Israeli security cabinet expected to approve Gaza takeover plan

[Twiglets1]

Sky News report that Israel is expected to approve Benjamin Netanyahu's plan for a takeover of Gaza when the security cabinet meets later today.

According to the Times of Israel, the full cabinet is due to convene at 6pm local time, 4pm in the UK.

Israeli media are reporting that the plan could potentially span over five months, and it is likely to be aimed at destroying Hamas and pressuring it to free remaining hostages.

While some ministers have been critical of the plan, reports suggest Netanyahu is likely to secure a majority of support.

https://news.sky.com/story/gaza-latest-hostages-famine-aid-hamas-idf-war-palestine-state-live-13398805

So how many Jewish terrorist attacks v Extreme Islamic attacks? You and another poster, seem to want to reduce the threat of Islamic terrorism. It's not going to away, hence Israel's military stance.if you are trying to prove jewish terrorism is a global threat, then its not going to work.

No, and it's saying quite a lot tbh, this desperation to prove Jews aren't ŵhiter than white. I haven't said they are - I've said I support them, and think they are ridiculously oppressed. It's others making the inference. You have to wonder why.

If we look at the list of terrorist attacks in the UK and Europe in the 21st century, the vast, vast majority were carried out by Islamists. The only mention of Jewish people, if you read the long wikipedia list, are as victims of the atrocities.

I said the same and my post was deleted. Then they say it's pointless trying to debate with you when " you refuse to face facts". Laughable double standards.

Of course, I did mean to add that at accusing me of Islamophobia is an attempt to shut down another person's perspective. Where have I heard similar?

Which ethnic group kills the most is irrelevant and frankly is bordering on racist tropes again. The point we are making is that human beings are all capable or great and awful things - no race or ethnicity is better or worse. The English army probably has one of the biggest death counts in history and some of the loveliest people I know are English.

Jewish people are not better than Islamic, Catholic or Buddhist people. There are no chosen people or evil people, we have all been created equal. Sociopaths usually have under developed frontal lobes - that is a biological phenomenon that affects empathy and how their brains work - it is not determined by their religious beliefs or their ethnicity. Within any group there are people who tend to follow their leaders and believe what their leaders say and there are free thinkers who challenge that. Atrocities are often committed by people who have been radicalised or manipulated into a certain mindset; past trauma, as we’ve discussed, leaves people more open to radicalisation as does poverty and hardship.

Jewish terrorist’s victims were just as dead as Islamic terrorists victims. The IDF’s victims are just as dead as Hamas’ victims. One thing does not justify the other. One murder is not more or less bad. There is no group of people or religion that has no bad people or no good people.

Which ethnic group kills the most is irrelevant and frankly is bordering on racist tropes again.

No, the last 2.5 decades have had an enormous problem with Islamic extremism, it makes no sense to try and shut that down by talking about "racist tropes":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_terrorism_in_Europe#List_of_attacks

That's just UK/Europe - obviously other continents have been affected. And it's also true that ordinary Muslim people have been victims of these attacks, both in Europe and then obviously in the Middle East overall and specifically in Israel.

This is certainly true and Islamic extremism is definitely an issue. I think what I and others have tried to suggest is that this isn’t all down to Islam being an inherently violent religion or Arab people being more likely to commit violent acts. It doesn’t reflect on this group of people more broadly. The reason why these groups appear and gain traction lies beyond this simplistic argument and extremism can only lose its power if the conditions for it to succeed are dealt with. Why have the US and UK targets for ISIS, for example? Could it, perhaps, be more of an issue because of our role in the Middle East in recent history? That’s uncomfortable context for some but it’s relevant.

Or, to use a totally different example, why are so many extremely violent acts carried out by young white American men on their classmates? It can’t be set aside as some religious war so what other conditions are there in place that make people do terrible acts? Understanding that is how you stop it from happening again.

Putting it down to a mere religious argument, even in the Israel/Gaza scenario takes out so much vital context. If we don’t want groups like Hamas, we have to question why they appear. It’s not an issue with Islam because it’s not unique to Islam. Hence the mentioning of Jewish terrorists or the Crusades or American school shootings. It’s not good enough to conclude that some people/groups/religions are just ‘evil’ or more violent - they are products of an environment and that environment is what needs to be analysed and fixed.

I am defending my position in saying that arabs treated christians and Jews as second class citizens. This was jumped on so it's not racist to talk about terrorism and its actors. It IS racist, to treat another race/religion in the way Jews have been treated - specifically antisemitism. For some reason, that really has touched a nerve. Tough. It's central to this conflict.

I think you are trying to create something that is not there at all. It was never about comparisons.

This all started because you stated there was none and I politely replied there was and this does not reflect on all Jewish people like Islamic terrorists do not reflect on all Muslims.

I never mentioned Islamic terrorism was or wasnt a threat.

Talk about another strawman sound bite "trying to prove Jewish terrorism is a global threat" was never once in any of my posts .

Soundbites? That's rich.

Most religious groups and ethnic groups have been persecuted, in recent times hate speech in the UK has mostly been directed at muslims with tropes about terrorism. Obviously anti semitism has risen in recent years too and this is awful too.

It is also not exactly a walk in the park for christians and muslims in some parts of Israel. My mum saw christian worshipers being spat at in Jerusalem by jewish men in 2019. Spitting at christian worshippers was also covered in one of the recent documentaries on Israel. Settlers have targeted christians as well as muslims! Bigots and racists come in all shapes, sizes, ethnicities and religions.

Most religious groups have been persecuted by another group at one point or another - in Ireland our language was erased and the catholic religion was outlawed. To justify it our physiology was deemed to make us more like apes. In Northern Ireland catholics were not able to live in certain areas or work in certain jobs, it is only in our lifetimes that the Good Friday agreement brought about equal rights. It is still illegal to have a catholic monarch or for a monarch to be married to a catholic in the UK. During the crusades christians slaughtered muslims and committed terrible crimes including rape and murder. Obviously one of the biggest genocides in history was against the jewish people during WW2 and happened because of rampant anti semitism across Europe.

In China the Uyghur are currently being imprisoned, forced into slave labour and there are reports that some have been forcibly sterilised or had organs harvested. Obviously there are the Yazidis who historically have suffered terrible abuses and more recently were murdered and raped by Isis. Christians are being persecuted in various places in the world. None of this gives any group a carte blanc to “defend” itself by blanket bombing civilians.

At the end of the day we are all the same, made of the same blood, organs, bones, microbes etc - most of us have ancestors who were victims of terrible crimes and likely we had ancestors who committed crimes. What is important is what we do and how we treat people - we cannot argue that we are the biggest victims and other groups are the biggest villains to justify horrendous crimes against humanity. If a jewish person shoots or bombs a muslim child it is no different than a muslim shooting or bombing a jewish child. Nothing anyone has done to us or our ancestors gives us an excuse to hurt another living breathing person.

History is important in seeing how circumstances came about and where hatred comes from, it is important to understand history so we don’t commit the same mistakes. We shouldn’t use history to justify hate but more as a tool to understand the roots of where hate and ill will comes from. The rise of Hamas can be understood by looking at other terrorist groups like the IRA - oppressing and killing civilians actually helps these groups flourish and grow as they use trauma to breed hate. Agreeing frameworks which bring about equal rights for all groups is what will being about peace.

Why am I getting flashbacks to the Kneecap thread? All making sense now.

Please dont bring AI here. Use your own words or dont bother.

I ran this text through an AI Scanner and it came back as 100% human.

Really? That surprises me. But ok- I trust your word. Thanks. And sorry.

They must be just a very good writer 🫣 anything I write is clearly not AI (too many years teaching infants!)

There's been quite a few lengthy sermons @dairydebris So I'm not surprised you thought that.

Me too 🥴 not enough apostrophes and poorly constructed sentences. 😬😬😬😬

Really value human voices tho.

Same .All the things I give out to my class for 😬

I don’t think anything being said here is super controversial - it sounds like most of us agree there is extremism (to varying degrees) on both sides and both Israel and whatever leadership takes over from Hamas (who need to go as they are terrorists) need to be more moderate if there is going to be any sort of lasting peace.

If extremism continues to attract followers, Israeli people and Palestinian people will continue to be hurt. Hurt turns to anger. Anger can lead to extremism. The sad cycle continues.

Extremism (in whatever form) takes hold when desperate people feel like they have no options or hope or reasons to live. To avoid this, you need to look at why they feel that way. In the case of Gaza, there is a terrorist government causing enormous suffering and an oppressive neighbour reinforcing the ‘us against them’ narrative. Hamas must go and Israel need to reflect on their role if there’s any hope for a peaceful long term solution.

Just came across this and for me it is more evidence that more moderate voices are needed on both sides of this conflict. In short, Israel plan to increase (illegal) settler housing in an area of the WB. This is from Haaretz but free to read on the bbc: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckgdzxpkdd7o.amp

“Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich praised the plan, calling it "a reality that buries the idea of a Palestinian state, because there's nothing to recognize and no one to recognize it."

"Those in the world trying to recognize a Palestinian state will get an answer from us on the ground," Smotrich said earlier on Thursday, as he announced the plan's impending approval in the West Bank settlement of Ma'ale Adumim. "Not through documents, not through decisions or declarations – but through facts. Facts of homes, neighborhoods, roads and Jewish families building their lives."

He added, "They'll keep talking about a Palestinian dream – and we will continue building a Jewish reality. A reality that buries the idea of a Palestinian state – because there's nothing to recognize and no one to recognize it."

Smotrich thanked Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, saying that "as far as Judea and Samaria are concerned, he supported and enabled me to carry out this revolution over the past two and a half years."

Addressing Netanyahu directly, he said, "The time has come to apply Israeli sovereignty in Judea and Samaria, to permanently remove the idea of dividing the land and to ensure that by September, Europe's hypocritical leaders will have nothing to recognize."

"This isn't just a planning initiative," Smotrich emphasized. "But a resounding Zionist statement: united Jerusalem is our eternal capital, and [the settlement of] Ma'ale Adumim is an inseparable part of it."

Very concerning when combined with their actions in Gaza.

I don’t use AI but thank you for the compliment.

You're welcome. And sorry.

So awful! Really the UN peacekeeping force and others need to go in and protect people on the ground. There need to be huge sanctions, words are not enough at this stage. Mass evictions will only bring more violence on both sides.

Completely agree with you regarding Netanyahu and Hamas. There needs to be new governance on both sides. Religion should also be removed from any constitutions and governments, no one should have more or less rights based on their religion.