Why Can't Gazans Leave?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

There is probably a very simple answer to this that I missed in early news reports.

It's so awful watching News Feeds that essentially seem to say that Gazans are having to move around in a cat and mouse game with the IDF to avoid bombs but have nowhere left to go.

I am very aware that war has casualties and other countries are at war. I am not necessarily saying that IDF should stop fighting.

But this war is different in that all civilians seem to be trapped. Normally war creates refugees. Ukrainians, Afghans, Syrians - they were able to get out. Not all, I know, but movement was an option and it kept civilian casualties down. Why can't Gazans leave Gaza?

18% is an outlier by a long way in terms of estimating the amount of buildings destroyed in Gaza

Here's an interesting article on the contentious and difficult business of estimating damage from a couple of weeks ago

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/07/widespread-destruction-in-gaza-puts-concept-of-domicide-in-focus

Destroying universities/schools/hospitals and desecrating graves, can they get any lower?! 😡

@MissyB1 - my DT’s finished Uni a couple of years - part of their Uni time was during the pandemic. Thinking about their difficulties is nothing compared to the university students in Gaza who have had their futures destroyed, and many may not be alive now.

https://www.palestinechronicle.com/crime-of-genocide-south-africa-officially-brings-war-crimes-charges-against-israel-at-icc/

Crime of Genocide – South Africa Officially Brings War Crimes Charges against Israel at ICC

I saw something about the Israeli government thinking of building a 'humanitarian compound' in the north, and moving some Palestinians there. It was in yesterday's Guardian, which I can't see right now. It sounded vague and I don't know what to think about it. It sounds good, but will it be guarded by IDF forces, will people have freedom of movement and families kept together?

Saw that too @stormy4319trevor - slightly sinister overtones

Israel have been talking about setting up a field hospital in northern gaza for a while and also have ongoing plans with Cyprus/EU wrt setting up a [UN-free] maritime humanitarian route - so maybe part of that

It'll be a good place to re-locate those pesky civilians who keep getting in the way down in Rafah

Sounds about right

This is rafah right now. There's no bodies or anything, you can just see the strikes and how close they are to the displaced civilians who were told to move there

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C1Ew8ZAM45Q/?igshid=MjM0N2Q2NDBjYg==

@stormy4319trevor I saw that too although I wouldn't blame the Gazan's if they didn't want to move there even if one was made. Most of the previous safe zones have all been bombed so why would this one be any different

I try to be rational but in this instance il be honest it sounds like a trap. A humanatarian compound will be made. Gazans will move there and conveniently so will Hamas
You know what comes next

@Parkingt111 @Efacsen Thanks for your thoughts. It didn't sound like a firm plan, so we'll see!

@Parkingt111 hopefully Hamas would think enough of their own people to not go there or attempt to fire rockets from inside it.

You never know?

@stomachameleon like Hamas that was in the church and all the hospitals and all the mosques and all the bakeries and all the schools and all the water sanitation plants and all essential infrastructure

I don't trust the IDF for one second. The Palestinians are nothing more than an inconvenience for Netanyahu and I don't think he will lose his sleep if any more safe zones happen to get bombed
I don't see any reasons why the Gazans would trust them either after the last 76 days

Oh and let's not forget any males over 16 who get stopped and often detained and taken away when trying to move somewhere safe

Some mysteriously disappear and others come back with signs of torture and abuse

Did you see on the other thread where I mentioned Noa Argamani was not taken by Hamas but taken by normal 'civilians'

Not everyone is innocent. People have to be checked.

Whatever is posted will be excused as Israeli propaganda but what about the head of the hospital... no one appears to have mentioned that. Don't use infrastructure for nefarious purposes then?

nypost.com/2023/12/19/news/gaza-hospital-chief-admits-to-being-hamas-commander/

Yeah the older man who was shot in the leg requiring amputation when being tortured

And then released so presumably didn't have any useful information after all

Thankfully that is going to be investigated

@stomachameleon i have looked and the only thing I can see is a NBC report which thinks that she might have been and there is no evidence for it either. I haven't seen anything official from IDF statements or anyone else so that is just speculation at this point?
Either way it's terrible and I hope that in the next round of hostages released hopefully that she is released and if not then for Hamas to atleast have the minimum decency to confirm if she is alive or not. (Although I don't have much hope of any decency in them)

I haven't actually seen about the Kamal Adwan director. It hasn't been reported in any MSM like sky or BBC so I will look into that.
And whatever Israel attacks is just said Hamas was there and that's the end of it. Does it excuse or justify the thousands killed and the thousands more injured and the thousands more stuck under the rubble? In my opinion no it does not.
The Gazans have no one. A government who doesn't seem to care about them and an army who is indiscriminately killing and maiming them in their thousands. They have every reason not to trust the IDF

An Israeli air attack has taken place, this time close to the Egyptian border, southwest from Rafah city

It would only take a small mis-calculation to hit that wall?

.

@stormy4319trevor more on the 'humanitarian compound'?

Israel’s foreign minister says Israel wants to fast-track the delivery of humanitarian aid to Gaza through a maritime corridor from Cyprus, bolstering stability in the region.

Foreign Minister Eli Cohen told reporters Wednesday after a visit to a center of operations in the coastal town of Larnaca that the well-supervised aid to Gaza would help the region to gain more stability, AP reports.

Always giving shade to UNWRA - I mean intense bombardment of Rafah/Southern Gaza doesn't impair their ability to deliver aid does it? And definitely leads to 'more stability' Depriving UNWRA of fuel really helps them deliver

/

I see The Guardian story suggests that around 70% of buildings are undamaged
(Towards the end if the story adding up aerial footage from all parts they summarised).

@Efacsen

Pasted from the story you linked:

"This amounts to between 67,000 and 88,000 buildings, meaning roughly 70% of buildings remain undamaged. The figure for Khan Younis will have risen since the end of the ceasefire and the concentration of Israeli military activity in the south.' Naturally only the ver damaged areas are being shown. Some suggested that Hamas control what the local journalists are allowed to show.

@Christmascountdownpanic that's interesting and certainly not the way it's being portrayed in the media

When you cover a war and you have bias you don't show areas that are not damaged, you don't show the millions who are not dead or injured. You show the death, destruction and damage. 25000 people dead is absolutely dreadful and a proper ceasefire with hostages released is needed but a population is not being wiped out as some would claim. We never see dead terrorists because a)they dont die or b) it is purposely not shown.

War is horrific and with social media we now see that horror in colour online constantly.

Hamas has caused all this. If you kill 1200 Israelis what do you expect? It is the Israeli 9/11.What else did anyone think would happen? If it happened in the UK we would react along similar lines - it is why we hold nuclear weapons etc. This is war.

As for Hamas using hospitals as cover it is very likely https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/gaza-hospital-chief-admits-to-being-hamas-commander-using-clinic-as-military-base/ar-AA1lKqfz

I've never seen a "war" like this before. No one has.