from school sites. So it would not be surprising to see a school targeted. HOWEVER, there is zero benefit to killing kids. In any cold hard calculation there is no way Israel or the USA would just be murdering children for the hell of it, it costs money to drop bombs, every single one counts and pissing off Iranians does not benefit them at all.

If you believe they would do it because they are just evil then you are suffering from a level of stupidity no-one can help you with.

Ihatetomatoes · 03/03/2026 11:37

SummerFeverVenice · 03/03/2026 10:31

What does it tell you? After all Israel and the US have been doing exactly that for years in the region too.

Day before yesterday we hit a primary school and killed 65 mostly young children. We have the technology to not hit schools full of children. What’s that say about us?

Edited

Are you American or Israeli? Who's we?

Ihatetomatoes · 03/03/2026 11:39

Bringemout · 03/03/2026 11:23

Do you remember that time when everyone thought Israel had bombed a hospital carparking lot full of very visible civilians and it turned out to be islamic jihad? By the time the truth came out the lie had already run all over the world.
I wouldn’t be so quick to ascribe blame here given that Iranians are saying that iranian state tv said the iranians may have done it by accident, it’s a primary school besides a military post. The Israelis or the americans may very well be responsible, but we just don’t actually know that yet. I would also point out that it’s a bit hypocritical to be upset about the deaths of children in a school but not the sheer number of teenagers killed by the regime over decades as well as all those who were recently shot in the street and then hunted down in hospitals to be shot there or kidnapped and then raped so badly their bodies had their reproductive organs removed before they were returned to their parents.

Also, syria is riven with sectarianism and tribalism their leader has his hands full of al-qaeda recruits that came to join him when he was head of al nusra (from all sorts of countries) , also the problem of mentalist turks. As I said before Iranians are not arabs, they have their own language and culture, they do have ethnic diversity but they have nothing like the inter communal hostility you see in many other arab countries. Nobody would seriously say Turks are exactly the same as Saudis so why people can’t understand that Iranians and Arabs may be different is a bit bewildering.

Israel annexed land because a man who was literally al-qadea is now in charge if their neighbouring country. It is reasonable to create a buffer zone, also don’t forget a lot of those buffer zones involve druze, who as you pointed out are some of those civilians being massacred, only Israeli help kept some of those people alive. But perhaps they should have just left them to it…. Maybe the wrong kind of civilian to care about?

The difference here is that Iranians have been asking for help, they are singing and dancing in the streets, why do you think the Iranian diaspora is so bloody insistent about this? The messages coming out are things like “ if i die in an airstrike I’m fine with it, don’t use my death to blame the west”. I’m seeing a lot of that on twitter. 30’000 + protesters didn’t die trying to protect the IRCG, only people in the west seem radicalised by the toppling of an autocratic, imperialist, woman hating regime. Your average iranian seems pretty pleased with these developments.

This.

Katiesaidthat · 03/03/2026 11:42

While I agree in theory. If they topple the regime, what are they going to replace it with? Isis or the Whatevers of the Levant, like Irak or Syria? Ask the Kurds or the Yahzidis how that went. Where are all these democrats, who will build this paragon of democracy in Iran coming from? Another terror story is Afganistan. Western intervention has never brought anything good to the area. I am very sceptical.