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Conflict in the Middle East

Teaching Hatred

267 replies

UnSognoAVenezia · 27/12/2023 23:55

INTERNATIONAL LAW
The use and recruitment of children under the age of 15 as soldiers is not only illegal under international law, but is also defined as a war crime by the International Criminal Court.

This law applies both to state armed forces and non-state armed forces; in other words, Palestinian groups cannot claim innocence for using children in combat under the guise that their paramilitary groups are not acting on behalf of a sovereign nation.

In 2005, Amnesty International stated: “Palestinian armed groups have repeatedly shown total disregard for the most fundamental human rights, notably the right to life, by deliberately targeting Israeli civilians and by using Palestinian children in armed attacks.”

The psychological effects for child soldiers are devastating. Research conducted among Palestinian and Ugandan child soldiers found that 50 percent of former child soldiers experience post-traumatic stress disorder. Others suffer from major depressive disorder, hostility, sadness, low self-confidence, and an inability to cope with daily life.

HISTORY
The recruitment of minors for combat by Palestinian militants dates back to the final years of the Ottoman occupation of Palestine (1517-1917). Youths were at the forefront of the opposition against Jewish immigration, and an attitude developed that children had a “duty to sacrifice themselves.”

During the infamous 1929 Hebron Massacre, when 69 Jews were murdered and the most ancient continuous Jewish community in Palestine was decimated, Arab youths instigated the violence.

As relations between Nazi Germany and the Arab world developed, the powerful Husseini family founded the Palestinian Arab Party, modeled after the Nazi Party in Germany. Inspired by the Hitler Youth, the party created a Nazi-like scout group named “Al-Futuwwa.” That same year, the A-Futuwwa youth corps began Nazi-inspired military training. Al-Futuwwa adopted the following motto: “Liberty is my right; independence is my goal; Arabism is my principle; Palestine is my country and mine only. This I attest and God is a witness to my words.”

With the establishment of the Palestine Liberation Organization in 1964, the PLO created military training programs for boys and girls.

During the First Intifada (1987-1993), a culture of Palestinian youth stone-throwing emerged, quickly linking stone-throwing to martyrdom. During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), at least nine children carried out suicide bombings against Israelis.

TRAINING CAMPS
As stated above, the first militarized training camps for Palestinian children were established in the 1930s, inspired by the Hitler Youth. The group was known as Al-Futuwwa.

This practice resurged with the establishment of the PLO in 1964. Palestinian children were subjected to military training with the aim of “strengthening Palestinian national self-awareness” and upholding a “revolutionary culture.”

In 2000, 25,000 Palestinian boys were taught “kidnapping, ambushing, and using assault weapons” at a training camp run by former Palestinian Authority president Yasser Arafat’s staff.

In September 2012, Hamas, the Islamist, antisemitic, extremist terrorist organization that runs the Gaza Strip, instituted a new military training program for school boys in Gaza, also named Al-Futuwwa. The program implemented the following: (1) a two-week military training camp, (2) weekly “military” classes, and (3) “practical activities.” The curriculum targeted some 37,000 boys, who were taught to use Kalashnikov assault rifles, hand grenades, and other explosive devises.

SUICIDE BOMBINGS
During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), Palestinian groups recruited children as militants in a number of ways; most notably and devastatingly, at least nine suicide bombings were carried out by Palestinian children.

In 2004, the Israeli military intercepted an 11-year-old Palestinian boy carrying explosive devices on his person through a checkpoint in Nablus.

In 2000, the then Grand Mufti of Jerusalem Ekrima Sa'id Sabri made a statement in support of suicide attacks carried out by children: “The younger the martyr, the more I respect him.”

In 2003, the United Nations Secretary General stated: “We have witnessed both ends of these acts: children have been used as suicide bombers and children have been killed by suicide bombings. I call on the Palestinian authorities to do everything within their powers to stop all participation by children in this conflict.”

On December 25, 2023, the Israeli Defense Forces found child-sized suicide bomber vests in a building used to shelter civilians in the Gaza Strip.

During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), a photo of a "baby suicide bomber" sparked international outrage. The boy's uncle verified the authenticity of the photo, though the IDF believed there were no actual explosives in the belt.

INDOCTRINATION
Hamas runs both Shehab News and the Al-Aqsa Media Network. Al-Aqsa Media is known for its virulently antisemitic content; for example, the children’s program Tomorrow’s Pioneers, which ran from 2007 to 2009, quite literally encouraged Palestinian children to murder Jews. Children’s characters made statements such as: “We will annihilate the Jews,” and “[I] will finish off the Jews and eat them.”

Palestinian schoolbooks frequently espouse overt antisemitism, as well as demonization Jews, Israelis, and Israel. Hamas has repeatedly interfered with the curriculums of United Nations Relief and Works Agency schools, including the decision to suspend any education on the Holocaust in 2009. UNRWA teachers have also been caught posting explicitly antisemitic content online, such as content praising Hitler.

From 2002 to at least 2006, the Hamas-run biweekly online magazine for children, Al-Fatah (“The Conqueror”), praised suicide bombers and attacks on the “Jewish enemy.”

At least 20 UNRWA schoolteachers and staff praised the October 7 Hamas massacre of Israeli civilians, the deadliest antisemitic massacre since the Holocaust.

Here is a quote from Hamas MP Fathi Hamad:
"[The enemies of Allah] do not know that the Palestinian people has developed its [methods] of death and death-seeking. For the Palestinian people, death has become an industry, at which women excel, and so do all the people living on this land. The elderly excel at this, and so do the mujahideen and the children. This is why they have formed human shields of the women, the children, the elderly, and the mujahideen, in order to challenge the Zionist bombing machine. It is as if they were saying to the Zionist enemy: 'We desire death like you desire life.'"

IMPLICATIONS
First, a caveat: Israel too has been accused of “glorifying” military culture, with children being taught to look forward to their military draft. That said, the two situations are not remotely similar. First, Israel does not recruit minors for military operations. Israel does not fire from civilian-populated areas, and certainly not from areas populated by children. Independent studies have found that, while both Israeli and Palestinian school textbooks generally don’t offer a very sympathetic view of the other side, Palestinian textbooks overwhelmingly glorify martyrdom, whereas Israeli textbooks emphasize peace.

The militarization and radicalization of Palestinian children is a form of child abuse, and it has grave implications.

A clinical psychologist at Tel Aviv University, Shafiq Masalha, found that during the Second Intifada (2000-2005), 15 percent of Palestinian children dreamt of becoming suicide bombers. According to the director of the Gaza Community Mental Health Program, Eyad Sarraj, 36 percent of Palestinian children over the age of 12 aspire to die “a martyr’s death.”

A 2012 study on Israeli, Palestinian, and Arab Israeli children found that exposure to the conflict and violence increased aggressive behavior. It stated: "Palestinian children were at the greatest risk for exposure to violence across settings as well as at the highest level of aggressive behavior in comparison to the two other groups. Males were uniformly at greater risk than were females for all forms of exposure to violence as well as more aggressive."

(credit Rootsmetals)

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Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 11:48

ItsRainingTacos79 · 28/12/2023 11:41

Providing one sided 'facts' and opinion pieces does not mean this thread is not dehumanising Palestinians. I could do the same thing and compile facts and opinions about Israelis. There is a lack of critical thinking here.

There is already at least one thread doing precisely that ....have a look.

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 11:49

EmberLight
Does this make you feel better about the 8200 children Israel has killed?

BeggyMitchell
Are those Hamas run health ministry figures? You're better off quoting some random on TikTok...oh hang on^

If you think 8200 isn't correct, how many is acceptable then? 7500? 6000 perhaps? What about "an eye for an eye" and equal to the number who were killed on 7 October? Would you mind answering this, here on this parenting forum, how many dead children you actually find acceptable?

I'll tell you my number. It's precise - actually precise too, not like the bombs ripping children to shreds - ZERO. That's the same number of grieving parents I want.

And to be extra precise, yes, I count Palestinians as people equal to Israelis. And therefore their children too.

Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 11:51

Pizdietz · 28/12/2023 11:44

If you had any idea how many threads on here could be accused of "dehumanising" Israel/Jews by blaming them for genocide, ethnic cleansing etc, entirely overlooking the situation they are in.

To turn kirinm's question back:
What has to happen to people in Israel for those who cheer on Palestine to say "enough is enough"? Their complete annihilation? How many more pogroms would you like to see before you consider that some kind of defensive action against Hamas is justified?

It would be interesting to see what would be left of Israel by now if Gaza had the same military capacity. I mean, they've spent the last couple of decades lobbing rockets over and stockpiling weapons so that they could inflict as much damage as possible, as quickly as possible, given the opportunity. How many Israelis would still be alive after 3 months if Hamas/Gaza had equal power? I doubt it would be 99%.

This.

sunshinesupermum · 28/12/2023 11:54

I still have to see what actions Israel 'should' have taken after the 7th October massacres and kidnappings especially when Hamas has repeated its intention of committing the same again and again until Jews are wiped out.

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 11:58

Very seriously, I would advise people who are trying to discredit Palestinians, to focus their considerable time resources to looking at what is happening to Israeli soldiers.

There are videos almost every day coming out from Hamas showing them being killed and attacked. Now, yes it's armed conflict, but those kids are NOT TRAINED PROPERLY. They're doing stuff like shooting at a target while standing up (easy pickings - soldiers lie low for a reason). They're clustering in a groups of about 8, all standing, to collect a dead soldier, facing inwards, nobody facing outwards for protection! I'm going to assume the average Israeli soldier is as smart as the average anybody, so this means they're inadequately trained.

It's a total shame on the Israeli government that it receives so much funding, and sends its boys in to battle like this. Even the Golani Brigade had to withdraw due to losses. Tanks are being overturned in FLAT ground! There is a very serious lack of training and if people want to save their family and friends, they'd be better off trying to find the actual number of death and injuries, not only the reported ones.

After all, Netenyahu doesn't stand to lose his son, unless he gets hit by a freak wave on a Florida beach.

Stop spreading hate and fuelling a genocide and take care of your own boys.

Pizdietz · 28/12/2023 11:59

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 11:58

Very seriously, I would advise people who are trying to discredit Palestinians, to focus their considerable time resources to looking at what is happening to Israeli soldiers.

There are videos almost every day coming out from Hamas showing them being killed and attacked. Now, yes it's armed conflict, but those kids are NOT TRAINED PROPERLY. They're doing stuff like shooting at a target while standing up (easy pickings - soldiers lie low for a reason). They're clustering in a groups of about 8, all standing, to collect a dead soldier, facing inwards, nobody facing outwards for protection! I'm going to assume the average Israeli soldier is as smart as the average anybody, so this means they're inadequately trained.

It's a total shame on the Israeli government that it receives so much funding, and sends its boys in to battle like this. Even the Golani Brigade had to withdraw due to losses. Tanks are being overturned in FLAT ground! There is a very serious lack of training and if people want to save their family and friends, they'd be better off trying to find the actual number of death and injuries, not only the reported ones.

After all, Netenyahu doesn't stand to lose his son, unless he gets hit by a freak wave on a Florida beach.

Stop spreading hate and fuelling a genocide and take care of your own boys.

Thanks for that, Lord Haw Haw Flowers

stomachamaleon · 28/12/2023 12:02

@Pizdietz there is always one....

Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 12:02

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 11:49

EmberLight
Does this make you feel better about the 8200 children Israel has killed?

BeggyMitchell
Are those Hamas run health ministry figures? You're better off quoting some random on TikTok...oh hang on^

If you think 8200 isn't correct, how many is acceptable then? 7500? 6000 perhaps? What about "an eye for an eye" and equal to the number who were killed on 7 October? Would you mind answering this, here on this parenting forum, how many dead children you actually find acceptable?

I'll tell you my number. It's precise - actually precise too, not like the bombs ripping children to shreds - ZERO. That's the same number of grieving parents I want.

And to be extra precise, yes, I count Palestinians as people equal to Israelis. And therefore their children too.

No dead children are acceptable. Me sitting here on a forum saying that will not make it happen.

I'm merely trying to understand why the hatred is there and thought that the @UnSognoAVenezia information gave in different sections interesting. Screams of shut it down by some, doesn't contribute anything.

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 12:03

-Thanks for that, Lord Haw Haw

You're welcome, sweetheart.

Att1cusPund · 28/12/2023 12:05

sunshinesupermum · 28/12/2023 11:54

I still have to see what actions Israel 'should' have taken after the 7th October massacres and kidnappings especially when Hamas has repeated its intention of committing the same again and again until Jews are wiped out.

100% this. I see plenty of posters saying "Well, for a start I wouldn't have started killing a load of civilians."

Any fool can say that. What WOULD you have done?

Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 12:06

daretodenim · 28/12/2023 11:58

Very seriously, I would advise people who are trying to discredit Palestinians, to focus their considerable time resources to looking at what is happening to Israeli soldiers.

There are videos almost every day coming out from Hamas showing them being killed and attacked. Now, yes it's armed conflict, but those kids are NOT TRAINED PROPERLY. They're doing stuff like shooting at a target while standing up (easy pickings - soldiers lie low for a reason). They're clustering in a groups of about 8, all standing, to collect a dead soldier, facing inwards, nobody facing outwards for protection! I'm going to assume the average Israeli soldier is as smart as the average anybody, so this means they're inadequately trained.

It's a total shame on the Israeli government that it receives so much funding, and sends its boys in to battle like this. Even the Golani Brigade had to withdraw due to losses. Tanks are being overturned in FLAT ground! There is a very serious lack of training and if people want to save their family and friends, they'd be better off trying to find the actual number of death and injuries, not only the reported ones.

After all, Netenyahu doesn't stand to lose his son, unless he gets hit by a freak wave on a Florida beach.

Stop spreading hate and fuelling a genocide and take care of your own boys.

There is at least one thread doing what you suggest already. Have you seen it. There are also hundreds of threads sharing what is happening in Gaza and many with links to videos?

This thread felt slightly different since lots of information rather than graphic tic toc or x links with some attempts to understand why.

gingergran · 28/12/2023 12:07

My view of the conflict is coloured by my personal experience. My friend who lived on kibbutz be’eri sadly died about eight months ago and although it may sound strange I am glad she was not alive on October 7th.

Her husband was murdered. Her sister who looked after her grandchildren because their mother is severely disabled was murdered. Her 12 year old grandson was murdered. Their house was set alight and it was only after providing DNA that they were able to confirm that her 12 year old granddaughter was also murdered. They buried her toys because they could not bury her.

They were people who were on the left wing of Israeli politics. Who firmly believed that there could be peace with the Palestinians. They talked of a peaceful and secure border. They employed numerous Palestinians on their kibbutz. And these same Palestinians were the ones who provided information to Hamas so that they knew who lived in which house, who would be not be there at the weekends, where the school and kindergarten were, where the children would be.

There is nothing that can ever justify such cold blooded murder and betrayal

I deliberately haven’t posted until now about this but the vitriol and ignorance on the other threads fills me with despair

Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 12:08

gingergran · 28/12/2023 12:07

My view of the conflict is coloured by my personal experience. My friend who lived on kibbutz be’eri sadly died about eight months ago and although it may sound strange I am glad she was not alive on October 7th.

Her husband was murdered. Her sister who looked after her grandchildren because their mother is severely disabled was murdered. Her 12 year old grandson was murdered. Their house was set alight and it was only after providing DNA that they were able to confirm that her 12 year old granddaughter was also murdered. They buried her toys because they could not bury her.

They were people who were on the left wing of Israeli politics. Who firmly believed that there could be peace with the Palestinians. They talked of a peaceful and secure border. They employed numerous Palestinians on their kibbutz. And these same Palestinians were the ones who provided information to Hamas so that they knew who lived in which house, who would be not be there at the weekends, where the school and kindergarten were, where the children would be.

There is nothing that can ever justify such cold blooded murder and betrayal

I deliberately haven’t posted until now about this but the vitriol and ignorance on the other threads fills me with despair

I'm so sorry.😥

BeggyMitchell · 28/12/2023 12:11

sunshinesupermum · 28/12/2023 11:54

I still have to see what actions Israel 'should' have taken after the 7th October massacres and kidnappings especially when Hamas has repeated its intention of committing the same again and again until Jews are wiped out.

I would love to know this.

Pizdietz · 28/12/2023 12:12

Att1cusPund · 28/12/2023 12:05

100% this. I see plenty of posters saying "Well, for a start I wouldn't have started killing a load of civilians."

Any fool can say that. What WOULD you have done?

Unfortunately, as daretodenim has pointed out, Israelis are so blinded by murderous intent that it just doesn't occur to them to keep their sons and daughters safe, instead of sending them into a horrible war that many of them are unlikely to survive.

ItsRainingTacos79 · 28/12/2023 12:15

@sunshinesupermum Israel would certainly not have been this heavy handed if Hamas were operating from Israel. The rhetoric coming from Hamas is no different to the rhetoric coming out of Israel.

untitledmum · 28/12/2023 12:17

There is no reason for this thread to be reported. It is factually accurate.

If only we could screen the recordings of October 7th you would all see that the facts that @UnSognoAVenezia posted are 100% correct.
Training Camps, Under-age kids joined in the attack, Indoctrination, Terrorist Ideology. There is video evidence of all this.

25milesfromhome · 28/12/2023 12:18

gingergran · 28/12/2023 12:07

My view of the conflict is coloured by my personal experience. My friend who lived on kibbutz be’eri sadly died about eight months ago and although it may sound strange I am glad she was not alive on October 7th.

Her husband was murdered. Her sister who looked after her grandchildren because their mother is severely disabled was murdered. Her 12 year old grandson was murdered. Their house was set alight and it was only after providing DNA that they were able to confirm that her 12 year old granddaughter was also murdered. They buried her toys because they could not bury her.

They were people who were on the left wing of Israeli politics. Who firmly believed that there could be peace with the Palestinians. They talked of a peaceful and secure border. They employed numerous Palestinians on their kibbutz. And these same Palestinians were the ones who provided information to Hamas so that they knew who lived in which house, who would be not be there at the weekends, where the school and kindergarten were, where the children would be.

There is nothing that can ever justify such cold blooded murder and betrayal

I deliberately haven’t posted until now about this but the vitriol and ignorance on the other threads fills me with despair

@gingergran I’m so sorry.

untitledmum · 28/12/2023 12:21

@gingergran This is heartbreaking. Nothing justifies this.
I commiserate with the despair and frustration at the ignorance and hatred towards Israel.

Mushroomsouptonight · 28/12/2023 12:21

untitledmum · 28/12/2023 12:17

There is no reason for this thread to be reported. It is factually accurate.

If only we could screen the recordings of October 7th you would all see that the facts that @UnSognoAVenezia posted are 100% correct.
Training Camps, Under-age kids joined in the attack, Indoctrination, Terrorist Ideology. There is video evidence of all this.

This is my view too.

The people who shout shut it down won't address any of the issues raised by the original post

YetAnotherSpartacus · 28/12/2023 12:25

gingergran Flowers

Santalazy · 28/12/2023 12:26

I think it’s completely necessary to understand the ideology. In fact it’s colonialist-type thinking that assumes other cultures have the same values as ours. Imo it’s very possible that some in that culture express love by seeking martyrdom for their children. It’s a culture we might find abhorrent but that shouldn’t stop us acknowledging that it exists.

backtowinter · 28/12/2023 12:28

gingergran · 28/12/2023 12:07

My view of the conflict is coloured by my personal experience. My friend who lived on kibbutz be’eri sadly died about eight months ago and although it may sound strange I am glad she was not alive on October 7th.

Her husband was murdered. Her sister who looked after her grandchildren because their mother is severely disabled was murdered. Her 12 year old grandson was murdered. Their house was set alight and it was only after providing DNA that they were able to confirm that her 12 year old granddaughter was also murdered. They buried her toys because they could not bury her.

They were people who were on the left wing of Israeli politics. Who firmly believed that there could be peace with the Palestinians. They talked of a peaceful and secure border. They employed numerous Palestinians on their kibbutz. And these same Palestinians were the ones who provided information to Hamas so that they knew who lived in which house, who would be not be there at the weekends, where the school and kindergarten were, where the children would be.

There is nothing that can ever justify such cold blooded murder and betrayal

I deliberately haven’t posted until now about this but the vitriol and ignorance on the other threads fills me with despair

Flowers
backtowinter · 28/12/2023 12:30

ItsRainingTacos79 · 28/12/2023 11:20

This biased thread, in itself, is an echo chamber that is teaching and confirming hatred of Palestinians. Dehumanising Palestinians as coming from an alien culture where they don't love their children etc. What a disgusting, racist thread.

Are you saying that this thread isn't factual?

ItsRainingTacos79 · 28/12/2023 12:30

@gingergran - I am incredibly sorry to hear this 💐. I wish for nothing more than a peaceful resolution to all this and I wish both sides that are doing the killing, dehumanising, spreading hate, etc can see past their egos and come to some understanding and agreement soon.