Assisted Conception (and the bits in between) Volume 5

[Bumpless]

Thought I'd set us up a new home! kettle's on and choc tin open.

This is a lucky start to our new thread: 2 BFPs and a fantastic fertilisation rate from Dueling!

Boobs and biscuits to everyone

Hi all,
just off to the GP to ask about the test....

Hi all,

BB I have been referred back to the infertility clinic for any tests. The GP thought it seemed a perfectly reasonable request, but also thought that there was no expertise at the surgery in this area and they would feel uncomfortable interpreting any results.
They asked me to phone in a couple of weeks to see what the outcome is.

I don't know if the infertility clinic will play ball or not, but even if they don't we will still go ahead with the embryo adoption. I don't feel very worried about my immune system to be honest, just want to tick a box.

Hi Levi, hope your pregnancy is going smoothly! Much love from me.

My follicles seem to be growing and this protocol seems to be better so far for me. I have fewer follicles than last time but they are much larger which Geeta assures me is a good thing. She pointed out that the idea of this kind of low-stim protocol is to go for quality rather than quantity so here's hoping she is right! I have to say, though, that the Buserelin has turned me into the witch from Hell. I am the moodiest cow that ever lived. Think DH is thinking of moving out.

So, after more scans, I am booked for egg collection on Thursday. My fingers are very firmly crossed for a good result. Hope it works this time. I am not sure how many more cycles I can bear, tbh.

Hi all,

BB you are probably right. Worth a shot though!

Horton hope your DH sticks around long enough to give you a lift to EC! He just needs a hard hat until your trigger shot and then the hard stuff is finished.
I agree about the quality, seems to be the case in the majority of cases I have come across on boards.

Ah, well, maybe the hard stuff might just get harder. I just did the trigger shot but the progesterone pessaries were, erm, a bit problematic from the point of view of my moodiness, tbh.

Actually, I totally think that if DH was behaving like I am now I'd have to leave him. It's really odd. I can hear myself being all whiny and shrieky and unreasonable and mean but I simply can't stop myself doing it.

Very interested in the non-sticking embryo discussion, btw. I do wonder if this is our problem at times - we have no real fertility issues other than age and my mum has a great history of late pregnancies but even last go on IVF with two excellent quality embryos didn't work.

Hi all. How goes it?

Can?t believe it is autumn/September!! Aaaggghh.

Horton all the very best my dear. Hope it goes well and DH does not leave you.

Rowing good luck with box ticking; I know exactly how you feel.

Levi lovely to hear from you.

Keziah what are you up to. Just waiting at the moment? Are you fit as you can be, you could join me at Rosemary Conley!

Frosty are you still around?

Mojangles how goes it?

Idreaminchocolate what is happening with you, are you still lurking and are you getting a new job/going for FET?

I wonder about Isle and Gingerwine are they still lurking or have they gone?

My husband actually said yesterday 'You can't get any bigger or I won?t be able to have sex with you! 'But that was a total joke as he was giving me a cuddle and we were talking about Rosemary Conley at the time - in relation to weight loss not sex!

Still drinking the evil tasting Agnus Castus, still having sex with hubby (fortunately not too fat for that) and still waiting for May when we get to the top of the list.

Love to all.

Cerabina special post for you, thinking of you sweetie.

I am still lurking.

Fingers crossed Horton.

We have now been referred to FC. It was a few weeks ago and the GP said we wouldn't have to wait long to go there but we still haven't heard anything. Am on a bit of a fitness drive at the moment and would like to be able to run 5k so that is something to focus on. Am feeling more toned. But not on a diet. It is nice to have something different to think about. Well focussing on being barren and not having another baby is not good for anyone's mental health. Also, being referred has lightened my mood as was told by my GP that he finds highly strung people find it harder to conceive and I needed to relax. Ho hum. He did refer us though.

Sorry bit of a ramble on and on..

Hi all

Horton best of luck for EC tomorrow and I hope for some top quality eggs for you. The moods sound difficult to manage, for both of you. As much as it is amusing to joke about women's hormones making them irrational it's not much fun when you're mired in it. Is your OH setting you off or is he just bearing the brunt because EVERYTHING sets you off? Maybe it would be a good idea to give him some space so you don't take it out on him too much. Remember the advice about thrashing a pillow when you get the rage! It works for me.

Loujalou I think it does help with positive mental attitude when you get referred. If you are anything like me it is just a relief to think that you aren't responsible for absolutely everything and someone else will take over (eventually). Long term TTC is so draining because you never really get time off, it's always lurking in the back of your brain and you are always waiting to test or planning timings of sex or doing OPKs or checking temperatures etc! It's so exhausting - hope your referral comes through quickly now. Any idea how many goes you would get through your PCT if that's what they recommend, and what the waiting list is like?

Italian keep up the good work with weight loss and exercise. It can only help in all aspects of life and will make you feel so good and in control of things. I agree with you that September seems to have arrived so soon! I was back in tights again for work yesterday which must be a red letter day.

LAW that is a difficult combination of things (due date and OH losing job). Hope you are doing OK in the circumstances, it's understandable to feel low and you should let that stuff out if you want to.

Levi congrats on getting to 19 weeks, that is ace and I hope all continues to go smoothly for you. You must be starting to feel it kick now are you?

I'm 6 weeks today and waiting for my first scan next Friday. No huge symptoms - I feel generally queasy but not needed to be sick, my breasts are getting a bit bigger I think, and my tummy is covered in bruises from the heparin injections. My OH calls me a Friesian because I have these black spodges! I would prefer to have some more obvious symptoms to be honest as it would reassure me that it's not a phantom pregnancy but not long to wait til the scan so I must just be patient!

to anyone I've missed out.

Cerubina as I already have a DS (thankfully) I don't think I will get much but at least they can do all the tests and look at our results in more detail. My DHs sperm count was good but motility not so good so we will see. When I was pregnant I was nauseous but never sick. I have a healthy little boy so all was ok.

Horton--Amen to the shrieky, whiny, bitch from hell. My poor DH is a saint to put up with me, but honestly, men can say the most idiotic and insensitive things and never know or realize the massive amount of s*it they've unleashed. I'm a little over a week down-regging. Good luck with the EC, and hope they get some quality little buggers!

Cerubina and MM--Thinking of you, hoping you feel good...

Italian--How're the teeth?

Lou--Good luck with the FC. Good for you for getting healthier!

Starting work again on Monday after being off for two weeks. (Family that I nanny for was on holiday) I just realized that it's possible my EC will coincide with Yom Kippur, which is not the greatest timing, but what can you do? What will be will be. Still sniffing like a fiend and being cautiously optimistic. Just finished reading The Shack by William Young. It really gives you perspective on the relationship between God and Man. Read it, you won't be sorry!

Thanks, all, for the kind good wishes. I am having half a glass of wine and trying to relax and not be shouty or shrieky. Our extension works mean that relaxing is v thin on the ground at the moment as every single day something goes wrong!

Love to everyone, hope you are all well.

RowingBoat - I've had the Chicago tests via ARGC and they absolutely DON'T include a chlamydia test - it's basically testing cytokines, anti thryoid and anti phospholipid antibodies and then Natural Killer cells. It's dne via 17 (ouch!) vials of venous blood sent out to Chicago. Chlamydia is tested via a swab I think, usually via a GP. I've posted regularly on the Fertility Friends site particularly on the ARGC bit and have never heard of anyone even getting tested for chlamydia never mind testing positive after a few ABs!

The treatment at ARGC really IS intense - they monitor the way your body is reacting to the drugs on a daily basis so that your ovaries are harvested at exactly the right moment - they have very little issues with ovarian hyperstimulation as a result. (and so PCOS girls who traditionally overstimulate easily) do well there, regardless of immunes. They try to only transfer good day 5 or day 6 blasts, and only freeze top quality blasts. Over 70% of their treatment is ICSI rather than straight IVF which then bypasses any possible male factor, and they start treating women who have a history of immune issues before embryo transfer so that the uterus is at its most hospitable.
It's full on, you're expected to be in clinic daily for the whole of stims, including weekends, and towards the end are scanned sometimes twice a day to ensure the ovaries are perfectly ripe.
After transfer, and also after a BFP, treatment for immune issues continues if appropriate - in some women for the whole of the pregnancy, with a cocktail of aspirin, clexane, ritrodine, progesterone, steroids and immunoglobulin, and sometimes a monoclonal antibody.
It's expensive - the basic treatment is the same as anywhere else, it's the additional bloods which bump things up. But their results are phenomenal. And the thing that ISN'T clear from the HFEA success stats is that ARGC get the desperate patients who have usually cycled and failed elsewhere. They're used to a really tough caseload and yet still produce the most fantastic live birth rate.

I have had two cycles there, and no where else (I was getting on a bit when we started so decided to bring in the big guns early!). The first cycle resulted in my son, and I had my second cycle in May and am now almost 20 wks pregnant with twins. We hadn't used ANY contraception for about 4 years, and I have psoriasis and asthma, both of which are immune based. I requested having the Chicagos and when 5 of the results came back out of range, I was treated with steroids. My first BFP was only HCG of 29 on test day and I'd already started bleeding - but they whacked in some steroids, the HCG shot up and the embryo stuck. Every day I think about how close we came to not having him.

Anyway, for anyone with repeated IVF failure elsewhere, I'd say consider seeing ARGC before giving up with your own eggs - it might be just getting them to stick that's the issue. Holly x

BB, if they say no, Dr Amin Gorgy from the Fertility and Gynaecology Academy will test and monitor immunes and do any necessary prescribing regardless of where you have your 'traditional' treatment, or stabilise your immunes whilst you try naturally. I've only heard good things about him and he used to work at ARGC.

Another alternative is Dr.Hassan Shehata, who works part NHS from Epsom and also runs The Miscarriage Clinic in Harley St. He specialises in repeat mc and IVF failure.

The Lister also does immune testing and treatment but not as aggressively as ARGC. so there are a few options to think about! Hope that helps! Holly

Bit of an aside but I feel so sorry for Ffion and William Hague, don't you? As if having repeated miscarriages wasn't awful enough to go through, having hideous, spiteful people making snide comments about the absence of children must be the crowning despair. It would be nice to think that those bloggers and journalists feel completely ashamed of themselves today, but somehow I doubt they do. I just feel so desperately sorry for them that they've had to react to the bullies and share something so private. No justice.

That is really sad that they have been going through all of that :(

Excellent - he's very in demand at the moment! The only criticism I've heard about SHehata is athat he doesn't necessarily treat as aggressively as ARGC or Gorgy, and his testing isn't as extensive. But on the other hand he gets great results particularly in repeated mc.
Before you have any testing , I'd recommend getting hold of Dr. Alan Beer's book, "Is your body baby friendly?" if you haven't already, it's like the bible of immunogynaecology. Incidentally, you won't find any reference to Shehata on fertilityfriends as he asked for all references to him to be removed - if you try and type his name in a post, it's just deleted!!
Very best of luck, I'll look out for your updates!

Cerubina hope your scan goes well and reassures you.

Italian - thanks, yes am "waiting", but good news is have finally got referral to Care sorted, dh got his Menevit started and we go for 1st apt and more tests (a 4th SA for dh and a 2nd transvaginal scan for me!) in 2-3 weeks. So, yes am continuing with healthy eating and exercise - have got my BMI down to what is needed (under 30, about 28ish now)and want to do it very slowly so it stays and doesn't affect anything, just in case!! All the best with your RC regime!

Hi all,
Horton how did you get on??

BoH the test I have seen discussed was 'hidden C'. I think it a particularly stubborn strain of chlamydia. I do admit to finding the whole immune testing topic absolutely mind-boggling.

A couple of the girls at my local clinic went to Dr Gorgy and are both now pg. One girl had suffered multiple early miscarriages after IVF and is now into the second trimester.

Cerubina, good luck with your scan and yes I agree it is awful for Ffion Haig to have this dragged through the press. I can't imagine how she must feel.

Italian glad you are on the mend. I still feel slightly tired from the bug last week, but have managed to drag my giant bum onto the exercise bike (in front of TV) for the past two nights, and peddle for 20 mins.
Better than nothing.
What are you up to?

Lissy Do you think Yom Kippur will affect your treatment? I'm not sure where you are based.

Have not been having much luck in organising the STD test. The appointments are booked quite far ahead and the other option is the dreaded drop-in, which is very busy. Looks like the drop-in it is, otherwise the results may not be returned in time.
Nothing like an 8am visit to an STD clinic - hope it rains too, lovely!

Just four eggs. Really hope some are of decent quality and we get some embryos to put back. Sorry sorry sorry for short message and I am thinking of you all but feeling a bit depressed, tbh.