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Conflict in the Middle East
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ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:20

NordicwithTeen · 28/01/2025 20:18

Depends if someone has asked the question "what have we learned?"

The whole speech was about what we have or should have learned

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:21

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:20

The whole speech was about what we have or should have learned

So what have we learnt about Sudan, Yemen, DRC, Myanmar? Or is it just Gaza that's relevant?

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:21

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:19

So are you saying he only mentioned Gaza because there's now a ceasefire?

You're digging yourself a hole here...it's quite amusing to witness... particularly after your faux naivety on display earlier....

Edited

That was the context through which he introduced it, yes. He included quotes from both an Israeli peace activist and a Palestinian peace activist and then spoke about how much both sides have lost

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:22

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:21

So what have we learnt about Sudan, Yemen, DRC, Myanmar? Or is it just Gaza that's relevant?

No, what we have or should have learned from the Holocaust.

partyplanningseason · 28/01/2025 20:22

Honestly I despair.

What do people think "never again" means?

I didn't hear what was said today but everyone should be condemning the mass slaughter of civilians, including children, in Gaza. It's absolutely inexcusable. It's exactly what "never again" covers and yes holocaust day is a good day to discuss it IMO.

The holocaust memorial coverage on BBC last night was very moving. Jews, intellectuals, gypsies and others were dehumanised, that's how such wicked acts were carried out on them.

Palestinian civilians are being dehumanised right now and a terrible injustice is being done to them. The Palestine people is not the same thing as Hamas, but the entire country including children have been treated as if they are terrorists / the enemy. And I see people justifying it everywhere by dehumanising them.

They have been massacred.

If you stand against persecution of the Jews on humanitarian grounds (which I do and so should you IMO) then how can you not get the same token see the Palestinian people deserve not to be massacred and have entire towns and communities destroyed?

"Never again" should cover everyone. It's about basic human rights not tribalism/ taking sides.

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:22

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:21

That was the context through which he introduced it, yes. He included quotes from both an Israeli peace activist and a Palestinian peace activist and then spoke about how much both sides have lost

Righto...so are you now saying that if a ceasefire hadn't been called, he wouldn't have mentioned it?

Kindatired · 28/01/2025 20:24

I think that this thread is part of a concerted effort to systematically discredit Ireland and the Irish. The Israeli government is spending 146 million USD on propaganda this year.
If you read the speech it is clear that October 7 must be referenced and hopes for future peace expressed.

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:25

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:22

Righto...so are you now saying that if a ceasefire hadn't been called, he wouldn't have mentioned it?

No that’s not what I’m saying. How could I possibly know what he would have done? What I actually said is he introduced the conflict in the context of ceasefire and striving for peace. Explain to me why you think he shouldn’t have used this particular example?

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:27

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:19

So are you saying he only mentioned Gaza because there's now a ceasefire?

You're digging yourself a hole here...it's quite amusing to witness... particularly after your faux naivety on display earlier....

Edited

That’s exactly what I have been saying all along, go back and read my posts! I’m not digging any hole for myself, you’re just arguing and disagreeing with me and not backing any of it up or offering any opinion of your own. More fool me for engaging with you!

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:29

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:27

That’s exactly what I have been saying all along, go back and read my posts! I’m not digging any hole for myself, you’re just arguing and disagreeing with me and not backing any of it up or offering any opinion of your own. More fool me for engaging with you!

Because you can't explain why that particular conflict was mentioned over other conflicts...just waffling on about how it is because there's a ceasefire

Dulra · 28/01/2025 20:30

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:22

Righto...so are you now saying that if a ceasefire hadn't been called, he wouldn't have mentioned it?

How is the poster meant to know that. You don't agree with what he said others do. His speech was received well by those present he was an invited guest and invited to speak at the event. It was organised by Holocaust Education Ireland get it touch with them about your issues with his speech.

I personally feel he should not have mentioned the current conflict at this event but having read his speech I have no issue with any of what he has said and it is talking about peace, respect, tolerance as opposed to the US. President who is talking about ethnic cleansing Gaza but there doesn't seem to be much issue with that which is extremely depressing, what have we become.

https://www.holocausteducationireland.org/

Holocaust Education Ireland

Holocaust Education Ireland is the independent national non-profit working to educate the people of Ireland about the Holocaust and its consequences. We do this by delivering unique school and teacher education programmes; awareness initiatives, such a...

https://www.holocausteducationireland.org

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:30

Comedycook · 28/01/2025 20:29

Because you can't explain why that particular conflict was mentioned over other conflicts...just waffling on about how it is because there's a ceasefire

That’s the reason? What do you think is his reason? There’s really no need to be rude. Respectful discussion should be possible.

Puppalicious · 28/01/2025 20:32

I’m Irish and I don’t think he should have gone to this event, nor do I think a Holocaust memorial service is the right time to mention Gaza.

Dulra · 28/01/2025 20:35

Puppalicious · 28/01/2025 20:32

I’m Irish and I don’t think he should have gone to this event, nor do I think a Holocaust memorial service is the right time to mention Gaza.

He's gone every year for past 7 years. I think it would have been an even worse reaction if he refused the invite this year

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:35

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:27

That’s exactly what I have been saying all along, go back and read my posts! I’m not digging any hole for myself, you’re just arguing and disagreeing with me and not backing any of it up or offering any opinion of your own. More fool me for engaging with you!

It’s not clear whether you really don’t understand if you’re pretending not to understand, that it’s anti-Semitic to hold Jews in general responsible for the politics or actions of Israel. The implication of bringing up Gaza on Holocaust Memorial Day, and not any of the other current wars happening around the world, is obviously that it is of relevance to the Jewish people and the holocaust. If your message is simply that war is bad or civilian deaths are bad or massacres are bad, why wouldn’t you bring up the other wars? He’s bringing up Gaza because he’s saying ‘Jews this is your responsibility”. Actually what’s happening in Israel has nothing to do with the six million murdered in Europe. So many people wiped out that there was no one to remember that they ever existed.

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:37

The equivalent is holding Muslims responsible for the actions of the Saudi government, by bringing it up the war in Yemen at an Eid celebration. Racist.

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:40

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:35

It’s not clear whether you really don’t understand if you’re pretending not to understand, that it’s anti-Semitic to hold Jews in general responsible for the politics or actions of Israel. The implication of bringing up Gaza on Holocaust Memorial Day, and not any of the other current wars happening around the world, is obviously that it is of relevance to the Jewish people and the holocaust. If your message is simply that war is bad or civilian deaths are bad or massacres are bad, why wouldn’t you bring up the other wars? He’s bringing up Gaza because he’s saying ‘Jews this is your responsibility”. Actually what’s happening in Israel has nothing to do with the six million murdered in Europe. So many people wiped out that there was no one to remember that they ever existed.

I’m not pretending anything, why would I do that? How is he holding Jews responsible for the Israel/Gaza conflict? I don’t see it.

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:45

Dulra · 28/01/2025 19:59

The organisers of the event, Holocaust Education Ireland. He has spoken at every memorial since being President so for the past 7

HEI asked him to attend and speak presumably? I was wondering who had asked him NOT to attend, as another poster said had happened

LetThereBeLove · 28/01/2025 20:47

Dulra · 28/01/2025 19:48

And Higgins was asked not to attend the memorial and when he did,
He was invited to attend and to speak as he has done at every Holocaust memorial since he became President

He was asked by the small embattled Irish Jewish community not to attend this year specifically, even though the invitation came from Holocaust Education Ireland.

Dulra · 28/01/2025 20:50

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:45

HEI asked him to attend and speak presumably? I was wondering who had asked him NOT to attend, as another poster said had happened

I was wondering who had asked him NOT to attend, as another poster said had happened

The Isreali ambassador/ Israeli government as far as I am aware. It was not their event though. The organisers of the event never rescinded their invite he has spoken at all of their events since being President.

Dulra · 28/01/2025 20:52

LetThereBeLove · 28/01/2025 20:47

He was asked by the small embattled Irish Jewish community not to attend this year specifically, even though the invitation came from Holocaust Education Ireland.

Edited

He was asked not to attend this year specifically

By people that had nothing to do with the event. Why didn't they ask the organisers to take back their invite to him? The organisers didn't so clearly wanted him to attend and speak at event.

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:54

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:40

I’m not pretending anything, why would I do that? How is he holding Jews responsible for the Israel/Gaza conflict? I don’t see it.

As I said in my post, by bringing up this specific conflict he is implying that it has some particular relevance. Why bring up Gaza and not Yemen or Sudan? Because he thinks Gaza has a particular relevance in this context.

Dulra · 28/01/2025 20:54

LetThereBeLove · 28/01/2025 20:47

He was asked by the small embattled Irish Jewish community not to attend this year specifically, even though the invitation came from Holocaust Education Ireland.

Edited

Not by all of them, some wanted him there some didn't.

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:56

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:54

As I said in my post, by bringing up this specific conflict he is implying that it has some particular relevance. Why bring up Gaza and not Yemen or Sudan? Because he thinks Gaza has a particular relevance in this context.

Well of course it has relevance but how do you jump from that to Higgins holding the Jews responsible for it?

Humfree · 28/01/2025 20:58

ZebraPyjamas · 28/01/2025 20:56

Well of course it has relevance but how do you jump from that to Higgins holding the Jews responsible for it?

What is the particular relevance of the conflict in Gaza, above those elsewhere?