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Just carpeted AP - please make supportive noises! Tired mum, patience exhausted.

88 replies

BoffinMum · 23/02/2009 08:21

Long post, apologies in advance. Badly need to get this off my chest.

Some of you may be familiar with my AP saga. We've had a lot of APs over the years, some good, some ad, some indifferent.

Basically the current one is a nice enough lass of 21, who has been with me since November, and was at university doing a biology degree last academic year, but often very inefficient, and had to be dealt with by the agency early on for only doing what she felt like doing when she felt like doing it, resulting in minor but persistent domestic chaos which was driving me nuts. There has been some improvement in key areas since then but there are still problems.

Background is I am having a fourth baby in 5 weeks, have bad SPD, and am very very tired, so need a reasonable level of domestic support.

Recent misdemeanours have included failing to come home at the time she is supposed to, because she felt like taking DS2 (7) to the shops and library spontaneously, so DS1 (11) came home to an empty house after school and panicked and went back to school in tears, causing a major incident with the Deputy Head phoning me etc (I was at the hospital for an appointment). I carpeted her for that, and told her if it ever happened again she would be on the next plane back home because the children's safety was paramount. I noticed a more minor repeat of the incident happened on DH's watch a couple of weeks ago, but he is a bit of a softy, and didn't tell her off like I did.

There's a lot more stuff as well. I was in the kitchen last night and noticed the oven door was looking grubby, so went over to give it a quick wipe. The back story here is that I have just had Ovenu in to completely overhaul it at a cost of £120, because the AP had not been wiping it after spilling things and it had got into a right state. I had explained to her the need to wipe up after yourself when using ovens, otherwise the fat etc all bakes on and then makes the thing impossible to use (which she had originally been complaining about). When I opened the oven door I could see that she can't have wiped it once since the bloke came, because it was caked in dirt and grease, the Lakeland teflon liner at the bottom had spilled fat all over it and was so grimy and greasy it could hardly be removed from the oven floor, and there was a tray of charred cooked food from the end of last week sitting there in pride of place on the middle shelf. Ugh.

I started cleaning up after her using my Lakeland oven chemicals, such was the state of the thing, but it soon became clear that she had let it go to the point where it needed the man to come in again after only 4 weeks of relatively light use. You should know that it was very painful for me to scrub away at the oven with my hips in the state they are in, and also I cannot cook myself at the moment because I can't lift the hot dishes.

She also has been taking 8-10 hours to fold the washing and do the ironing each week, a job which has taken other APs up to 4 hours and takes me 2 in my normal fit state, and spends a lot of time hiding in the utility room doing this, but failing to help the children with their homework and music practice, which is what she is supposed to be doing between 4-5 each day. I try to help the kids as well but the painkilling drugs I am on mean I can be quite out of it sometimes at this time of day, and this is very hard. The laundry backlog got particularly huge last week and I found DH in there late one evening trying to finish off the pairing of socks, folding of school polo shirts and so on from the mountain, but he works a 60-70 hour week and frankly I do not think he should have to do this.

Similarly I showed her how to clean the kids' room and shower room a couple of times (the only cleaning she is supposed to do apart from wiping up after herself), but she has reverted to that thing APs do where they just do a bit of token dusting and hoovering in the easy areas, leaving the ornaments, tops of shelves and so on. We now have a situation in which the window frame is literally black with mould, a problem as we are all allergic to mould spores here. She has not wiped the window once, that means. You can also draw in the dust.

I have just sat her down and told her she has to start doing all her jobs properly and thoroughly, and is on two weeks' notice to improve otherwise we will have to review whether she stays at all. She did a bit of a poor little girl act (she is good at that, particularly with DH) but I just told her to pull her socks up and give us the help we need and are paying for, not what she can be bothered to do. This means she may well give notice herself leaving me stranded just before the birth, and rather rueing having paid an agency £400 to provide us with her last November, but I am thinking I probably can't go on picking up the pieces after her.

Has anyone else had problems like this, and what was the resolution??

Also any supportive murmurings badly needed here.

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
nickschick · 23/02/2009 08:30

Erm I think you are expecting rather to much of your u pair tbh if you need a housekeeper,cook,cleaner and nanny - pay for them!!
And dont keep having a go at the A.P cos even tho you are tired and in pain its not her fault.

By the way I think carpeted as a term is quite harsh.

gagarin · 23/02/2009 08:31

Do you children like her. That is what is important - not dusty ornaments.

All your concenrs are about housework - no mention of children's views.

Ask them - that's what's important.

BTW when your ds1 came home to an empty house could he not just text the AP asking how long she would be? Or was he left on the doorstep?

This (IMO) was a far more serious problem thatn not cleaning the oven - but I do only clean mine once a year (after Xmas - and I haven't done that yet !)

Maveta · 23/02/2009 08:33

What does 'carpeted' mean?

I thought APs were just supposed to help out here and there? It does sound like you expect quite a lot of her if she has to do all the laundry - washing, drying, ironing, folding. Cleaning kids' room and showerroom. Meals and cleaning up after meals. Looking after kids.

It sounds like you are in quite a lot of pain and maybe you need a higher level of support that an AP can give you? Maybe look into a nanny and cleaner?

nickschick · 23/02/2009 08:38

I did think that at 11 your ds would be capable of waiting and texting the A.P,I know with my own teens (we have no A.P) but if I have an afternoon appointment I warn them in advance in cse Im not home even if theres a chance grandad or dad might be here.

BoffinMum · 23/02/2009 08:40
  1. AP was the person who complained the oven was dirty and smoking hot fat, which is why I got specialists in to clean it for her.
  1. She only has to do 30 minutes a week cleaning of the kids' room, 2-4 hours a week laundry (almost all of this is the kids' stuff) and 20 hours a week doing the school run and keeping an eye on the kids after school and giving them their tea, which is hardly onerous for an AP. We have a cleaner for all the rest of the stuff (just not the oven, which doesn't normally need doing this radically or frequently because people just wipe up spills as they go along). For this she gets £80 a week, a lot of paid holidays and a massive double bedroom in a nice house in a nice area, plus all her bills and food paid. We even had her bf to stay a couple of weeks ago so they woulnd't have to shell out for a hotel.
  1. My kids are a bit old for a nanny at 7 and 11. I doubt we could even get one, especially for so few hours. We are going to get one when the new baby comes though.
  1. DS1 is only 11 so doesn't have a mobile phone - they are actually banned from his school anyway. He goes to the same school as DS2 a mile away and sets off on his own ten minutes later for the home trip, but on this occasion she just didn't turn up at home, without telling anyone what she was planning.
  1. Kids like her but get upset when they don't have clean clothes, food doesn't happen on time, AP not there when they expect her to be and so on.
OP posts:
Weegle · 23/02/2009 08:41

you poor thing

I actually think it's worse when there are lots of niggly problems rather than a definitive "no way is she staying" because you have to work hard (on both sides) to resolve it.

I think you've done the right thing, even though you risk losing her. It sounds to me that the stress of having her is actually offsetting the benefit at the moment. Have you been extremely explicit. e.g. on Monday at 4pm you will sit down with the children to do their homework, at 4.45pm until 5.15pm you will ensure all washing for that day is folded and placed in appropriate rooms. Sometimes, when you get a particularly dippy one you need this level of detail. With regards to the oven - stop cleaning it yourself! Tell her, as it hasn't been done properly she is to do this at x time today until y time.

Also - does she know how bad you are? I ask because as a young girl she probably is clueless as to how an average pregnancy with 3 kids would affect someone, let alone one with SPD. Does she know the drugs make you woozey? Does she know how much pain you are in? I have an AP because of a painful arthritic condition, and much as it goes against my brave-face personality I have to make it clear that just because I'm not laid up in bed, or showing signs of being in pain, I am. But that as a mother I don't wish to show that to my son and if he needs picking up I will even though it hurts me. I've pointed out that a cold to them means I'm in agony for 6-7 days etc - it means they understand WHY I'm asking them to do certain things (why in fact I have them in the first place!). If it seems to have been forgotten or not sunk in I get DH to have a word in passing "Oh, C is pretty bad today with pain can you make sure she doesn't lift anything" etc... I'm sure it goes against your usual stoicism, but lay it on thick.

And finally I cannot abide carelessness when it comes to safety and communication. I had a similar incident recently where on a 5 min errand with DS AP decided to detour to watch trains for over an hour. I was having kittens, no response to mobile. Turns out she hadn't taken phone with her and didn't see what the problem was anyway. Went nuts over that I can tell you! So don't give any leeway on that one.

Good luck but rest assured you've definitely done the right thing...

MmeLindt · 23/02/2009 08:42

I was an aupair many years ago and the level of work that you expect of your aupair sounds similar to what I was doing.

Some light dusting/cleaning and the laundry. Looking after the children. TBH, if she was not taking more than twice the time that you normally take to do the laundry then she would have more free time.

How many hours does she work?

The thing that would worry me most is that she is not reliable, she HAS to be back home in time so that someone is there when your DS comes home from school.

She sounds like she produces more work for you rather than relieving you.

MmeLindt · 23/02/2009 08:45

Oh, and I agree with Weegle that you need to stress how difficult your pregnancy is.

BoffinMum · 23/02/2009 08:46

Just to clarify:

She doesn't do all the meals. She gives the kids their tea after school. We do the rest.

She doesn't do all the laundry. She does mainly the kids' laundry and runs our sheets through the washing machine and drier on a Thursday, plus irons 4 shirts for DH and a couple of minor things for me. We do the rest.

She is supposed to dust and hoover the kids' room on a Monday and change their sheets, also clean their bathroom. Our cleaner does the rest of the house (in 4 hours, I hasten to add).

It is quite normal for an AP to do some housework as part of the deal - they practucally all do. She has timetabled opportunities during the day for the bits of housework she does do and is paid 30% over the going rate for the area too.

OP posts:
BoffinMum · 23/02/2009 08:49

Thanks Weegle and Mme Lindt, I feel you understood the situation more than the earlier posters.

God this is hard when it's in your own home. Plus I always try to be so considerate to APs and I feel it's not often reciprocated, tbh.

OP posts:
Penthesileia · 23/02/2009 08:55

Generally I think people on MN have inflated ideas about what they expect their slaves APs to do, but in this case, your expectations as you outlined them seem quite reasonable.

Why don't you offer her 2 choices:

  1. She does what you ask, and what you house & pay her for

  2. She can stop doing some of the chores, but her £80 will be reduced accordingly if you have to find someone to do them; e.g. if you can find a local person to do the ironing at £10 an hour for 2 hours, then she gets £60.

It may be that she just doesn't have the organisational wherewithal to do these tasks, as light as they seem. I can sympathise I must admit: I'm shockingly bad at housework and ironing takes me an absolute age. If I were her, I'd rather get £20 a week for looking after the kids after school and do without other pocket money than do these chores which I find difficult.

I'm sorry you're struggling so much with your SPD.

Helen31 · 23/02/2009 08:55

No experience with APs to help, but just wanted to other some sympathy - you certainly don't need this hassle with what you already have on your plate.

Just one practical suggestion re. the oven - could you pay the cleaner a little extra to keep it under control and save your stress and the £120 call out? Sorry, I have no idea what the specific make of oven is you mentioned.

MmeLindt · 23/02/2009 08:58

I think it is easier to judge the situation if you have been an aupair or had an aupair.

You sound like you are quite houseproud (and I mean that in a nice way as I am a bit jealous). I don't change the DC's beds every week for instance, and I don't have a schedule for what should be getting done when. This should, in theory make it easier for her though, as she has tasks to do on particular days.

It seems to me that a big part of your problem is that she is a bit of a slattern when it comes to housework, and you are on the opposite side of the scale.

I am not a fab housewife with regards to cleaning but even I would [boak] at seeing the charred remains of last weeks meal in the oven.

thebody · 23/02/2009 08:58

sounds like you are having a bloody rotten time. I dont think you sound too harsh, presumably you told her the duties before she started and she agreed to the job. best of luck with the baby, have you got any family whom can help. or good friends.. hugs.

Penthesileia · 23/02/2009 09:03

If you already have a cleaner, could you ask her to take on the ironing, oven-cleaning (a clean once a week would be as good as a wipe down once a day), and other chores?: deduct the money from the APs 'salary'. If she can see the financial consequences of her (in)action she can make an 'adult' decision about whether to pull her socks up or suck-up the cut in pay.

Weegle · 23/02/2009 09:05

The other suggestion I have is you have a daily printed tick list and each week she is provided with a new set. And example would be:

Monday:

8am: sit at table and supervise breakfast. Clear dishes in to dishwasher, wipe down sides.

8.30: ensure DC's have shoes and coats on, help get in to car with bags etc.

9am: Change DC's bedding, put in washing machine.

9.30am: Prepare food for DC's dinner today it is: XXX

10am: Iron DH's shirts

11am: Clean the DC's bedrooms - use X cleaning products and move XYZ to wipe. Then hoover floor whilst tidying any toys away.

3.15pm: collect DC2 from school, walk home and ensure home for

3.45pm: let DS1 in and sit down for snack.

etc etc

you have tick boxes next to each task which she is to tick off. This can go on the fridge or somewhere centrally located. At the bottom you have a few blank tick boxes which you can add any additional tasks for that day e.g. notice oven is grimy - please give it a clean...

You don't need this with most AP's but some really do need that level of detail. Then you don't feel like you're constantly nagging and they can either prove to you they have or haven't done what was asked. They also know time expectations for chores (always allow more time than it would take you though).

BoffinMum · 23/02/2009 09:18

She has a handbook with a list of daily tasks, which I checked out with the agency to make sure it was fair and reasonable.

The weekly bedlinen thing is because of dustmite allergies, which I have tried to explain to her.

I liked Helen's idea, and I can probably get two extra hours out of my cleaner as she does this when we are between APs, doing the ironing for us on a Tuesday evening (she is ace at ironing). But other than that the cleaner doesn't have any free slots.

I am quite houseproud but not ridiculously so, my priority is the kids and making sure they get fed and have clean clothes, get their homework, etc.

OP posts:
MmeLindt · 23/02/2009 09:21

How long is she due to stay with you? Are you getting another Aupair when she leaves or going for a nanny?

Helen31 · 23/02/2009 09:29

Glad an inexperienced newbie could be of some help BoffinMum . I did also think Penthesileia's point was very fair - that you should reduce what you pay if you take significant work off her (e.g. ironing). Your cleaner sounds excellent, so I suspect she will be able to whizz through the ironing (and oven grease) in that couple of hours.

ssd · 23/02/2009 09:30

Boffinmum, I've read many of your posys on MN and you come across as witty and intelligent so I hope you don't mind me being honest

I've worked as a nanny for years and I think what you need is a nanny! someone who knows what they are doing, is practical and will help out without having to read a book to tell her what to do next. I think it doesn't matter if she is/was at uni, you need someone with household and childcare experience and to me an au pair won't do. I realise a nanny will be x£ the amount you're paying, so how about a day nanny say for 3 days a week? To me you need someone older, eg.30's plus who will help out instead of causing you more grief. Maybe go to an agency for a p't mothers help?

i THINK WITH 4 KIDS (OOPS) and a busy house a young girl won't be what you need unless you are lucky and find someone fantastic.
good luck!

ssd · 23/02/2009 09:31

excuse the spelling there!

herbietea · 23/02/2009 09:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

ingles2 · 23/02/2009 09:38

Poor you BM
sweeping statement I know, but over the years I've discovered that AP's are very quick to pick up and complain if things aren't perfect (ie. the oven) but then don't realise they contribute to it, and to keep it in perfect condition you need to look after it!! For that one, I'd be saying, Ap, You know I've just spent money on having the oven cleaned, I'd appreciate it if you could now wipe up spills or I will have to ask you to contribute to the cost of the next clean. and then forget about it. Don't let it stress you, but if it's bad remind her what's going to happen.
As for the not coming home when she was due, I'd go ballistic! (well not literally but you know what I mean) That's the whole point of having an AP.
She sounds very immature and her behaviour is childlike. Unfortunately some AP's regress back into a child position, the eldest daughter of the household and some step up to the mark and take on the adults responsibility. She sounds like the former. Is it long before you are on Maternity leave?

Sambucus · 23/02/2009 10:09

Boffin Mum,
I don't think you are being unreasonable in any way. The point is that the au pair relationship is supposed to be mutually beneficial - she gets the opportunity to be fed, housed and supported in a foreign country, and you should benefit from the help she gives you in exchange.
It sounds to me like you are merely getting the benefit of extra hassle and worry. wondering whether someone is reliable enough to be there for your DS isn't helping you at all!!
We had a similar university student au pair who was similar in that she never really did anything which would warrant the next flight back- but , she never really did anything... In fact, by the time she left, I had so little trust in her that I rarely asked her to do any housework and never asked her to look after the children because I couldn't rely on her.
Do you have time to find another au pair?...

Lovesdogsandcats · 23/02/2009 10:14

The bit thats puzzling me is HOW on earth can anyone, even lazy AP get an oven that dirty after a deep clean 4 weeks ago?

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