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Conception

When's the best time to get pregnant? Use our interactive ovulation calculator to work out when you're most fertile and most likely to conceive.

Over 40s TTC & success stories.

999 replies

Grizzer · 18/07/2015 22:20

Starting a new thread for support & advice ladies. Not quite ready to graduate yet!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
11
greenlizard · 23/11/2015 11:22

Welcome city I am quite sure it is not too late for you and your DP but I recall the panicking feeling. I wish you all the luck. I found that throwing everything at it helped me as it felt like I was doing something and if it didn't happen - it wouldn't have been for the lack of trying and therefore it was a "meant to be" sort of thing.

Welcome also Tidesout I went to my GP when I was 43 and explained that we were TTC - I expected her to throw me out on my ear tbh but she ran all the normal tests (3 day, 21 day, thyroid function etc). The only one I had to pay for was the AMH test (which showed that mine was a shockingly low 1.3 just before I conceived the first time naturally). When I was going through fertility treatment, she repeated the tests I needed so I didn't have to pay for them which I thought was very decent of her. I would enlist all the help you can get.

Congratulations on your little girl inshock and good luck with making number 2.

onporpoise · 23/11/2015 11:43

Hi all - I'm really happy to find this thread and see that plenty of other ladies are positive about the outlook over 40, I swing back and forth between feeling ancient/ unlucky and then seeing all the good news (and people I know) that have had babies at my age or older.

Like plenty of you, I just met the right person too late - got pregnant after only 3 months of trying last summer and then had a MMC in Dec. Then I got pregnant again in July, and thought I'd nearly made it to the 'magic' 12 weeks (so much for that) - the NHS testing was really worrying high (1:5 for Downs) so we had a Harmony test and it turned out to be Edwards syndrome, so I had to terminate last month - it was devastating. It was a horrific couple of months, and I turned 41 the week after the termination. I'm physically back to normal now and just really aware of my age, so we're going to see how it goes again. I wasn't sure I would be able to go through the whole thing again, but it feels as though we should have one last try/ I know so many people have been through the same and much worse.

I was very lucky that it happened easily the first couple of times (and we really wanted to avoid TTC-related stress as much as possible), but I'm wondering about temping etc this time, just so I at least have some idea of what's going on!

Good luck to you all...

ChewyGiraffe · 23/11/2015 13:40

Catching up again – totally agree Onporpoise, it’s so encouraging that there’s plenty on here giving it a good go! I’m so sorry to read of your TMFR – that must’ve been really hard. Of course that was very, very tough luck, but there’s no reason why your next pregnancy couldn’t work out beautifully for you. 41 is still pretty young after all – on an age basis alone, the NHS would still offer you fertility treatment, although you seem to have fallen pregnant quite easily, which has to be a positive). Personally I find temping too difficult, so I can’t offer any advice, but you should find a few fans on here I think. Have you tried OPK’s?

Oh Green – what a very handsome little chap – he’s absolutely yummy scrummy! Star

I'll keep my fingers crossed for your FET – and for trying naturally meanwhile. Do you get a natural go in December too (i.e. the cycle when you have your pre-treatment scan)? On the subject of FET – I’ve just written a baby congratulations card for a couple who started with a frozen embryo – they said they didn’t expect it to work but obviously it did work beautifully and they’ve since found that FET can often work better (is it down to fewer drugs and inflammation, or something?).
Thanks for putting a positive spin on our timing – when scan info overload might’ve been counter-productive this month. BTW – as regards the cycle monitoring I’ve had: I found an independent clinic who only do gynae/early pregnancy scans and bloods (and email images/reports into IVF clinics if someone’s having long-distance treatment). All the sonographers trained in NHS (some still work P-T in NHS too) and are v well qualified. Each scan works out massively cheaper than within London IVF clinic (almost 1/3 price). Maybe there’s something similar near you?

Inshock - many congrats on your baby DD too – 6/7 months is such a gorgeous age, hope you’re enjoying her! Do let us know when you decide to start trying for baby #2 – and perhaps (although hopefully for only a very short while) you’ll hang out here too.

Tidesout - Good luck for your 2ww. V positive that your day 21 progesterone test was good. My GP took a similar view on blood tests to Green’s GP. I’m obviously not entitled to NHS IVF, but my GP has still requested the basic blood tests (day 3 FSH/LH and day 21 progesterone) a couple of times over the past year, just on the basis that we were trying. On the other hand, DP’s doctor wouldn’t do a sperm analysis on the NHS. He self-referred to our local NHS hospital fertility clinic as a private patient and got one done for £72.

Twinkly - Good luck for your 2ww too – should we expect a bumper crop of BFP’s soon? And great effort with all those supplements! Hope you don’t mind me saying that I wouldn’t alternate your days for taking Pregnacare Conception – if only for the Folic Acid, as I think it’s best to have your Folic Acid every day?

Ababs - Sounds like a great plan for you to sit this month out for some R&R and extra time for supplements to work their magic. I know I couldn’t TTC for quite some while after medical management of my MMC last year – I was just too upset. I was curious to find whether you’d had any specific advice about getting the medical management drugs out of your system though (I didn’t have any)?

LOL at having a ‘relaxing’ time TTC with a 23 month old! I reckon my 28 month old DD has Duracell batteries as she’s a very poor sleeper – so I can see how the Christmas holidays and some judicious use of daytime nap time could help Wink

City - I know it’s natural to worry (I have the T-shirt), but I hope you appreciate that you’re actually in a very strong position. Yes it must have hurt when your Mum said you would’ve had children by now if it was ever going to happen, but you need to remind yourself that whatever your Mum (or the Daily Mail, or whoever) says, doesn’t have the slightest influence over whether it actually will happen. Obviously I can't second guess what she meant, but perhaps she made that comment without thinking, or to rationalise her own expectations of having grandchildren (or more grandchildren), or to protect you from any further pain from broken aspirations given that your husband had just left. Plus as you were single at the time, no-one could’ve predicted you’d meet your now DP so (relatively) soon, whereas your Mum might come from a generation where single parenthood was less 'acceptable' (not a good word, sorry), or even possible .... yet you’ll notice women on these threads who are TTC, single and over 40 - and more power to their elbow, frankly.

I do know someone in RL who, childfree at 36, unfortunately was diagnosed with premature ovarian failure. She happened to deal with her infertility by buying a f*ck off big house which has become the vibrant hub for extended family get togethers. But that clearly isn’t your situation. An FSH of 5.7 is great. Your FSH/LH ratio of about 1:1 is perfect. No one would consider your FSH to be even mildly elevated (i.e. not such a good thing) until it was at least 8, and not even the most stringent IVF clinic would exclude you until it was over 10. (Many clinics treat FSH levels up to 15 and a few ignore it entirely.) If your ultrasound scans have been described as “very active” then you should be very re-assured by that – it’s a pretty objective assessment and Sonographers don’t tend to mince their words in my experience. (I’ve been on the receiving end of the opposite - “very low reserve” - type of comment. And that was even before I conceived my DD aged 43.) On that basis, you’d expect your AMH results to be fab too.

So I'm sure you'll be fine. The one thing you could maybe do is check on your protein vs carb intake. There’s been studies finding that female IVF patients whose daily protein intake was 25% - 35% of their diet and whose carbohydrate intake was 40% or less of their diet, in the 3 months before IVF, had four times the pregnancy rates of patients who ate less protein and more carbs daily: link to high protein low carb.

I too was veggie for about 25 years – until I weaned my DD, now 2, and decided that 3 separate meals every mealtime was going to be way too much hassle. (Plus once I’d finally plucked up the courage to taste whatever meat casserole I was blending for her, I was pretty much over it.) Likely you’re better at being vegetarian than I was, but I know I struggled to eat enough protein – plus I’ve always had a tendency towards being anaemic too.

I guess you could also send your DP for a sperm analysis – just to check nothing’s changed since he had his children. It gave my DP a bit of a kick up the backside to improve his diet – and his SA has improved lately.

Hi to Jass if you’re still around. Hope all is well with you.

Lots of luck to everyone.

citybumpkin · 23/11/2015 17:06

Hello there Chewy (love the name) and thanks for the lengthy response.

It took a while to pair up with the new OH (we had been friends for years) due to a reluctance to really move on. Its still a struggle but new OH is very caring, sensitive etc. I'm concerned slightly about his age (just turned 54) but he already has two DC so there must be some good fertility in there?

I have no idea about all the data/stats so any interpretation is very much welcome. My concern was the high estradiol level (177 pg/ml) which I've read can suppress the FSH so it appears to be normal?! OH has agreed to a SA. As said we are both reasonably fit/healthy but I just keep thinking that is no real reassurance.

TwinklyMusic · 24/11/2015 00:39

Hi everyone, nice to see it so busy here again! Smile Welcome to all the new people and the de-lurkers!

Wow Chewy that was a mega post! I'm really impressed the way you remembered everyone's individual concerns!

It's good to hear how you are doing. I'm glad you came to a solution to your IVF now or after DHEa dilemma. It sounds like a good way forward. I'm looking forward to hearing how you get on with it.

I don't take folic acid every second day, don't worry! Any day I don't take Pregnacare, I take a B complex vitamin that has similar or higher doses of all the B vitamins, including folic acid. There is also folic acid in some other supplements, so it should be well covered!

My tww wait ended with the early arrival of AF unfortunately. Time for a glass of wine or two to numb the disappointment...

Beautiful baby Green! Fingers crossed for sibling!

How are you doing ababs?

Anyone know how the graduates are doing?

TwinklyMusic · 24/11/2015 00:45

Chewy, I meant I am looking forward to hearing how you get on with DHEA (I read it back and it didn't sound quite right!). I should add that I've been curious about this and thought about trying (well, I'm pretty much taking everything else.. Confused).

ChewyGiraffe · 24/11/2015 09:38

City - Hmm, the username is from that ubiquitous rubber giraffe teether that all babies seem to have. For ages my DD was inseparable from hers, but it all seems like a very long time ago now. Perhaps I should name change but can't be ar**d - and continuing a favourite toy theme would have me down as 'FisherPriceSyringe' or something equally odd.

Did you mean that your separation from your Ex is 'still a struggle'? If so, I'm sorry to hear that, but having let a bad break-up derail my own life for a long time, just don't do it to yourself. Your new DP sounds lovely and crucially, shares your wish to have a child/children, which Ex/Tosspot didn't. No contest.

I've heard a bit about that thing you mentioned re high estradiol suppressing FSH to an artificially low level. I've a vague recollection of Googling it once and that it needs to be somewhere over 200 to have that type of impact. But I think there's also more than one set of units of measure for estradiol, so I don't know really. Important thing is that your GP said it was "fine" and your scan showed "very active" ovaries (which wouldn't correlate with an estradiol issue at all).

Male age isn't really an issue is it? Not if that famous 56-year old new dad, Simon Cowell is anything to go by. But I guess you could have less than optimal sperm at any age (surely unlikely to be anything serious as he has kids already) so still worth testing, probably.

Twinkly - oh boo for AF this time round. Onwards and upwards - glad to hear you've got all your bases covered with those supplements.

Yes sorry for mega post yesterday. I was having a very productive day surfing the f*cking internet 'working at home' as you can tell!

I think I've done nearly 4 weeks of DHEA so far and feel fine - no drastic side effects that I've noticed. I've probably only got a few months left of TTC, so we're trying to throw more or less everything at it - although why I can't seem to give up caffeine is a total freakin' mystery to me.

Anyway I found the report below reasonably encouraging (from an IVF clinic in New York who reckon they started the whole DHEA thing):
"... We recently discharged into obstetrical care a 46 year and 9 months old female, who spontaneously had conceived after 6 weeks of DHEA, while waiting to start an IVF cycle after the usual 2 months of DHEA supplementation. This case represents so far the oldest female with a DHEA pregnancy established at CHR ..." August 1st, 2008 Link to article

So for me this cycle - we DTD on CD 11, 12, 13 and 14. Had a positive OPK in the evening of CD13 that was still positive in the morning of CD14. I think that's it now - the idea of sex just for fun seems quite bizarre at the moment!

citybumpkin · 24/11/2015 13:36

Sorry greenlizard miss you out on a previous message! It's hard to keep track of everyone being new. What a lovely bundle of fun you have there! Gorgeous!

chewy I assumed your username came from the toy. My niece had one and wasn't particularly keen. She preferred chewing the Nemo I bought her from the sealife centre. The ex did want kids when I was about 36 but by that point I was doing a masters degree (to replace the missing child) and was concerned about how he would cope due to working 7 days per week on his business. I came off the pill 4 years ago to get my body in order just in case. Seriously thought about it at the end of 2013 as I thought the relationship was okay and I wasn't getting any younger but BAM, 4 months later he leaves. Feeling that I should have said yes when he wanted them.

Thanks for the positive vibes re the old test results. New results due on Friday.

ababsurdum · 24/11/2015 14:14

Hi all, lovely to see the thread busy Smile. Welcome to all the new people.

Chewy you've had a difficult and busy few months! I do think getting tests feels like you are doing something. I felt the same when we did IVF after a year of ttc with no luck. I'm no help interpreting test results as I only had an AMH test before moving directly to private IVF. I assumed the NHS wouldn't do anything, at least not in the timescale we needed.

I'm interested to hear you've had no adverse effects from the DHEA, I've been put off by the potential side effects but if we don't conceive in the first couple of months I might use it to up the ante.

I was told by the nurse when I had my medical management to wait a couple of months before ttc. I was not given a PIL but dr Google seems to say 1 month or 1 full cycle. I guess I'm erring on the side of caution plus wanting time for supplements to work.

Luckily my ds sleeps pretty well but is usually up about 5:30 zzzzz

Greenlizzard your ds is gorgeous! You made me laugh with your 'fill her up' approach. We tend to do eod leading up to ovulation and daily over the peak days. I also try to go by cervical mucous and if it's good then go for it!

Onporpoise I'm so sorry for what you've been through, it must have been awful Flowers. I found temping a real pain and only really useful to confirm you're ovulating. I gave up after a few months.

Twinkly I'm sorry to hear AF came for you, the witch. Here's to next month and a Christmas BFP.

As for me... I'm taking the supplements, handful of nuts every day etc. This week I've resorted to substituting lunch for a green smoothie in order to try and lose some weight (I'm about 10 st but was 9.4 before getting pregnant with ds, I'd be happy at 9.7 maybe). I'm rubbish with meal planning lunches for myself anyway so this makes it easier frankly.

I'll be interested to see when I ovulate this month and how long my cycle is. I'm usually 27 days, ovulating about day 15, but cycle length does vary by a day or two sometimes now I'm older.

Sorry for anyone I've missed. And good luck for all of you trying now or in tww. Let's hope for some spontaneous conceptions before IVF/frozen cycles in the NY! (For any of you new to IVF it sounds awful but I really didn't find it that bad, I guess I was pretty lucky in that respect. Ultimately, although it went well it didn't work for us though luckily I conceived ds the following month.)

ababsurdum · 25/11/2015 11:35

Twinkly in your first cycle after your mc did you continue to spot? I'm on cd9 here and starting to get ewcm but it's tinged with blood. I'm assuming this is just getting back to normal after the mc? I'm not too concerned about it but just curious.

onporpoise · 25/11/2015 18:09

Hi all, and Abab and Chewy, thanks very much for the kind words and encouragement. It does sound that the temping might be a nuisance! I'll try for a month or so and hopefully it will at least show that I'm ovulating (I have a - hopefully irrational - fear that it will just stop happening without much warning). I haven't tried OPKs but maybe that's easier all round - so again, thanks for the advice!

Apart from that, I'll stick with the supplements and just hope that my cycle doesn't stretch to 38-40 days as it had after the MMC. It's good to hear what everyone else is trying / share this with you ladies - I'm trying not to keep banging on about when I may or may not be ovulating to my husband as we agreed to try and be relaxed about TTC! (I wish I could be truly relaxed, but it's really hard to have that attitude at this age/ knowing that even if I get pregnant it won't necessarily be straightforward! However, I'll remember the positive words above, thanks again:).

Best wishes to everyone, and looking forward to getting to know who's who a bit more!

ChewyGiraffe · 25/11/2015 18:42

Onporpoise - so glad you're not letting my own laziness put you off temping! I just found it hard to take my temp at roughly the same time each morning (and without having got up in the night to see to DD etc). Yet plenty of women seem to manage to set an alarm for it, so no idea why I found it such a faff.

Have you seen the fertility friend app which creates charts and lots of (highly addictive) stats for you? Personally I'd try some OPKs whether you do the charting or not. I prefer the OPKs because of course, OPKs are supposed to give you 'advance warning' of ovulation, whereas charting only shows a pattern in retrospect. On the other hand if you're doing both, you can input the positive OPK into the FF app and that helps to interpret the chart.

Ababs - TMI alert - I don't think I spotted during the cycle after my MMC, but given the amount/length of MC bleeding was perhaps not surprising ... I do remember the post-MC cycle was looong though. Hope you're taking care of yourself and ready for your Christmas holiday TTC-athon.

Well I'm about 2 DPO and just caught myself Googling early pregnancy symptoms! Blush FFS shoot me now

ababsurdum · 26/11/2015 08:39

Ha ha Chewy, what ttc does to an otherwise rational woman! Fingers crossed you get a bfp this month.

Onporpoise definitely use opk's. It's really important knowing when you're ovulating so you're not wasting dtd. From memory I think you start using them on CD10 (depending on your cycle length). I will usually do 2-3 a day over the key days as in my experience the peak can sometimes be missed if you're only testing once a day. Of course temping is free but opk's aren't. I read you can buy them in the pound shops though.

TwinklyMusic · 27/11/2015 09:39

ababs I think it finished more abruptly that usual, but spotting rings a bell. I know from previous mcs too that the first cycle after mc can be a really wonky one!

Can the DHEA informed people remind me, when in the cycle is it supposed to be taken? And are its benefits different to Agnus Castus?

I'm not a huge Agnus Castus fan, as I think it has side effects for me that bother me (moodiness and some breast twinges that have nothing to do with where I am in my cycle). However, it definitely seemed to lengthen my cycle back to 28 days a few months back, after which I got pregnant. So I've put myself back on it (as my last cycle had dropped to 26 days again).

Anyone have knowledge or advice?

On temping - I'm with Chewy in that no matter how much I try, I don't seem capable of organising myself to temp at the same time every day! Invariably I fall asleep again and forget what it said, or just forget to take it. I can't even blame waking to look after a toddler as my youngest is now 5!!!

ChewyGiraffe · 28/11/2015 12:24

Hi Twinkly and Ababs - Where is everybody else? I'm hoping I don't have to change my user name to 'threadkiller'?

Anyway - for anyone taking a leave of absence - hope you're all off having a lovely weekend getting/being pregnant!

Twinkly - about your question on DHEA - can I say this with a health warning that if anyone thinks I'm talking crap, please do correct me!

I've tried to read a bit about DHEA - mainly from that "it starts with the egg" book, plus bits and pieces published by CHR (Dr Norman Gleicher), which is an IVF clinic in New York that have done research into DHEA, and claim to have started the whole thing off (they have patents for using it as a fertility treatment). There's a link to CHR's website here: link to CHR (which also has links within that to their published articles etc).

DHEA is definitely supposed to improve egg quality. It might also perhaps (I'm less certain about this next bit) increase follicle counts and AMH. There's supposed to be a measurable decrease in miscarriage rates / increase in live births, following conceptions after DHEA. (I read somewhere that CHR claim to have had over 50 live births in patients who had very, very low and undetectable levels of AMH since they have begun supplementing this group of patients with DHEA.)

It tends to be recommended for everyone TTC over 40, but excluding anyone with PCOS. The typical dose is 25mg three times daily (i.e. 75mg total per day). The only reason I've seen given for splitting the dose is to avoid stomach upsets. Its supposed to be taken for three to four months before maximum benefit is reached, but they say there's a statistically significant improvement in conception + miscarriage rates after just 6 - 8 weeks. (I'm not clear what you're supposed to do if you had taken it for 4 months without conceiving - have a break perhaps? Although you certainly read of IVF patients who have taken it for longer.)

You definitely don't take it when you are pregnant - which would suggest that you shouldn't take it in the 2ww either. However, CHR's advice is to stop taking it once pregnancy is confirmed by a second "normally rising" HCG test. As this is from the USA IVF context, I assume they probably mean a blood test, rather than a POAS. However, although blood tests would detect a pregnancy earlier than weeing on a stick, if they're waiting for a second one, its probably about the same.

In fact, I'd been taking DHEA - albeit very briefly - when I conceived my DD (who's now 28 months, 95th centile height/weight and perfectly healthy and bright). I'd started taking it about 2 weeks before the start of the cycle I conceived, so I can't think I'd been taking it for anywhere near long enough for it to have made any difference to conception (i.e. as to whether I conceived or not) but I just mention it because I did carry on taking it until 11DPO (the day of my positive test) without any apparent ill effects.

I don't know much at all about Agnus Castus, except that some people think that it helps to regulate your menstrual cycle and I think there are theories about only taking it in half of your cycle - except I can't remember which! I don't think its even mentioned by Rebecca Fett in "it starts with the egg"?

I hope that maybe helps a little bit?

I'm 5DPO, not feeling at all pregnant, so pretty sad and pissed off ... Sad.

Must be time for Chocolate Biscuit Cake

citybumpkin · 28/11/2015 12:59

Hey Chewy! Still alive and in Amsterdam. Interesting stuff on DHEA. I'm not considering it just yet. Opted for pregnacare and COQ10. Had reasonably good ORT results back yesterday. Hope all is well.

ababsurdum · 28/11/2015 14:06

Chewy at 5 dpo it wouldn't have even implanted so there's still time yet.

I got a few toddler free hours this morning to go Christmas shopping and it was lovely and quite productive. Gap has 50% off everything (40% online) which seems crazy but is fab. Lots of other offers too.

Thanks for the info on DHEA chewy, I am sorely tempted to give it a try. I'm still bleeding lightly here which is a real pain. Trying not to think the worst (perimenapause!) but haven't yet googled to see how common it is post mc. Dh suggested I call the epu which is probably a good idea.

Hope you're doing ok twinkly.

City I bet Amsterdam is freezing? I love it there but very cold this time of the year.

citybumpkin · 28/11/2015 15:53

Ababs Its not too cold TBH. Refraining from mulled wine isn't fun though Sad

TwinklyMusic · 29/11/2015 02:15

Really, really helpful on the DHEA, Chewy, thanks! I know it's all been explained on this thread before, but it helps to be reminded. Thanks also for the links - I'll read through the research. Perhaps I'll give it a go for a couple of months and see what happens... I'll have a think about it.

Is Amsterdam work or treat City?

Ababs I'm really sorry you are still having problems. Not fair! It's probably no harm trying the EPU. I'm trying to remember my first period post mc (I've properly boxed it away!!). I think that although the normal flow stopped sooner than usual, there was some occasional light blood (when wiping, sorry TMI) for a while. It might just be things are still settling back to normal.

I'm ok, thanks for asking. I've had some really good days, but also some moments where I get a sudden flash of what happened and it's almost overwhelming. I'm quite desperate to keep a lid on it and be positive. I absolutely know I'm repressing and that's bad yadayadaya... but I wouldn't be able to focus on ttc or work or the million other things I have to worry about if i didn't. I'll deal with it later.... Confused

How about you? How are you holding up?

citybumpkin · 29/11/2015 14:04

Twinkly I dont think there is ever TMI when talking about these things. The more you/we share the more informed we are about what is normal/abnormal. Keep on sharing!

Amsterdam for pleasure. With DP trying to relax. Its rained much of the weekend so unfortunately we've had to spend a lot of time indoors Wink

ababsurdum · 29/11/2015 15:50

Twinkly sorry you're having some down days, it's a horrible thing to go through. I'm ok thank you, basically just not really thinking about it. I guess I was half expecting bad news somewhere down the line as it all seemed too easy conceiving straight away.

City it's a shame you've not been able to get out much, it's a lovely city for walks. Why are you not partaking of mulled wine?

citybumpkin · 29/11/2015 16:11

Ababs it is wonderful in the Nether Regions. DP works part time here so I get to see a lot of it. This is big crappy rain at the mo so not pleasant. Staying in as ermmmm... OPK says go girl go?!

citybumpkin · 29/11/2015 16:12

Oh and trying to abstain from wine. Worried how it may affect TTC.

citybumpkin · 29/11/2015 16:15

Sorry wifi intermittent as at airport. Fell off the TTC/abstinence wagon due to flight delay. Crapstix. I'm struggling with this TTC journey already. Those of you who have been "on the road" for months are just remarkable. It takes a massive strength of character to persevere and I really do applaud and hug you. So there.

ababsurdum · 29/11/2015 20:00

Ha ha, I'm sure it is city Wink

Don't be too hard on yourself, you have to live your life too. I think the 80/20 rule is very appropriate for ttc, you can't let it take over completely IMO.