Why Can't Gazans Leave?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

There is probably a very simple answer to this that I missed in early news reports.

It's so awful watching News Feeds that essentially seem to say that Gazans are having to move around in a cat and mouse game with the IDF to avoid bombs but have nowhere left to go.

I am very aware that war has casualties and other countries are at war. I am not necessarily saying that IDF should stop fighting.

But this war is different in that all civilians seem to be trapped. Normally war creates refugees. Ukrainians, Afghans, Syrians - they were able to get out. Not all, I know, but movement was an option and it kept civilian casualties down. Why can't Gazans leave Gaza?

For example.
or for example
https://www.timesofisrael.com/centrist-mk-says-call-on-european-countries-to-take-gaza-refugees-was-misunderstood/amp/

That is someone accusing Israelis of doing that, not someone suggesting it should be done.

Nope. That poster is replying to someone that is suggesting other countries should take the Palestinian refugees(and probably they won’t be allowed to come back)

Just to clarify I wasn't suggesting that all Gazans should move or be re-located

Just that those who desire a temporary safe passage out should have the option to do so, especially for the sake of the children. The key word 'temporary' as it has become increasingly clear that there are no safe spaces in Gaza. Ofcourse the question and debate on why this came about in the first place is totally separate but just thinking aloud at one practical way to preserve life.

I am also not of the opinion that Israel should not exist. I have my issues with the settlers in the west bank and with the treatment of Palestinians by the Isrseli government and IDF aswell as many unfair practices.
But that does not mean I wish for it to cease to exist and regardless of anyone wishing that, it isn't going to happen.

My wish was to see two states, side by side with equal rights for all and self determination for both. For the leaders to create an environment where this can prosper

It doesn't seem likely any more, especially after yesterday's news of further expansion In the occupied territories which would mean that the Palestinian hope of having east Jerusalem as their capital is further compromised.
Also not with the current state of Gaza being almost uninhabitable after the war ends.

And ofcourse it goes without saying Hamas aswell
But I don't see any possibility at all of Hamas ruling after this war

There's no "temporarily" going out of Gaza. Once they're out, Gazans won't return. A friend of mine works in a company I can't mention, she accessed information that there's talks on investments in Gaza right now. I'm talking about big named hotel chains and luxury resorts. If that is true (which is believable to me given how the war unfolded so far), Gaza is already being treated as Israeli territories and they're formulating actual plans for how Gaza should look like after the war is over.

I’ve seen similar from several different sources.

I understand all your points
But hundreds have been killed in the last 24 hours
This is Gaza right now
If there isn't a ceasefire and they can't leave then they will most likely die

Just for information, nothing to do with the thread really, dozens of Hamas terrorists just surrendered to IDF

These images are from sky news
So verified
If this isn't going to stop then tell me what will be left of the people?
The images coming live from the ground are much much worse
Unbearable to see
We are watching a genocide unfold
Can we atleast not try and save some?

My point is, if a Jewish poster like me really was doing a “fun” thought experiment where I was suggesting we should round up all 5 million Palestinians and drop them in the middle of Germany or Utah so that they can start a new life there, say they should be grateful for having any home at all (and even better, their presence will act as a punishment for the Americans/Nazis) someone would correctly point out that was racist, genocidal talk. The double standards are not even funny - put yourself in my shoes, imagine being Jewish and this is how people talk about you. “Let’s round the Jews up and dump them somewhere in the States and that’ll teach Americans for being too nice to them.” It’s not how minority communities should be talked about.

Because its 2.3 million people https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/factsheet-december-2023-blast-impacts-looking-consequences-explosive-weapons-gaza

The Gaza Strip is one of the most densely populated places in the world, with a total area of 365 km2 (41 km long and 6 km and 12 km wide in the north and the south respectively) housing a population of about 2.3 million

Do you have a link?

https://nypost.com/2023/12/07/news/dozens-of-hamas-terrorists-surrender-to-israeli-soldiers/

Depending on your news source, this is either a mass surrender or the rounding up of every adult male.

They cannot leave wuthout Egypt agreeing, Israel agreeing, hamas agreeing....therewill be no "take in a refugeee" programme as with ukraine ...everyone is complicit in certain death for hundreds if thousands (bombs or disease or hunger...) which is why UN is calling for truce

https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/06/14/gaza-israels-open-air-prison-15

Thanks. They are who I thought would be and have read they are from a school rather than Hamas members (too many people for Hamas members imo )

The shoes in those photos don't look very military. ME journalists have a different take and are including this photo.

link for where you read it?

I’ve seen it on Twitter. I guess the truth of who these men were will soon be known. In my opinion a Hamas member will not surrounded. They will die trying to kill others so really doubt that many have surrendered at the same time, but this is only my opinion.

The NY report says that this was shown on Israeli channel 13 as Hamas members who have surrendered but the IDF haven't commented on it yet

There's conflicting reports on SM on who the men are with many on the ground saying they were civilians who were separated from the women and children from the Jabaliya refugee camp and taken away.

This is not verified yet so personally waiting for further information

Read some of them have been killed in front of their families and others. Even if they were terrorists that have surrounded they posed no threat to those that have arrested them so should go through court rather than being killed.

How do we verify that those are actually Hamas members and not just civilians? The IDF have done the exact same stripping and humiliating scene in the west bank a few weeks ago.

Oh God. I don't like the look of this. I'm getting strong memories of Srebrenica.