Triggernometry - interview with Netanyahu

[Digitalhen]

Thoughts on this interview?

Massive scoop for the Trigger podcast.

We are outnumbered on the board BUT our posts aren't littered with personal attacks and childish retorts. It's impossible to have a discussion when you're faced with that.

Right ladies, I really need to get my house sorted. Have got visitors tomorrow x

After the atrocities of WW2 why weren't Jewish people given a part of Germany to call their State?

Have any of you watched The Flat - it's about a man who returns to Israel to clear out his grandparents apartment and he learns things about his grandparents and the Nazis that is fascinating. It gives you a bit of insight into how things evolved.

m.imdb.com/title/tt2071620/

Oh yes the old "morally bankrupt" insult, I've had that too. Along with lacking humanity, liking the idea of Palestinian children starving etc.

Interesting to see the hate that exists (normally just in people's minds) towards anyone that dares to defend Israel at all. Even towards those of us like me who will also criticise the Israel government and IDF on occasion.

I’d like to see that - just watched the trailer. Doesn’t appear to be available on any UK streaming platforms though.

In World War 2 unjustifiable war crimes were committed to the point that legislation was drawn up to stop things like this happening again. The EU was founded to stop situations like that occurring in Europe again. The ordinary Germans were not all guilty of the Nazis war crimes but they were starved and treated poorly in the wake of WW2. Read or watch some videos by Harry Leslie Smith, he lived it, I saw him once break down in tears on stage talking about the hunger Germans faces after WW2. They weren’t locked into a small landmass and bombed like fish in a barrel though.

At the end of the day you can not justify murder because someone murdered people in the past. Two wrongs don’t make a right - just because there was one genocide it doesn’t mean there should be another. The Nazi’s were wrong with their master race and desire to expand, Zionists are wrong with their chosen people and desire to create a Greater Israel. It is all wrong. We are all the same flesh and blood and have a right to life and NO ONE has a right or justification to take that away. No one is better than anyone else. It is just as unforgivable to bomb Palestinian hospitals as it would be to bomb Israeli ones.

I can only think that at least some of you are Israeli based and have grown up being indoctrinated or are Hasbara Fellows or part of one of the many social media initiatives that Israel has going on because some of you will defend anything that Israel does, you are so focused on defending Israel no matter what happens that you are dehumanising an entire group of people just as jewish people were dehumanised in the 1930s and 40s; you are making them less than, saying it’s okay to kill them because they are x,y,z. I have to think this as I can not see how people who have grown up in the UK or EU could see the news I am seeing, see the pictures of emaciated dead children and say it is justified, to say it is a war. A war with only one army levelling cities, with only one side burying their dead as citizens of the other side go on cruises, enjoy dinners by the beach, go on social media.

Jewish people were once dehumanised and murdered, this was not okay; dehumanisation and murder is NEVER okay!

I asked you first, I’ll answer as soon as you do.

You never answer questions though do you, you find a word or a sentence that has nothing to do with the argument at hand and try to bring the conversation a different direction.

After the atrocities of WW2 why weren't Jewish people given a part of Germany to call their State?

Israel had already already declared itself a state by the time the dust had settled. There was already a large Jewish population and essentially a state within a state in the region well before the end of WW2.

Although territory wasn’t removed from Germany after the war to be given specifically to the Jewish people, Germany was occupied and did lose territory to surrounding countries, resulting in millions of Germans being forcibly expelled from their homes.

The Nazi’s were wrong with their master race and desire to expand, Zionists are wrong with their chosen people and desire to create a Greater Israel.

Can you clarify what you mean by the above @RandomWordsThrownTogether?

It sounds like you are comparing Jewish people with Nazis in wanting to create their own State.

I can assure you from the river to the sea very much has something to do with eradicating Gaza. As you've not answered, I can conclude you can read between the lines when it comes to eradicating Palestine, but you won't do when it comes to Isrsel being wiped off the map. I thought as much.

She doesn't understand the meaning of free Palestine, so that one will certainly be lost.

Here we go - again. The thing is, you talk about us seeing only one side but that's exactly what you are doing. Again, the holocaust is being used - there is no bloody comparison. 7/10 was the second biggest genocide Jews have faced. History also hasn't been left behind so yes, it does dictate what is happening now.

I can only think that at least some of you are Israeli based and have grown up being indoctrinated or are Hasbara Fellows or part of one of the many social media initiatives that Israel has going on because some of you will defend anything that Israel does, you are so focused on defending Israel no matter what happens that you are dehumanising an entire group of people just as jewish people were dehumanised in the 1930s and 40s; you are making them less than, saying it’s okay to kill them because they are x,y,z. I have to think this as I can not see how people who have grown up in the UK or EU could see the news I am seeing, see the pictures of emaciated dead children and say it is justified, to say it is a war.

I’m from the UK. Christian and of Irish descent.

Not one person has said it is okay to kill anyone.

Not one person has said anything is justified.

This is, however, a war. And this is what happens in war. Israel is not an outlier.

It is not surprising to see these kind of comments being levelled against others on this board. It’s quite typical, actually.

I don’t feel like I am defending Israel, but I do understand the terrible position they are in and that they have been forced into since their inception.

A war with only one army levelling cities, with only one side burying their dead as citizens of the other side go on cruises, enjoy dinners by the beach, go on social media.

A war where one side has a massive tunnel network built below them, but won’t allow their civilians to take shelter in it.

I am not comparing jewish people with anything - there are many Christian Zionists and many jewish people opposed to Zionism.

You know what I am referring to when I reference the chosen people. 56% of Israelis polled by Haaretz agreed with the statement that jewish people are chosen people, this figure rose to 79% among people who profess themselves to be right wing. Obviously this may is from a random selection of people and may be a few percentage off if you asked the entire population.

The ideology of one group of people being chosen by God is not that dissimilar to the horrendous thinking behind a Master race - it puts one group as above everyone else, imagine being chosen by God, you could do no wrong, you could use it to justify burning down people’s houses, shooting them, stealing their land as settlers do on a day to day basis.

Just this week Netanyahu said he believes in Greater Israel, this is part of the same ideology where jewish people are “chosen people” and their homeland will include Gaza, the West Bank, Jordan and many other places.

Zero comparison to the Holocaust.

I get a visceral reaction every time I see a poster try and draw some kind of equivalent.

Disgusting.

Again no answer. As you've not answered, I can conclude you can agree with ambitions for a Greater Israel that includes the West Bank and Gaza. I thought as much.

The ideology of one group of people being chosen by God is not that dissimilar to the horrendous thinking behind a Master race - it puts one group as above everyone else, imagine being chosen by God, you could do no wrong, you could use it to justify burning down people’s houses, shooting them, stealing their land as settlers do on a day to day basis.

And the comparisons of Jewish people to Nazi’s just keep on coming!

Not all jewish people believe they are chosen, not all jewish people are Zionists.

Absolutely meaningless comment.

Hamas ARE the Nazis in both ideology and intent. Hamas’s founding charter openly calls for the destruction of Israel and promotes violent antisemitism reminiscent of the darkest chapters of the 20th century. This is not without historical precedent: during World War II, prominent Arab leaders such as the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem didn’t just actively collaborate with the Nazi regime, they were honorary SS officers.

In the 1960s, thanks to the maleficence Of the Soviet Union and the KGB specifically, a new narrative emerged—one that recast disparate Arab populations as “Palestinians” to advance a political struggle against Israel. This reframing helped shift global perceptions, but the underlying ideology in groups like Hamas remained virulently antisemitic.

Mein Kampf is a coffee table book Gaza —a chilling reminder that this ideology did not die in 1945. Hamas is not merely a political or militant faction; it is the ideological heir to the Third Reich, perpetuating a worldview rooted in hatred, intolerance, and genocidal ambition.

@whitewindowframe I saw it years ago on Netflix. It really is worth a watch of it reappears. It stuck with me.

not forgetting the snidey comments and ‘jokes’ on a thread yesterday.

Yep, agree. Comparing the assault on Dresden against the campaign in Gaza is a real 'Apples and Oranges' exercise. It can't be done. The technology Israel uses eg Joint* Direct Attack *Munition (JDAM) guidance kits makes the comparison meaningless.

But this is true of all religions. Followers of each religion believe that they are essentially the “chosen people”. That they are the ones who will be granted entry to heaven, or whatever they call it.

What’s your point?

You are comparing Jewish ideology to Nazi ideology:

“The ideology of one group of people being chosen by God is not that dissimilar to the horrendous thinking behind a Master race”

You are drawing parallels between Jewish people and Nazis.

The idea that Jewish ideology is a threat, is just not the reality of the world we live in.

Look in the end Netanyahu is defending Israel. I don't think he doing anything most people wouldn't do to protect themselves if they felt under serious threat. Examples from history like the bombing of Dresden just remind of the realities.

If humans didn't ever react with extreme violence when afraid or didn't behave aggressively when it was in their interest, we would not have wars and the atrocities that go with them.

There are two ways to end a war permanently, either by diplomacy or by one side absolutely crushing the other in a way that they have no way to come back from.

The latter is what most often happens because diplomacy can only work If all parties in a war are not so driven by an emotional need get what they want (or need) that they cannot talk to each other. If they could talk to each other and make concessions, they would probably have done so before they went to all out war with each other

So I do understand what Israel is doing but by the same token, it is absolutely right that people outside of that immediate circle of emotions keep calling for better solutions than all out destruction of one side. It is essential that leaders in war are held to account in some way and thst history judges thenlm, otherwise even baser instincts take over. .If we just stand by and say it is OK for Israel to do what it is doing, then we really are lost and they will stop even what they ARE doing to mitigate civilian deaths

Terrible things happen in war but if the people who do those things are not condemned then what hope does the human race have ?

War ia terrible and a price is paid by everyone, If you make decisions that lead to the deaths of many children and innocent civilians during war, no matter how justified you think that is in the circumstances, you should pay a price too. One that means you are condemned by the world for the things you did or decisions you made

That is my view and why I do condemn the Israeli leadership for some of their actions. Otherwise their overriding emotion of fear for their vulnerable position will take over completely and emboldened them to be even more aggressive in their defence of themselves

In the state of Israel today, approximately 2.4 million of the 10 million inhabitants are Palestinians/Arab Israelis. Most are citizens with Israeli passports and have full voting rights. I genuinely think that if Israel wanted a ‘genocide’, surely it would have started by expelling (or worse!) the Palestinians who already live within the borders of Israel?

The idea of ‘Greater Israel’ is not about exterminating non-Jews who live there but about politically and geographically expanding boundaries. The moral rights and wrongs of that can probably go back to biblical times and is a much bigger discussion. The concept is not about killing people though.

From the river to the sea has an entirely different meaning. It is about blitzing Israel off the map. I only know this because that’s what Hamas (and other similarly minded groups) have openly said.

So for me the difference is:
2.4 million Palestine’s/Arab Israelis live currently in Israel.
In Gaza/West Bank (not including disputed areas where the settlers are, for the time being) there are zero (or at least very few recorded) Jews or Israelis.

The difference is that as a Palestinian wanting to work and live peacefully within Israel, you can, whereas living as a Jew or Israeli within the West Bank or Gaza would end in your murder.

As before, I want to restate this is not a justification for war, war crimes or the awful, awful suffering of innocent people. It’s just a different perspective and perhaps naively, I am here to see it from all points of view.