Will history write we have failed children over this time?

[Bewareofisms]

I have just read a BBC article stating that 6 healthy children (in the UK) have died from Covid over the course of the pandemic. Six. We have closed schools and imposed all these "bubble" rules for this, the impact on children's mental health will remain to be seen.
I have an acquaintance working with social services that has personally been involved in dealing with children that have lost their lives from abuse over this period. She, one person, has personally been involved in many more than 6 cases over this time. She hasn't stopped. Vulnerable children have been "lost" due to school closures. The impact of that will far outweigh the deaths from Covid. I wonder if they will ever release the true figures here...

In 100 years time will it be written that we utterly failed children over this pandemic? 😞

@LipstickLou

I can only speak from my own experience. My daughter (second year a level) has not been able to sit her exams or assessments. Due to MH issues she had poor attendance. Along came school closures and it took away the momentum at her new school. Can she repeat the year? No, no space. Effectively she is written off. She is not even 18. Next.

So sad. I hope she finds a way to work through it all positively in the end 💐

Oh and strangely there is no positive experience to knowing that your child is so at risk going out the house at all could kill them.

pre-conceived opinion of my motive?

Well this appears to be your first thread so it's not entirely clear what your motive is, but you are certainly posting dodgy information and 'won't somebody think of the children, the MSM are lying to us' in a hyperbolic style that doesn't inspire confidence.

@Sirzy

Oh and strangely there is no positive experience to knowing that your child is so at risk going out the house at all could kill them.

Why would this be positive in any way?

Well your the one who posted you where pleased I had had a positive experience

Bewareofisms

You might not have read the posts I'm referring to.

I may not have read them, or I may have read them differently to you.

For what its worth, I do believe that children have been failed, but not by schools and social services. etc.

They were already being failed by years of inadequate governments not prioritising them and reducing much needed funding.

Schools and social services have been made an easy scape goat throughout the pandemic by the government, media and and groups like us4them.

If schools and social services (and other groups that actually care about children) were listened to then the outcome for children could have been much different.

But with posters stating half truths and pointing the finger in the wrong direction, history will be written by those with a bias such as yours.

"We" didn't fail "our" children thank you very much.

I home schooled for ten or eleven months during last year with immense sacrifices form me, emotional, financial and health wise.

DD is heading for straight A's in G.C.S.Es.

I didn't fail ANYONE thanks.

So you don't know what the answer is.

You don't really understand the term super spreaders means.

You don't seem to know why schools were closed.

You acknowledge that lots of children were impacted by other things in the pandemic, not just school closures

So what's the point of your post?

If there is not viable alternative, how would history say that society failed children during this period?

The two things you stated in your OP that we did to 'fail children' were impose school closures and impose bubble rules. Do you believe that schools should have remained fully open throughout, with no bubbles? Do you believe those measures were unnecessary? If not, then what are you on about? Unless you have any better suggestion as to what should have been done instead, this was not a failure. It was a necessary measure with some inevitably negative (and in some cases tragic) consequences.

And yes, it will take a long time until the full impact of Covid and the measures we took can be judged. But, as you said, hindsight is a fine thing.

@Romanoff

So you don't know what the answer is.

You don't really understand the term super spreaders means.

You don't seem to know why schools were closed.

You acknowledge that lots of children were impacted by other things in the pandemic, not just school closures

So what's the point of your post?

If there is not viable alternative, how would history say that society failed children during this period?

I thought the point of this platform was to discuss, debate, hear others thoughts (even if you disagree).

Yes. We have failed them without a doubt. Lack of education. A tsunami of mental health issues. Massive fail. |History will judge this very badly.

Although I'm relatively new to here so maybe not!

I spent 1st lockdown in a country with v strict enforcement of covid rules. They only shut schools for maybe 6weeks, with some of this being holiday. Then there were various forms of restrictions in wider society to keep overalls numbers down, but schools were open. I don’t think they needed to shut schools again - and shops/restaurants were open more than U.K.

Because they had v strict border control and enforcement of rules. Any increases were dealt with v quickly with a hard response - so the restrictions only had to last a short time. This contrasts greatly with the U.K. govt’s dithering over school closures around Christmas.

I thought the point of this platform was to discuss, debate, hear others thoughts (even if you disagree)

Thats what I am trying to do. But you don't have a point to debate.

Hence me asking, what is your point?

You obviously thought 'only 6 children that died was evidence of some sort of point.
Again, if there's no other viable solution, why do you think anyone would think they were failed

And if your child was one of those 6. How would you feel about someone posting this?

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

In 100 years time will it be written that we utterly failed children over this pandemic? 😞

I think everyone has struggled and been messed up, not just children.

This, I’m actually a bit bored of people trying to say this group or that group has had it worse, it’s not a competition.

Everyone has had it tough, from every age group and for all sorts of different reasons, this whole ‘woe is the children’ attitude is quite irritating tbh, why does one group need to be given more sympathy than others?

I thought the point of this platform was to discuss, debate, hear others thoughts (even if you disagree).

Questioning the point of the threads people post is a valid part of the debate. Nobody is suggesting the validity of government measures shouldn't be discussed. We are saying that claiming a measure failed is pretty pointless unless you think the measure wasn't necessary and/or you have at least some suggestion... any suggestion... for an alternative.

@Romanoff

I thought the point of this platform was to discuss, debate, hear others thoughts (even if you disagree)

Thats what I am trying to do. But you don't have a point to debate.

Hence me asking, what is your point?

You obviously thought 'only 6 children that died was evidence of some sort of point.
Again, if there's no other viable solution, why do you think anyone would think they were failed

And if your child was one of those 6. How would you feel about someone posting this?

I am making the point that we should question things. I want to hear from people with different points of view. I've enjoyed reading people's input with their thoughts. I don't have to agree or disagree.

This is not about making light of any children's deaths - please don't try to make it go there.

I know a child killed in a car accident. Do I think it's devastatingly tragic - of course! Do their parents want all cars to be banned - no. I don't really understand why you would say that comment.

I am sorry if you have had a loss.

I agree that is mostly the 2 camps you will see on FB, Mumsnet etc. I don't think people from the other camps will post.

This is a non-goady question.... what are the other camps? As genuinely I only see the two camps I mentioned (mainly camp 1 to be honest).

Essentially...

Op: School closures and bubbles caused harm to some children.

Other posters: Yes. It's very sad and awful for those children. What do you think we should have done differently?

OP: Dunno.

@RockingMyFiftiesNot

I agree that is mostly the 2 camps you will see on FB, Mumsnet etc. I don't think people from the other camps will post.

This is a non-goady question.... what are the other camps? As genuinely I only see the two camps I mentioned (mainly camp 1 to be honest).

People who are not able to look after their children and have social services involved. Or just people outside the demographic that use social media. Perhaps those with limited internet access.

@lazylinguist

Essentially...

Op: School closures and bubbles caused harm to some children.

Other posters: Yes. It's very sad and awful for those children. What do you think we should have done differently?

OP: Dunno.

Perfectly summed up

Ok - since a couple of people seem to want me to have an answer.

1. What do you think would have happened if schools remained open to all that didn't happen anyway? (I obviously mean not to clinically vulnerable children.)

2. Do you think that closing the borders, closing large hospitality venues (stadiums, not little restaurants) straight away, stopping travel within the UK unless local/essential would have allowed schools to stay open?

@lazylinguist

Essentially...

Op: School closures and bubbles caused harm to some children.

Other posters: Yes. It's very sad and awful for those children. What do you think we should have done differently?

OP: Dunno.

Why would I have the answer to this?!? That's why I want to hear other's thoughts here!

My children would have been pretty devastated to have lost any grandparents to Covid.

If the hospitals were overwhelmed then children would have been at risk if they couldn't receive urgent care. My DD was in A&E during the first lockdown with suspected appendicitis. The NHS was there for her.

Children are part of society and society as a whole had to stop the virus spreading out of control. We haven't failed them. It's been difficult for everyone. Children are resilient and most cope with adversity better than adults give them credit for.

1. schools would have struggled for staff. -Children who live with vulnerable adults would have been left in an awful position.

• Staff who are vulnerable or live with someone vulnerable would have been stuck
• CEV children would have been even further isolated and left behind.

2. no. It may well have reduced the amount of time they needed to close for but it wouldn’t have negated all the risk factors