Candle smugglers of the world unite! The Berries have loaded up the charabanc and have Barry on repeat. Destination BFP (via the pouch of Douglas)

[happylass]

The small print:

The Berries have strict entrance criteria: TTC #1 for 12 months+, over 30, NO instadiffers, must have a special pimping pot and absolutely no mention of baby dust/dancing. Not that we're fussy

Current passengers

Happylass, 37, TTC since Aug 2012. 2 failed ICSIs. Hopefully FET early May with only frostie. Long awaited NHS appt in June
Beaky 35, ttc coming up 3 yrs, 2x failed iui 1x long protocol ivf cancelled due to poor response. On the pill awaiting short protocol IVF in may
Minx, 34, both tubes blocked, 1 buried ovary, IVF info evening June, IVF "booking in" appointment in July
Nolly, 33, TTC 2.7 years, mc Dec 2014. awaiting ivf August 2015 while dh is off on a jolly.
Wild 40 - TTC for three years. Embies on ice and planning FET with immune treatment in June.
HampshireBlues 36 TTC 3.5 years, unexplained. Cycle 1 chemical pregnancy, cycle 2 abandoned due to cyst, cycle 3 failed. Plan thrombotic profile, scratch and short protocol.
Lumen, 35, ttc since Nov 2011, unexplained, two IVF cycles in 2014, both bfns, waiting for lap&dye and results of numerous bloods, aiming for one last IVF cycle in the summer.
Tigerdog, 34 ttc since Jan 2013. Unexplained and all test results good. Currently in the middle of long protocol IVF, 13 eggs collected and awaiting news for next steps.
Gillster, 41, TTC since Feb 2012. Had IVF in Feb 14 and had 6 one cell embies frozen due to polyp. 2 x 2 day embies finally put back 14 months later on 16th April, BFP 28th April
Smidge, 39 this month, TTC since Jan 2013. Unexplained. IVF#1 Short protocol July '14 BFN, IVF#2 Nov'14 and IVF#3 Feb '15 both Long protocol BFNs. High NK cells immune treatment. 2 frosties due to be put back in natural FET in May or June.
Kuma - 40. TTC 2.5 years. Low AMH high FSH - DH antisperm ABs. Failed IVF June 14 and March 15. Looking to change clinic and try another natural cycle in June 2015.
Lucieloos, 35, TTC 18 months, low AMH & sperm motility. 1st ICSI in Czech Republic in April 2015. Awaiting results.
Barkingtreefrog, 35, ttc since Dec 2011. Clomid bfp summer 2013, mc @ 7 weeks. IUI bfp summer 2014, mc @ 7 weeks. Diagnosed with factor v leiden thrombophilia (but
not thought to be the cause of the mc's as they were too early). Failed IUI January 2015, failed IVF March 2015. No further NHS help. Going private for nk cells testing and a scratch before putting the frosties back, hopefully this summer.
Rain, 33 ttc since March 2012. unexplained. mystery bfp oct 13, MMC Nov 13. NHS IVF starting in June
Spare planning FET with remaining frosties shortly
Pont 1st IVF in Czech Republic in July.

Oh Tiger what absolutely appalling timing. A big hug and a handhold from me. Id say ignore your phone but that's so hard. Can you start a new box set to at least pass the time?

HB big hugs. It's such a tough time to get through eh. It could well be related to your ohss though. Hugs to you as well.

Happy so sorry about the bfn. Would you look into lining issues? you seem have really good grade embies. Tons of hugs to you as well lady.

Massive hugs to my berry ladies, you all deserve better than this. Xx

Oh I'm sorry to hear so much bad news on here

Happy so sorry about your bfn. Would you consider looking into other issues before donor. Like others have said you get really good embryos. Have you had a hysto? My clinic have agreed to let me try steroids and clexane this time incase of immunes and nk cells. Is this something your clinic would let you try? Also have you been to your gp for level 1 immunes?

If you do decide you want to go down the donor route I can recommend my clinic in czech they have success rates of around 65-70% for donor and can't get going in about 4 months.

Tiger, so sorry to hear you think you are having a chemical. This process is so unfair at times. Hope you can get in at the epu on Monday so you know what's going on one way or another. Keeping my fingers crossed for you.

HB, the 2ww drive me crazy as well. It's the worst part of the whole process and I don't know what to suggest to make it any better. You are going to have some many different hormones racing around its natural to feel up and down. For me I took most of the 2ww off work and I found it hell. I was sat at home on my own all day and couldn't get motivated to do anything as I was just so worried. The next time I have decided I am going to go straight back to work. It will get me out of the house and even though I imagine it will be very hard to concentrate at least it will take my mind off things a little bit. I guess what I'm saying is try to keep yourself as busy as you can and have time where you don't think about it if that is possible!

Beaky/Lucie we are going to look in to further testing but reluctant to spend thousands on it when we don't know if there's anything wrong and even if there is there's no guarantee that any meds would result in a successful cycle. We were given prednisolene this time so I'm not sure what else they would try? Also have always been told that my lining looks 'amazing', although I know that doesn't mean there's not a problem with it. Whilst all 5 blasts have been hatching AA/ABs I read somewhere today that lots of things can go wrong with apparently good quality embies after ET and 95% of failed cycles are due to a failure of the embryo to continue developing. No idea how accurate this is though? Starting to think that my eggs are just knackered and we'd be better off spending our money on a donor rather than expensive tests. The most frustrating thing for me at the moment is just not knowing why it isn't working. Just don't know which way to turn for the best

It's difficult isn't it happy. It's true that a large proportion of implantation failure is down to chromosomal defects of the embryos even if they look great. I think if it would me I would get a hysteroscopy to check everything is ok with uterus. I would get the level 1 immunes done free at gp or I would consider going to serum in Greece for them all done which only costs around 350 euros compared to thousands in UK. They are very good at serum. They have a questionnaire you can complete on their website and they get back to you very quickly with their thoughts on what could be going wrong and what treatment they would suggest. I have done it just to get a second opinion on my treatment and found them extremely helpful so that could be an option for you. It could be that you need intralipids and clexaneor they do a test that you can do from home for hidden infections. Have you had your progesterone tested whilst being treated to make sure you absorbing it properly? I am going to hopefully be trying gestone next time as serum said that I may not be absorbing the crinone enough.

Oh Tiger, that is shit.

Lucie I've never had a hysteroscopy (just a HSG) as I've no reason to have ever needed one really. AF is as regular as clockwork, no issues with LP, lining always looks good, even on the natural cycle. Will definitely ask about it at our follow up though. I got in touch with Serum after our 2nd cycle failed in Feb but I've held off filling in the questionnaire as it was quite lengthy and we had the FET coming up but I'll definitely get on to that now. We are in Greece on hols in the summer so it wouldn't have been too difficult to pop over to Athens and get the tests done but law of sod dictates that they are closed for the whole of August.
I can't really ask my GP for the level 1 tests as I don't want the NHS to know we've had more than 1 private cycle as I'm afraid it would affect our entitlement.
Our FC never tests for progesterone (or anything else!!) during treatment but I'm guessing that the fact that I've never started bleeding before stopping meds (even with this natural cycle when I've just been on one fanny candle per day) suggests that it's doing it's job?
Thanks for all the ideas - so much to think about but just so frustrating that the tests are all so pricey with no guarantee of a positive result at the end. Hope all is well with you Lucie and you're feeling a little better about your next step.

It's is frustrating happy, if you want a couple more goes with your own eggs maybe seriously consider going abroad where it will be a lot cheaper and you can get all the immunes done for a fraction of the price. Its such a shame that serum is closed when you are out in Greece in August. My clinic also recommends Hysteroscopy after 2 failed cycles as some things can't be picked up on ultrasound. Keep us posted on what you decide with everything. Really hope it works out for you soon x

It's is frustrating happy, if you want a couple more goes with your own eggs maybe seriously consider going abroad where it will be a lot cheaper and you can get all the immunes done for a fraction of the price. Its such a shame that serum is closed when you are out in Greece in August. My clinic also recommends Hysteroscopy after 2 failed cycles as some things can't be picked up on ultrasound. I am feeling a little happier now thanks although I still worry about the next cycle and still have a feeling that this isn't going to be an easy ride for me either.

Keep us posted on what you decide with everything. Really hope it works out for you soon x

Happy you seem so textbook spot on, It must be so frustrating and gutting to be told everything is amazing and top grade and then for it not to work. If you are happy to go straight to donor eggs then go for it I say.

Tiger my lovely, how are you? Still crossing everything and thinking of you.

Not looking good. The frer I did this morning looked pretty negative. There was a slight shadow but nothing more. I am 99.9% certain this is a chemical. Devastated and angry that I allowed myself a glimmer of hope. The thought of having to carry on with ttc after this gives me a heavy heart indeed.

I'm so sorry tiger, those feelings are just awful and gut wrenching. don't be angry with yourself. you've done nothing wrong. have you stopped the progesterone?

I'm so sorry, Tiger. Does your FC offer a counselling service? I had a session after my chemical with IVF#1 and it really helped.

Oh tiger I'm so sorry, this must be awful. I can't imagine the disappointment after the initial high of a bfp. MrSmidge and I were away at a friend's house over the weekend so I only just read yours news.

HB hang in there. I think it's quite usual to become emotional at some point after ET. It's almost like a downer after the adrenalin high of the build up. You're left in that sudden 'what do I do now' kind of limbo land and suddenly the enormity can hit. I bet you'll feel better in a couple of days time (just nervous instead!). The second week is always really nerve wracking. My clinic test 11dp5dt and it always feels too late. I generally know a good 4 or 5 days beforehand. And certainly for me by 9dp5dt it's obvious. But I guess they push it out a bit longer just to rule out chemicals for those where the progesterone actually staves off AF. Tough, but maybe it helps some people avoid what poor tiger is having to go through.

tiger
I don't really know what to say other than my heart is breaking for you and DH.

Oh Tiger I'm so very sorry. This is soul destroying. Please don't be angry with yourself, as nolly says you've done absolutely nothing wrong. Always her when you need us

I'm so sorry Tiger

Thank you for the support berries, I'm feeling ok today and am still looking at the piccies of our embies and trying to be positive. I think it's just so difficult having been here before.....

Interesting discussions about foreign clinics and some of the remote assistance they offer. When you think about how long IVF has been happening I think there is an expectation that the success rates would be higher or that someone would have found a way to tag embryos / eggs / sperm easily to flag abnormalities but it still seems lacking. I know of some research at Cambridge where a scientist has managed to flouress apparently normal looking sper that in fact have a chromosomal abnormality but this is still a long way from being widely available.

Thank you all for your support. Mr T has gone out for the day, so I'm trying to pull myself together to go and do something.

nolly I didn't bother with any more progesterone (waste of £40!) - last one was Friday. Anyone know how quickly af might arrive after stopping the cyclogest? No spotting or cramping yet. I'd be blissfully unaware if I hadn't carried on testing. I've even been having waves of nausea and sensivity to smell. It's like a sick joke.

Aww Tiger, I'm so sorry many hugs to you. I know nothing can make you feel any better but we are all here with you anyway and of course when you need us. I found I got AF about 3 days after stopping cyclogest. Xx

Berries I need a bit of advice, I was supposed to inject with cetrotide this morning and despite setting a couple of reminders I forgot. So I did it at 12 when I remembered but it should have been 8. There's no way I can inject at work, do you think it would be ok to just do it at 8 tomorrow then keep it at 8 for the rests of the time? I know it's supposed to be the same time each day but I don't know what's best to do. Any opinions welcomed.

Hi beaky I think you'll be fine to return back to 8am. It's just stopping your body from producing LH so a little extra in that time period shouldnt be a problem. I think when they say roughly the same time each day it's so you don't end up having a massive amount of gap beyond the 24 hrs. I was specifically told not to worry about 'an hour or so either way'. (Even if early one day and late the next - or vice versa) so my personal advice is do it just before you leave the house in the morning and not to give it any more thought.

(Obviously I'm not a doctor though, so I should really suggest you give your nurses team a call and ask their advice!)

Thank you Smidge I will just go for it. I can't ring the FC today as they aren't open but I'm in tomorrow for a scan so will mention it.

Beaky I'd say that you would be ok going back to 0800 but it's always worth checking with the FC at your scan tomorrow.

So rubbish Tiger Not what you want to hear but I started to bleed about 3 days after stopping gestone injections at 12 weeks.

I hope you get some answers tomorrow about what is happening tiger .
In answer to your question I started bleeding the day after stopping progesterone.

Tiger I never took any meds but I started bleeding the day of the bfn