A ceasefire deal has been agreed

[gloriagloria]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c3rwqpj70ert

I really hope this is the beginning of peace and prosperity for both sides.

I didn't know the IDF were part of the Israeli government.

Perhaps Hamas should not have committed the atrocities they did on October 7 which started the current war.

Round and round we go.

Armies are generally controlled by the government of the country for which they are the army. Did you not know that?

That doesn't make them part of the government.

Round and round we go

Yes because Hamas, the Israeli government and the IDF are war criminals persecuting innocent civilians and destroying lives

What are you on about? IDF is controlled by the chief of the general staff he’s a subordinate of the defence minister

Well said.

But Hamas started it!

Isn’t the defence for war crimes that you think it is.
It’s not a defence for Hamas’ atrocities on Oct 7th to blame Israel’s apartheid, occupation and 80yrs of oppression as Israel started it in year dot!

In the same way, Hamas’ Oct 7th attack as a ‘they started it!’ is not a defence to a genocide of 46k, including over 15k children. Israel have killed over 1,000 Palestinian children for every child killed by Hamas during the current war.

Every party is accountable for their own crimes. That’s why 3 arrest warrants were issued for Hamas commanders, and 2 for Israeli leaders by the ICJ.

Yes it does. Armed forces are part of their government. Every active duty military member is a type of government employee, paid for by our taxes. The IDF are not some sort of mercenary private contractor 🤣

I stand corrected 😂

I take issue with the actions of the Netanyahu govt being blamed on all Jewish people, I also think it must be remembered that what Hamas did on Oct 7 was absolutely inexcusable. What has happened since in Gaza is horrific and any chance for peace should be seized. Netanyahu’s approach to the war was never going to “destroy” Hamas because it’s an ideology and what’s been happening is absolutely going to lead to increased radicalisation. It’s just awful from every perspective.

No I think I made it quite clear in one of my posts that usually when people refer to a country in that way they mean the Israeli government, the same way they mean the US government etc. Hamas are not the government of Palestine so it would make no sense to use Palestine in that way. But I think you know that.

In fairness the US is a bad example because people very much do refer to individual administrations.

Not really. The US war on terror?

That said, it is common practice to refer to the actions of a country’s government, including their military by just the country’s name.
“The Russians have invaded Ukraine”
”The British have Brexited from the EU”
”The Israelis are fighting Hamas”
”Lebanon is rebuilding”

There is no need to apply any exceptionalism to Israel to add “government” after Israeli.

There is when you’re specifically pointing out that it’s Hamas, not the Palestinians.

If you were correct then they wouldn't need to say 'as an expression of practical zionism'.

But you are incorrect. Zionism is the simple belief in a Jewish homeland in Israel. Political zionism may have various manifestations but that dorsn't chsnhe the fact.

I agree with this.
Whatever 'side' everyone is on I'm sure in the end we all want an end to the bloodshed and war.

I only see/hear/read Americans doing that when they wish to distance themselves from the actions of the USG or when inside the USA.
Outside America, you usually hear “The Americans” from nonAmericans you don’t hear “the Obama administration” or “The republicans…”

Like you don’t hear outside the U.K. people referring to Tory this or labour that, you hear “The British”

my wish is that all innocent civilians are allowed to return home from both sides

That’s a laudable wish, but the Israeli government and the IDF have ensured, with their policy of blanket destruction, that ‘home’ is a wasteland for millions of Gazans. Their homes, communities, along with the infrastructure to support them, have been obliterated.

Even a temporary cessation of hostilities, increase in humanitarian aid and release of hostages is a lot better than nothing.

If the ceasefire starts on Sunday, when will the first hostages be released? I do hope the little Bibas children are amongst the first to return home.

I also hope all those medical personnel and other innocent Palestinians that are being held without charge by Israel are freed, like Dr Hussam.

I’m correct, you’re just tone policing the Zionist platform.

If you were correct, their platform would not direct settlement or refer to Eretz Yisrael- which has a specific definition in the Torah btw as the land promised by Yahweh to Abraham.

It would just say “We believe in a homeland for Jewish people”

I think they said on Sunday and that they would be released in batches of 3 (I might be making that up but I’m sure I read it somewhere). And I think Palestinian girls under 19 will be the first to be released.

Palestine isn’t a country. It is occupied territory.

Too Israel announced their war was with Hamas, not Palestinians.