Yo yo!! Calling all Ladybros over 30 TTC #1. Join the Berries aboard the Charabanc of lurrrve. Bring real Champagne, from the actual Champagne region. No Colombian builders allowed.

[happylass]

The small print:

The Berries have strict entrance criteria: TTC #1 for 12 months+, over 30, NO instadiffers, must have a special pimping pot and absolutely no mention of baby dust/dancing. Not that we're fussy

Current passengers

WildflowerMarmalade 40 - TTC for three years. FET done in June with immune treatments - waiting for result... Six embryos in the freezer after two freeze all cycles.

Minx 35 in August - TTC 2 years. Stage 4 endometriosis, both tubes blocked, 1 buried ovary, IVF booking in appt in July, hoping to start IVF soon after

Smidge 39, TTC since Jan '13. Unexplained. IVF#1 Short protocol July '14 BFN, IVF#2 Nov'14 and IVF#3 Feb '15 both Long protocol BFNs. High NK cell immune treatment. Natural FET in June '15, awaiting result.

Happylass, 37, TTC since Aug 2012. 2 failed ICSI cycles and 1 failed FET. Hoping to start long awaited NHS cycles in late August provided pesky smear test is sorted by then.

Beaky 35, ttc coming up 3 yrs, 2x failed iui 1x long protocol ivf cancelled 1 BFN following IVF

Tigerdog, 34 (soon to be 35) TTC since Jan 2013. Unexplained. IVF#1 May 2015 resulted in a chemical pregnancy. Now transferring clinics in the hope of a second round of IVF on the NHS and considering an NK cells biopsy in July/August.

barkingtreefrog 36, ttc 3.5 years. clomid bfp summer 2013 then mc @7 weeks, iui bfp summer 2014 then mc @6 weeks. Factor V leiden thrombophilia diagnosed at the repeat mc clinic. IUI bfn Jan 2015, IVF bfn April/May 2015. Currently awaiting nk cells results before a FET possibly in August/September.

Lumen, 35, ttc since Nov 2011, unexplained, two IVF cycles in 2014, both bfns, waiting for lap&dye and results of numerous bloods, aiming for one last IVF cycle.

Kuma - 40. TTC 2.5 years. Low AMH high FSH - DH antisperm ABs. Failed IVF June 14 and March 15. Looking to change clinic and try another natural cycle in June 2015.

Lucieloos, 35, TTC 18 months, low AMH & sperm motility. 1st ICSI in Czech Republic in April BFN.

Rain, 33 ttc since March 2012. unexplained. mystery bfp oct 13, MMC Nov 13. NHS IVF starting in June

Lucie what a weird appointment. Was she the nurse who scanned you on Tuesday? She doesn't sound very competent to be frank. I think you're still doing the right thing going ahead to Prague, and at least you get a scan before deciding whether to trigger. Your biggest ones may be too big if you go past Saturday and that affects their quality anyway. Fingers crossed for you but do let us know how you get on, I hope you have a better sonograper over there.

Tiger sorry to hear you've had another announcement, it's so shitty. At least you've a couple of days off work now too and you can have plenty of cuddles with tigerpup! I think you're right to speak to your clinic next week and see what their opinion is of the tests, then you can make an informed decision on whether to spend all of that money or not. I'll get some real champagne from the champagne region for our gloomy gazebo, that may cheer us up. I need to start the catching rainbows meditation again as I'd forgotten about it!

Clem sorry you're having a tough time, it's a real nightmare having the stress and then hormones on top of that. In terms of supplements I take pregnacare, 75mg vit d, 300mg coq10 and 75mg of dhea a day, but the last one is because of low/diminished ovarian reserve (DOR) but I think most people take what they think is right for their own situation. There is one thing that's supposed to help with ewcm but I cannot remember what that is, maybe a b vit? One of the other berries must know.

Minx any sign of af?

Sesame any news from your clinic?

Sorry Spare x post. What kind of weird? Maybe cut the dose down and see how you feel? Are you taking anything else which could make you feel unusual?

How annoying that they won't tell you over the phone! Arghh. Fx it arrives tomorrow for you and it's good news.

Arrrgh just typed a huge post and lost it all. Bloody wifi!
To summarise....
Lucie sorry you've had another stressful scan. There are discrepancies between the 3 nurses that scan at CRGW - they admit that themselves. 15mm sounds fine (CRGW look for 18mm and some of mine have gone over 20) and I think you are doing totally the right thing going to Czech tomorrow. Keeping everything crossed for you - keep us posted.
Spare feeling strange how exactly? I'm intrigued!

tiger a few days off sounds really nice, hope you can relax away from all the same old shit at least for a little while

lucie despite the arsey nurse, it sounds like you’ve got a good few follicles still in the game. Best of luck for your trip to Czech.

Hi clem nice to see you. Sorry about all the menopause shizzle, but hopefully that means it’s working…. I think there is indeed a supplement for improving CM, but I can’t remember either If you haven’t already tried it, you might also think about getting some preseed as a non TTCer I don’t know for the life of me why I need to know all these random facts-

spare sorry about the crapness of the CCG, hope you get that letter soon! No idea about the CoQ10 I’m afraid, I’ve only been on it a few days.

beaky what’s the 75mg Vit D all about? That’s loads higher than RDA isn’t it?

Thanks for all your support berries. I’ve had a pretty full on day at work today, so not as much time for wallowing in the gazebo. And, although I’ve been indoors since 8.30am, there is at least some stunning sunshine outside my window, so no rainy BBQs…. Regarding treatment, there is a new protocol, but I asked the nurse lots of questions about it (e.g. can I stab instead of sniff?) which she couldn’t answer, and my consultant is on hols so she went to ask another director. That guy went back to the nurse to say the new protocol won’t work, I could ovulate too early, and suggested I go on a LP (I did LP in first clinic I went to, and it was a complete disaster). I nearly cried when nurse rang to tell me all this yesterday. Anyway, consultant gets back from hols on Monday, so I have to keep taking the norethisterone until he gets back and then fingers crossed I’ll know more.

spare hope the letter arrives Asap. I also have no idea r.e. CoQ10 but weird isn't good.

clem sorry to hear about the headaches. I have been suffering them too with downregging, although thankfully they seem to have gone now. I tried all sorts of supplements etc. at various points but our clinic have told me to just stick to a pregnancy vit, so just on the usual pregnacare conception one now. I was taking Agnus Castus when I had my one off diff - but I had also had a hycosy a couple of cycles before, which I think probably had more to do with it.

tiger I feel your pain. Haven't had any announcements my way for a few months now which means one will be coming any second now. Most of my friends who got pregnant straight away around the time we started trying are talking about number two, so am expecting a total flurry

lucie what a frustrating and disappointing appointment, that nurse sounds rubbish! Glad your DH was there and on the ball - fingers crossed you see more sensible numbers when you get to Czech. - have a safe trip!

sesame hope you get a better plan when your consultant is back. What went wrong when you were on LP, if you don't mind me asking?

Started stims tonight - the mixing is a faff (and I can't see how I can combine this phase with any sort of post work London social life, will have to come home to do it and there's bugger all to do in our home town!). Hermits life for me!
Stim jab is less painful than the DR but harder to administer so far. I drew quite a bit of blood with the DR jab tonight. Totally my own fault. It didn't want to go in so I pulled it back to try somewhere else, then realised it had gone in a bit so pushed back in. Cue pain, swearing, blood and no doubt a massive bruise tomorrow. Might ask DH to help out next one, he should share in the fun

Thanks everyone, I feel a bit disappointed about it all tonight. Looking at it realistically I can only see us collecting 4 eggs. They probably won't all fertilise so we could be left with only 1 or 2 I just have a feeling this isn't going to go well.

Don't worry rain there's a reason why LP is the go to protocol in every clinic. It works. But everyone reacts differently to treatment and as I had very low ovarian reserve my body didn't respond very well. After DR it took weeks of stims to get to egg collection and by that point the egg quality was affected.

Lucie you're still in game, you're doing everything possible to make this work out and even with a few follies age is still on your side. Did you ever try LP by the way? What's your AMH?

No I did short antagonist the first time sesame and we got 6 mature eggs and all fertilised. My amh is only 7.3pmol so not great but could be worse. I can't seem to get more than about 6 eggs though but I see women with lower amhs get many more.

Well that's a very good fertilisation rate which should also work in your favour. This is most likely going to be the lucky one for you, but if it doesn't work out you could try out a LP. There's a lot of having about, but it's meant to help follicles grow evenly and premature ovulation is almost unheard of.

Lucie my AMH is lower than yours and I got 7 mature eggs the first time and 11 the second so it is possible to get a decent haul and get more second time around. Also remember it's quality not quantity. Although I get a relatively low number of eggs I've ended up with more at blast than some women who have had 3 times the number of eggs that I have. So please don't despair. Everything crossed for you.

Hi Berries,

You all seam to have a very busy week with stabs/scans/checks and way too much waiting around.

Hope you all okay!

I had my consultation yesterday - will actually get out the starting gates soon!!!

• my list of questions went out the window.
• I have a polyp they have booked me in for removal in 6-8 weeks time.
• got the unexplained diagnosis.
• Asked why not more tests as irregular cycles (14 to 41 days) they said the problems associated with the short/long didn't show in my tests - they could continue to test but difficult with the irregular cycles and could spend months trying to pinpoint the issue - so why do it, skip stage and go straight to IVF!
• Our area recommend 3 x IUI even for unexplained, they said if it saves 20 out of 100 couples going through IVF its worth it but I could go straight to IVF if i wanted. Decided to give IUI a chance first (no idea if that was good/bad choice but all to be discussed in more depth at FC before a final decision)
• So plan is ATM Potentially is - Sept/OCT - OPP, NOV-JAN IUI up to 3 rounds. MAR/APR IVF.

• So many questions I should have asked!!!
• DH on his optimistic Bubble again swears we will have the BFP by xmas - already trying to discus maternity leave and when I'll go back to work, even said how long till we try for No 2! Get real love!!!

Any ho,,,at least I have a focus for my research - IUI v's straight to IVF,,,any thoughts???

Thanks happy, my body just can't seem to produce more than 6 eggs I don't know why. I think it may be because my follicle growth is quite uneven so in the past I've had one or two larger ones which means the smaller ones can't catch up. This time around though I've only had 8 follicles altogether. On my previous rounds more have popped up as stimming has gone on. I only got 2 blasts out of 6 fertilised last time so my success rate is that great there either.

Sesame, I have thought of long protocol but like you I'm just worried it would suppress my ovaries too much. I wonder if that is what has happened this time as have been on buserelin since day 1.

Minx, thank you, I really hope things improve in Czech. Glad af has finally arrived for you and you can get started.

Lucie the amount of follicles/eggs you get each cycle is predetermined and they can see how many antral follicles you have each cycle at the start during your baseline scan, so it's less to do with your amh and more to do with your antral follicle count. Did you have a baseline this time? Best of luck for this weekend, I hope you get your bfp this time.

Minx I absolutely laughed my head off out loud at your dh sucking up air and thinking he'd got the liquid! Also, woohooooo that af is here! We will probably be scan buddies next week! I'm so pleased that you'll be able to get going.

KL lol at your dh, how canny! I've had 2 iui's, the first was medicated and was a bfn, the second was because I didn't respond to long protocol IVF so they downgraded it to an iui but that was a bfn too. Any questions about it let me know, but I think it's worth a try, especially if you don't get much of an IVF allowance. Sorry about the polyp though, did they say if that would be having an effect?

Rain ooo that sounds so painful! I bet you have a rainbow bruise tomorrow. How are you feeling generally now?

Took my last pill today, fx all is well at the scan next week and I can start stimming. Eek.

No I didn't have a baseline beaky. It just seems like no matter how many follicles I have growing only 6 ever seem to be mature enough to collect.

Sorry, I didn't explain that very well did I! Basically at the start of your cycle you can see how many potential follicles you have on a scan and whatever you do after that, different meds/doses etc won't enable you to get anymore follicles than what is there to start with. So I only ever have 2/3 antral follicles on each side, and so I'll only ever have a maximum of 6 follicles/eggs. But usually you won't get growth from all of the follicles anyway.

Weirdly no sign of a bruise at all yet! Maybe I got away with it, we shall see....

minx praise be for AF finally rocking up! I also laughed (loudly, in a very quiet office) at DH with the air! Maybe I should rethink my spousal support plan...

beaky fx for the scan and roll on those September bfps!

kl iui is funded in our area and we are also unexplained but our referring consultant was very much of the opinion that she thought iui was a waste of time given the reduced success rates and that if we hadn't conceived within the three years required before any nhs funded fertility treatment we'd be better off going straight to IVF. To be honest I've never really considered how I felt about that as we basically weren't really given the choice!!

Hurrah, a toast to af minx! Glad that you're on to the next stage. It is all so unpredictable. I did chuckle at your DH, bless him.

spare I really hope the decision goes your way.

lucie I agree with happy. I had well over 20 follicles and something like 11 eggs but only ended up with two blasts, neither top grade. So quantity does not mean quality! Will be keeping everything crossed for you. Hope the trip out to Czech goes well!

Ouch rain that sounds painful! When's your next scan?

Sorry to hear you're feeling down clem. I'd suggest getting some pre-seed to overcome any ewcm issues. Easier than taking a supplement. Comes with a handy applicator so you can get it in situ prior to dtd. Who said romance was dead eh?! I think magnesium is supposed to help too (taken orally not up the foof ).

KL our area also stopped funding IUI because of the low success rates. I think I would try it at least once but perhaps not three goes. How long have you been trying? Great that your DH is optimistic - I think it's important to keeping the vision of it all working out. Must say that's been a bit difficult lately.

Fingers crossed for the scan beaky, stimming next week, gosh that's come around quickly.

We're on the motorway in the pouring rain, heading off to not so sunny Scotland, for a long weekend of walks in the wilderness!

Anyone fancy 15 mins of fame? I would do it but we're probably starting late August and not sure if it has to be your first time.....

www.facebook.com/InfertilityNetworkUK/posts/1116071171755654:0

Yo ladybros

Wow, I can’t believe how fast this thread is moving at the moment!

rain, yes mixing is a total faff at the beginning, but give it a few more days and I’m sure you’ll become a pro and hopefully you won’t have to spend all your evenings in sleepy town…

Hi KL an xmas bfp sounds quite exciting…! Hope I can join you too! Can’t comment on IUI vs IVF I’m afraid. I would only add to make sure you are informed about your ovarian reserve, so any delay before moving to IVF would be unlikely to cause any problems. Also each cycle of treatment takes a lot of emotional investment. Hopefully you’ll be diffed and off the thread uber quick, but if it takes a little longer, you’ll need to have quite a bit of strength to keep on the journey.

minx hurrah for AF! Your DP is hilarious, you had me laughing out loud too!

lucie my AMH was below 2 when I did LP, that’s why I didn’t respond. You numbers are very different and there’s no reason why this would happen to you. Yes DR quietens down your ovaries first, it’s supposed to in order to bring all follicles back to the same baseline. It stops early lead follicles developing so could also be helpful if you have a short cycle. Anyway, this probably irrelevant anyway, cos you’re gonna get your bfp this time .

beaky did you say your BS is on Tuesday? Do you start your stims then too? What drugs and doses will you be on?

tiger enjoy your wild weekend in rainy Scotland. Hope the sun comes out eventually and the midgies stay away!

spare did you get your letter though?

Anyone heard anything from smidge? Last I heard, she was on her way to Englandshire…

happy good to hear about plans for a documentary on infertility. Really good to see these messages getting out.

Nothing much to report from me, waiting for the rain to clear, waiting to hear more from fc, and I really really want to get going and have another proper good try. And I’ve just got an email from a sports club I’m a member of to say one of the personal trainers’ wife has just dropped her second sprog. Wtf? There are literally thousands of people on this email list, why do I need to know this?

I think that may be similar to what I'm doing now sesame? I am down regging but just from day 1 of the cycle I am doing the treatment in. I asked about doing long protocol where I would down reg for longer but they said that there would be no benefit I would have to just stimm for longer?

Did you ever read agate’s guide to a failed cycle on FF website? Other berries might be interested in this too. She suggests if SP doesn’t work out, then could ask to try long, and vice versa. There’s also something about flare protocol.

From what you’ve told us lucie, you’re on a short flare protocol. On this protocol, first day of stabbing Buserelin, you are not being DR’d, in fact the opposite happens. The agonist Buserelin goes straight to receptors in your pituitary which initially stimulates them to produce a big flare up of your own natural FSH. This gives your ovaries a big kick and helps lots of follicles to grow. Then after a few days the receptors get desensitised and that switches off your own FSH production and blocks the production of LH. That’s why you need to add back in FSH stims to keep the follicles growing.

When you DR for LP, you take Buserelin for 2-3 weeks, which blocks FSH and LH production in your pituitary altogether, this causes your ovaries to go ‘quiet’ and lining to thin right down and bleed, before you add back in stims. In theory it should create a nice clean slate for follicles to start off from the same point and grow in a very controlled way. Meanwhile a nice fresh new lining can be built up from scratch. The negatives for LP is it needs more drugs, more days of stims, higher incidence of OHSS in high responders, and it doesn’t always work for poor responders. But it also means less cycle cancellations cos it prevents a premature LH surge.

Anyway all protocols have advantages and disadvantages and everyone responds differently. Naturally.

Enjoy your break Tiger! Even though you might not have the best weather, you'll still have that beautiful Scottish scenery!

Sesame you can definitley be my consultant! I've read a few bits from Agate which have been really helpful.

Spare any news on that letter?

Happy I couldn't bare to be on telly anyway, never mind with my fanjo out and sobbing at only having one follie. It's definitely going to be an interesting series though, I hope they do it properly though and sensationalise it like everything else.

Well, that was a spectacularly shitty week. Not quite sure how I managed to get to the end of it without having a total meltdown, but here I am and IT'S THE WEEKEND!!!!

You've been so chatty I've had to log in on the laptop to keep up!!

lucie I just added hidden infections to my list for the private FC... I had hypnotherapy for the first IVF round, I found it helpful, and listened to some of the recordings (she recorded our sessions and emailed them to me) after this last transfer (it was her that had me decorating my womb room )
It did also come out that my mental block to fertility was all about my mother. But there you go. I 'unblocked' this, but I'm still not pg. .
Are you on a flight to Czech now?! Sorry about the rubbish nurse

beaky I was awake throughout egg collection. It was bloody painful but the gas and air helped. They did give me painkillers, but I wasn't knocked out. It's only really bad when the needle goes into each follicle - it's not painful all the time. I had 9 eggs taken though, so it felt like it was going on forever. I did ask for extra painkillers at one point, and it was a lot easier after that. Did I say the gas and air helped? Love that stuff!!
When I had the severe reaction to the HSG and ended up in hospital overnight I was sick repeatedly and I eventually worked out it was shortly after each dose of codeine, so definitely ask them to think about what might have made you sick.

tiger I had no gas and air for my nk cells biopsy. I had to pay £315 and there was no bloody gas and air!!!!! Because I also had the biopsy that looks at the hormone levels in the womb lining he had to get enough out for both. I couldn't believe he was actually cutting out part of my womb with a knife and all I had was a paracetamol. I was in tears by the end

spare good work on the moustache - as I'm usually on the app I can never see photos and I allowed myself to believe that a marker pen had been employed by minx and beaky on the photos on the baby corridor
I might add some of your questions to my list as well... Embryo glue was standard with our NHS round + FER but I think we'll have to pay extra for it with the private round. The edometrial window biopsy sounds like what I had done (and they found out that my lining lagged a few days behind where it should be) but it was nowhere near £1200, that sounds a lot (but sounds like you don't need it anyway).
What was your AMH result? Has the letter about funding arrived yet?
I'm a fan of frozen cycles in theory as I felt totally exhausted after the egg collection, and I was still in pain the day before transfer, but obviously losing one blastocyst and having the other damaged has made me a lot more nervous of the process.

nolly snakebite & black? I was a pernod and black fan... Mmm

rain my consultant said they would never change the dose once started, but others on here have. It's the usual inconsistency .
Hope the stabbing is going okay.

sesame When are you at the clinic next week? The lack of control is so hard. Isn't selenium in pineapples and helps implantation? Or is that something else? I bought a pineapple but couldn't be arsed cutting it so never ate it which is obviously why it failed so I then felt really guilty for not trying
That pg announcement on an email mailing list is ridiculous!!

Happy Hope you're having a great holiday
Given how open we are about it all anyway I'd be okay doing the filming, but I don't think we'll be started by the end of September.

clem you could take just about everything if you wanted to. I used to rattle, but now I've scaled it back to only pregnacare again. If the private FC recommend anything I'll take it.

KL I got pregnant through IUI (then had a miscarriage) but the second round failed and we decided to move on to IVF instead of trying a third round. No idea if that was the right decision given our one round of IVF with 3 blastocysts came to nothing, but these things are pointless dwelling on...
For what it's worth I'd definitely try at least one round of IUI - if nothing else it gives you information on how your body will react to the drugs, and all the scans will give you further information on your follicles and womb lining. It's all useful information should it not work, so it's not a complete waste of time either way.

minx hooray for AF! where the hell was she?!

So, now I've made an attempt to catch up, here's my update. I filled in the forms and sent them off a week ago, so 8th August. At least, I told myself, now we're going private we won't have the waiting lists. I emailed the clinic and explained that DH would struggle to get time off work come September and I was really keen to speak to someone before the end of the month. Next available appointment? October . I got a call today offering me a late cancellation but it was for next Thursday and I've only booked 3 days holiday to go away with DH and I'm bloody well going....
Going in for a antral follicle scan and an AMH test on Monday. I'm guessing I then have to wait until October to find out my AMH?! A large part of me doesn't want to know my AMH, as there's nothing I can do about it anyway.

Thanks Barking, do you remember what painkillers you had? I've never had gas and air, what does it do to you? I can remember the pain of the needle going in but because I was sedated i felt, erm, swimmy! I only had 4 eggs as well! I can't decide if the needle would be worse than feeling swimmy and vomiting all day. Anyway, what a shame you couldn't get to the cancellation, I hope they can offer you something else ASAP. Have they got a long waiting list for treatment? For me, finding out my amh has meant that my expectations are probably more realistic, I know I have very little left and therefore treatment can only be an option for a limited period. That does help in a way, actually. You had a good amount of eggs collected though so you probably have a decent enough ovarian reserve. When is your dh back? I bet you can't wait to see him!