A famine has been declared in Gaza city

[SaltAirAndTheRust]

https://news.sky.com/story/gaza-latest-war-israel-city-ceasefire-hamas-13415481

Meanwhile, up to 80,000 troops are being prepared to start an offensive there. There are no longer any words

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@DrPrunesqualer 100 per cent the truth

That
Is
All
This
Ever
Was
ABOUT

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Um, literally everyone?

Thankyou!

I’ve been posting that for nearly two years and surprise surprise no one ever wants to discuss it.
Its good to remind people though I think, we should never forget and we should always try to find the truth.

But WHY is israel held to a higher standard? It is at war with an enemy, so of course it bombs and kills and civilians die. That is literally what happens in all kinetic warfare. That is what happened during WW2 and what saved us from the Nazis. But Israel should kill ‘nicely’?

Hamas has an extensive tunnel network that could hide every single Palestinian and protect them from any air strikes. Hamas has publicly stated it does not allow civilians to hide in the tunnels, only Hamas soldiers. Because they don’t care about them dying. So Israel should treat the Palestine people better than their own leaders do?

Yes… we all seem to agree there’s no logical reason for Israel to target civilians.

What can you possibly say to someone who - believing that - nevertheless thinks they IDF do it anyway?

There’s no response because it isn’t logical but they choose to believe it anyway. Not arguing with stupid comes to mind.

What is it 'all ever about' in your opinion, could you expand a bit? You seem to be over emojiing a poster who thinks this is all a land grab.

Have you heard about Oct 7th and the hostages? Granted we've had pro gazan posters who think the hostages are irrelevant and they are sick of hearing about them.

Do you think that?

Hmmmm

Nonsense. If it was about land they'd have done it ages ago.

If they had done it before Oct 7 they would have had absolutely no sympathy apart from the most ardent Zionists. Oct 7 gave them some kind of justification in the minds of some for their subsequent actions. They could pretend it's not just about the land.

That makes no sense. There has never been more hatred, public disapproval and political pressure on Israel than there is today.

If it was about the land for Israel, then why were Jewish people forcibly removed from Gaza by the IDF in 2005? They were forced to give up everything. They left homes and thriving businesses behind. They dug up their dead.

They did that in attempt to reach peace.

But there won’t be peace, because for one party, it is about the land. All of it. From the River to the Sea.

I do! 🫣 but look there is always a place for healthy debate.

You've got to be joking.
We are told over and over again that all everybody cares about is human suffering. Its completely coincidental that Israel is involved. Everyone just cares about babies dying. All babies, but the situation in Gaza is the worst catastrophe so everyone cares about Gaza the most for that reason and that reason alone.
And yet.
24.6 million people are facing acute hunger and 2 million in famine or at risk, in Sudan.

it was declared a famine last year. Last year. Lots of time to organise a march.

Here is the WFP 'Sudan risks becoming the world’s largest hunger crisis in recent history as conflict continues to rage, destroying livelihoods, infrastructure, trade routes and supply chains.
A protracted famine is taking hold – the only place in the world at this level of hunger.'
Look on all the major agency websites.

Famine in Sudan | World Food Programme share.google/SyBKYe2tvOmt0Jasc

If your social media isn’t clogged with stuff about Sudan, for example, it’s because you haven’t been searching or watching content about Sudan. That’s an issue with your algorithm. I’m sure if you started showing an ‘interest’ (from a SM perspective, I’m not saying you’re not actually interested), your algorithm would flood your feed with relevant videos.

Re MPs, I’m not sure how to gauge the amount of Israel/Gaza related ‘harassment’ they are getting. Is there a measure of this?

And what political party is being founded to advocate for Gaza?

I do agree this conflict has garnered a lot of attention though. When it comes to why that is, I think it’s a combo. It involves the Uk to a certain degree (so the news covers Starmer/Lammy comments) and it involves Trump (who is always on the news for his ‘take’ on things). So coverage is a given.

It’s also been a war of information as well as an armed conflict. Both sides are flooding the internet with their narrative and then there are commentators who respond to it and try to fill in the middle ground/find the truth. The more people read about it, the more it becomes ‘click bate’ and the more it’s written about. It will be interesting to see after this is all over the analysis of propaganda tools used by both sides and the other orgs (NGOS/media companies) trying to wade through it and report as truthfully as possible. To be honest, I think of SM had been more prolific during the Iraq/Afghanistan wars, it would be a similar situation in terms of people being outraged by the suffering of civilians.

It’s a cycle then ends with people protesting and calling out governments. I don’t think you can blame people for not wanting children to be killed or starved. That’s what they are protesting and their focus is aimed at Israel because of the role it has played in that situation. If we focus on just the aid side of things, you cannot cut off aid for weeks then replace a 200+ network of aid with just 4 outposts and not expect people to suffer. Israel can explain why they have made those choices but to deny famine altogether only increases the scrutiny on them. Or if we focus on just what key politicians have said about Gaza, you can’t be surprised that people are disturbed/concerned /outraged.

Sadly, re other areas/countries in desperate situations, I also think certain things have become normalised in our day to day lives. Horrendous images of frail children pop up between This Morning segments, regular charity letters have similar imagery. I think people are somewhat used to hearing about ‘another’ famine in Africa. This is obviously a disturbing and upsetting problem and one we could discuss separately but people aren’t as easily affected by such stories anymore. The difference, I think, with Israel and Gaza is that there is more coverage, more information (and misinformation) so more people have an opinion.

@Montysmoon My point is what NGOs are confirming the fact that there is a famine in Sudan (obviously there is one). I’m wondering whether the sources you trust to report on Sudan are suddenly disreputable when they say the same about Gaza?

I’m sorry but this is so disingenuous. We’re only seeing Israel/palestine on our social media because of our algorithm? Nonsense.

and the new political party is Jeremy Corbyn’s, whose current main aim is to oppose government policy on Gaza.

No, its not an issue with my algorithm. I note that you did not know that a famine had been declared in Sudan last year so I don't really think you are in a position to patronise me.

I have been involved in advocacy for Africa in one way or another for many decades and have close connections with the international aid community. I follow lots of related accounts and read a lot of relevant material online Any fool can see that anything to do with Africa gets little traction and its nothing to do with my algorithm. Speak to anyone involved in development and they will tell you how hard it is to garner sustained engagement.

Please do share with me the viral posts going around social media right now about Sudan - stuff that gets traction with people not related to the cause directly.

As for harassment of MPs, all you need to do is read/listen to the news, talk to MPs and politicians. I take it you haven't heard of 'Your Party' Corbyn's new outfit. Gaza is central to their platform. You won't be aware, I suppose, that 4 independents were elected last year explocitly on pro-Palestinian tickets with Shockat Adam announcing 'This is for the people of Gaza.' When he won.

You don't seem to.understand that the media is a business. It just doesn't wash to say people don't care about Africa and do care about Gaza because there's more coverage. The media doesnt cover Africa because people don't care. The media covers Gaza because people do care.
Now, why is that?

Not a ‘higher standard’. The same international law that applies to all states. WWII also gave us the Geneva Conventions precisely to stop mass civilian targeting being normalised. The fact Hamas is abhorrent doesn’t give Israel a free pass to commit war crimes.

Did you read my whole post? I said more about the volume of information beyond the first few sentences.

I read you whole post. It didn't explain why people are more interested in Gaza than Sudan.

I disagree. The reason that this particular war has gained so much attention is because the world’s only Jewish state is involved and there has been a targeted, and very successful, propaganda campaign to make Israel into a pariah State as a goal of this war.

It cannot be denied, no matter how much people try to, as the evidence is clear.

What do you think is the reason for all the global attacks on Israelis/Jews, including murder and physical violence, being chucked out of restaurants/hairdressers/planes, being prevented from getting into University campuses, being denied visas, protests at cruise ships carrying Israelis, synagogues being attacked, Jewish people feeling they have to hide their Jewish identity, the boycott of Israeli products, health care professionals saying they would kill a Jew if they came in for treatment, etc?

Do we see any of this with the diaspora of any other country at war like Syrians, Sudanese, Somalian, Congolese, Nigerians, Yemeni’s?

Did we see it with Afghans, Iraqis?

The global marches in support of a massive terrorist attack, which was clearly evidenced by them starting on Oct 8th 2023 with a request to hold them in the UK submitted on Oct 7th 2023 while the attack was still going on, with police protection to continue them, would have been largely sickening to most if it was against any other State than Israel.

https://www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/disclosure-2023/november-2023/information-palestine-protest-march-14102023/

No country has a free pass to carry out war crimes, yet they happen in every war. They are an inevitable outcome of conflict.

Such is the nature of war and decision making in war.

It’s not like the IDF are all sitting around a table concocting which war crime they can commit next.

I wish some attention could be given to the war crimes carried out by Hamas, though. There is never any criticism, mention or acknowledgement, of the war crimes carried out in Gaza, by Hamas, to their own civilians.

The fact Hamas is abhorrent doesn’t give Israel a free pass to commit war crimes.

This is what I mean. War crimes are being committed by both sides, yet they are only ever mentioned in relation to Israel.

Also we have had MPs in the UK elected on a pro-Palestinian platform.

Never before have I seen this so blatant in UK politics for any other country or State, and there are many countries and States who could do with the support, who haven’t had a long history of terrorism and who’s government hadn’t just committed one of the worst terrorist attacks on record.

www.newarab.com/news/who-are-uks-five-pro-palestinian-independent-mps?amp

I did know about the famine - I was asking what sources you trust in determining that famine.

Your second agrees with my last paragraph. Some agreement!

Re posts about Sudan, I follow various charities so relevant posts pop up a fair amount on my feed. In terms of ‘viral’ posts, I have no clue. I also couldn’t name one ‘viral’ post about Israel or Gaza. No interest in wasting time on SM viral posts about a war zone. I’m sure there’s a huge overlap with misinformation and viral posts. But as far as I know, Sudan isn’t fighting a war of information/misinformation so there’s a lot less info out there to begin with.

Of course I’ve heard of Your Party and it’s no surprise that it has clear views on Palestine as Corbyn is involved. That’s old news. I don’t think it’s accurate to say it was set up purely re Gaza and Israel. And re the independents, what is wrong with being an MP and pro-Palestinian? Plus that’s not the only thing SA focused on in his campaign.

I can understand being critical or questioning the media’s focus on Gaza. But they are reporting on things actually happening in Gaza. So you could argue that the attention is something to be explored but if that attention exposes war crimes, crimes against humanity etc. that’s still on Israel. They are responsible for those actions/decisions.

Am I right in concluding that you believe everyone only cares about Israel because of antisemitism? Because there are plenty of Jewish people who are just as appalled by the situation in Gaza? Are they suffering some sort of self hatred identity crisis or is there more to this conflict than religion alone.