Gideon Levy on the killing in Gaza

[Auvergne63]

A very interesting transcript of an interview with Gideon Levy.
https://www.currentaffairs.org/news/israeli-journalist-gideon-levy-on-the-killing-of-gaza

Israel Is carrying out a genocide is also counteracted with 'you can't say that because it's anti-semitic'

You hear it all the time from Israeli officials. According to them, the UN are anti-semitic, HRW are anti-semitic, Amnesty International are anti-semitic, the ICC are anti-semitic, the ICJ are anti-semitic and so on and so forth. In a nutshell most organisations or individuals outside of Israel who criticise Israel are called anti-semitic.

In USA campus protests were shut down, several university presidents either resigned or removed from their positions due their lack of crackdown on protests citing these protests were antisemitic. In reality, there were Jewish students who joined these protests.

And there were Jewish students prevented from joining their lessons and hounded off their campuses. Faculty staff blocked from doing their jobs by masked antisemites
So?

I suggested reading up on the Livingstone formulation , not illustrating how to use it.

Absolutely, using antisemitism as a veil to attack free speech (note it's increasingly being pushed by non Jewish people) will end up backfiring spectacularly.

When that happens it will be Jewish people who will be blamed and attacked and many former allies who have been unfairly labelled "antisemitic" won't be around to help.

This article in the Guardian covers the pitfalls of this strategy :
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/dec/31/antisemitism-israel-gaza-war-right

But I fear it's already too late, I have been watching grassroots MAGA movement (as opposed to the Political class who are wholly pro Israel) grow increasingly anti Israel and now openly antisemitic.
With Elon Musk actively banning or de-monetizing prominent right wing accounts this week, many other accounts were openly blaming Jewish influence.

Similar workbook for other conflicts too - any criticism about west's actions whatsoever is counteracted with "you are against democracy and freedom"

Someone somewhere is really good at devising sophisticated marketing for war it seems

I think in cases where Jewish (or any other identity) students were targeted and harassed because of their identity must be definitely handled seriously.

At my son's campus, two student originally from Palestine talked to the student newspaper anonymously because they were afraid as they were already receiving threats and harassment. Think about that for a moment. They can not even raise their concerns or talk openly. I wouldn't know about them if somehow we were not affiliated with this university. To me, it sounds like they don't even have a voice. What do we call this type of oppression? I think we don't have even a word to define what they must be going through.

@OchaLove I am surprised by this as it's certainly not the impression that's been on social media/ the press of all sides/ student representatives that I know, students at uni on both sides of the pond.

The attitude towards Jewish students has been openly hostile. Replying with ' I know two anonymous students who have it worse' does what? Threats and harassment from whom?

'Views, expressed in this video from random members of the public, are shocking to me and very revealing'. This comment was made on this thread regarding this video; thank you for sharing.

You can apply that statement to these videos taken by the same journalist speaking with Palestinians.
.

I could state, 'The prognosis seems hopeless' after watching these videos, but that would be to give in to a preconceived opinion about all Palestinians that is not based on reason or actual evidence but prejudice.

Do the contributors on this thread understand the definition of prejudice and criticism? Read through all the comments above and other threads related to the war in Gaza, you will see a pattern forming. Jews, who are Israelis and make up 73% of the State of Israel are collectively held responsible for all the suffering of the Palestinians and the actions of the government. It sounds ridiculous when you say it out loud, but it's all here to read in black and white on MN.

Maybe I should apply the same collective judgemental stereotype to all Palestinians that you apply to Israeli Jews. After all, we have the video evidence, and you believe in this journalistic reporting, don't you?

Just to let you know, ladies. I will not be responding to your replies. Let us be honest, I'm not the kind of contributor you want on one of your anti-Israel/Jewish threads because I question the validity of some of your sources, as they are neither impartial nor authored by a credible individual.

Have a lovely weekend! Ta-ta.

Absolutely. This thread is sickening.

Yet you are on it.

Thinly veiled is being replaced by blatant @SharonEllis

"The attitude towards Jewish students has been openly hostile."

I think this would have been correct if you assume all Jewish students as supporters of Israel's current administration, which is not the case. I think there is an imbalance of representation in the media. For instance, who knows or remembers these college students who were shot because of their identities?

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/18/interview-palestinian-students-shot-vermont-hate-crime

I also watch a podcast from an independent journalist, she says Palestinians in USA send her messages but they don't want to be on the live show saying they fear retribution for themselves or for their relatives still in Palestine.

Or listen from these Jewish students who perfectly explains from their own experiences. If you find what we're trying to explain here as sickening or some kind of blatant racism/antisemitism, please check your own prejudices.

The IDF used this Palestinian man as a human shield (common practice by the IDF) and then another soldier shot him. Palestinians have been used as human shields by the IDF for decades.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/palestinian-human-shield-in-gaza-for-idf-troops-shot-dead-in-error-by-officer-report/

It is so easy, and not very clever, to surf the web and find snippets of information to target a specific group of people. I am referring to Israeli Jews.

Ironically, you copied that quote from 'The Times of Israel', and ex-Israeli President Reuven Rivlin made it.

You forgot to mention that Prince Charles came to Israel in 1995 and 2016 to attend the funerals of Yitzhak Rabin (he was the fifth prime minister of Israel) and Shimon Peres (who served as the eighth prime minister of Israel).

Prince Charles made an official visit to Israel in 2020 to attend the World Holocaust Forum, marking 75 years since the liberation of Auschwitz and the systematic mass murder of the Jewish people in German-occupied Europe.

How respectful of our King to show sympathy and understanding to survivors of the Holocaust who felt there was no future for Jews in Europe after 6 million were murdered for no other reason than for being Jewish.

It is also commonly believed that the British Foreign Office, for fear of Arab boycotts, had advised the queen not to visit Israel.

There is always more than one side to a story; I intend everyone to hear it.

That would make life far too easy and give you free rein to anonymously use a social media platform without accountability for what you say.

It is so easy, and not very clever, to surf the web and find snippets of information to target a specific group of people. I am referring to Israeli Jews.
I heard it on radio 4 so no, I didn't scroll the net as you put it.
Are you deducting, from my comment about the late Queen, that I am antisemitic? Where did I mention Israeli Jews?
Ironically, you copied that quote from 'The Times of Israel', and ex-Israeli President Reuven Rivlin made it.
Really? See above. If I had known it was him who said it, then I would have quoted him.
You forgot to mention that Prince Charles came to Israel in 1995 and 2016 to attend the funerals of Yitzhak Rabin (he was the fifth prime minister of Israel) and Shimon Peres (who served as the eighth prime minister of Israel).
I didn't forget to mention it. I was talking about about the Queen, not the royal family as a whole.
Prince Charles made an official visit to Israel in 2020 to attend the World Holocaust Forum, marking 75 years since the liberation of Auschwitz and the systematic mass murder of the Jewish people in German-occupied Europe.
Wrong. The first official visit was from Prince William, not Prince Charles, in 2018.
https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-716696
How respectful of our King to show sympathy and understanding to survivors of the Holocaust who felt there was no future for Jews in Europe after 6 million were murdered for no other reason than for being Jewish.
He isn't my king. I am a French citizen, not a British subject.
I have immense sympathy to all who were the victims of the Holocaust, including Jewish people, Roma and Sinti, Poles, Slavs and many more. Every single one matters and should be remembered. My great aunt was tortured and sent to Auschwitz. She was a member of the French resistance.
It is also commonly believed that the British Foreign Office, for fear of Arab boycotts, had advised the queen not to visit Israel.
Indeed. I suggest you read the link I posted above, which explains why she never visited.
There is always more than one side to a story; I intend everyone to hear it.
Good for you. Before you do that, make sure you get your facts right,first.

I know, I dared to post a link about an interview with Gideon Levy, an award winning Israeli journalist and a man I admire greatly!
I also posted interviews of some Israeli citizens, expressing shocking views!
How dare I!
Please, remember that we have still freedom of speech in this country.
I will not be silenced.
I am not accountable to you or any others on this forum.
Finally, a friendly reminder, personal attacks are against the rules.

@BelleHathor

Correct, and much respect to Queen Elizabeth, unlike many politicians she stayed committed to never condoning/forgiving the extra judicial murder of British citizens. I mean how could anyone break bread with people who kidnapped British soldiers, murdered and booby trapped their bodies to explode.

Now in fairness, she shook hands with Martin McGuniness, once a leader within the IRA. A big moment for both of them for various reasons. So she was very much a forgive type person.

Getting stuck in a who are/were the worst terrorists debate is unhelpful. Most people want to live in safety and security and there needs to be a way to move forward past the hate and endless cycles of violence.

It looks increasingly unlikely unfortunately. It's gone on so long now It's hard to see a good ending for either Israel or Palestine.

@Auvergne63 you would do well to remember that with your 'grammar is inportant' rubbish that you target at very specific posters. All noted. Patterns are inportant.
Freedom of speech works all ways so remembered that when you being challenged and don't like it.

@GentleScroller as you where x

Oh before I forget.... how many times are you going to accuse people of calling you antisemitic, roll out the same stories again? Once again targeted at specific posters. Just so I know when to switch off. And if this posts illicits a response from Mumsnet I can prove it. Over and over again.

@BelleHathor she 'broke bread' with those who murdered her husbands uncle and the mentor of Charles. The uncle who had both his legs blown off.
She has also been targeted on more than one occasion.
So I would say fairly forgiving.