Nanny quit before starting because questions I asked her referee

[machinemum]

After weeks of searching, interviews etc I found a nanny I really liked and got great vibe. She came to the house twice and we talked very openly, as you do, and early last week got to an arrangement to start Monday morning, turning down some other really great girls. Friday afternoon via text message she says she cannot work for me. When I call frantically as starting work on Monday she says (via text no call) that the questions I asked her referee were completely inappropriate. I am shocked. I had great chat with her referee we spoke and laughed and shared. It was all positive and kind. Is this excuse? I know she did have a few reservations about the job, such as I may move in new year so wanted to be honest I could only commit to the end. Should I just move on trying to find someone else and forget it? Or should I find out what the questions were that were considered inappropriate? Racking my brains trying to retrace the conversation. Not like I asked her favourite position, just general things about responsibility, trust, did she socialise, strengths and weaknesses. I thought the protocol was that you do ask fairly probing questions about someone if they are going to have sole charge of your baby and be in your family, possibly staying over. Very confused. I feel let down that the referee 'warned' her against me.

cut your losses and find another nanny. you wouldn't want her now anyway, so don't waste your time

Fell thankful you had a lucky escape and contact one of the other lovely girls asap.

If she is that sensitive/entitled then gawd knows what she is hiding- YANBU to ask detailed questions of a referee.

I doubt she "warned" the applicant probably just fed back on the talk & Missy threw a Hissy!

feel

aww thanks peeps. was about to add 'can't even ask referee the right questions' on the self-hating list of shoddy mothering. Just wanted to check there isn't some protocol I wasn't aware of! You are right. Move on Thank you xxx

You do need to ask probing questions when employing someone to look after your precious, unreplacable children when you're not there! What does she expect?....I agree with the lucky escape comment.

Did you just ask questions about her she did the job, or about her personal life?

I don't think it's overly usual for a referee to contact an applicant after giving a reference. That seems an odd move.

I'd definitely ask what questions were considered inappropriate. Then you can decide whether to ask them again.

The referee may have felt it was an odd question to warn the nanny?

I don't think we can label the nanny as sensitive/entitled without knowing the questions.

I would call the referee and the nanny again and find out exactly what it was they felt was over the line. Maybe the nanny is nuts or maybe you crossed a line.....you won't know unless you ask.

Probing questions about how she did the job are fine. Probing questions about her personal life are not fine.

Either way it isn't going to work out with this nanny, so start looking for a new one.

You're placing your children in her care, you need to ask Probing Questions.

If she is offended by this then she's unlikely to be the right person for the job.

However - I would ask why the referee told her details about your conversation. If I was asked to give a reference, I would not disclose the details to the applicant.

True @outraged I'd like to know the questions as well. OP stated that these were "just general things about responsibility, trust, did she socialise, strengths and weaknesses". Doesn't sound like she overstepped the mark, but hard to know.

OP - would you share?

Yes, pretty strange for the referee to call the nanny and tell her what was asked unless there was something unusual there.

I think I would have to ask which questions the nanny found inappropriate. Then at least if, on reflection, you agree you may have inadvertently overstepped a line, then you can apologise for any offense given and see if you can save the relationship. I can't help thinking that the referee must have found something you said a concern for them to have bothered to contact the nanny and let her know. At least if you find out what went wrong you can take a view as to whether you made a mistake or whether she is oversensitive.

My referees will sometimes say 'X rang today for a reference, I really like the sound of that job' but not give any detail.
One referee did say once she thought it was odd that the new employer had asked how often her children have been ill, so she mentioned that to me in passing.
And another new employer asked a referee how much she had paid me, and did I know the difference between net and gross because she was hoping to pay less - that annoyed me because it was quite patronising.

But I can't think of anything that would make me quit immediately.

Sounds very weird - tho you do need to ask nanny what questions did she think was inappropriate

Tbh after that text I would have contacted her and asked what it was that upset her

It doesn't sound like you crossed any lines.

But.

'Does she socialise' - did you specify socialising the children/making play dates etc... because my original thought was 'why does my new employer want to know about my social life?'

I asked if she didn’t mind getting her hands dirty, nappies, bins etc. I asked what her boyfriend was like. In my experience, if you have a fairly 'open' family the nannies boyfriends become part of the family too. She said she didn’t know if she had a boyfriend. I asked if she liked anal sex.* I asked if she liked to socialize, she said no, she was religious. I asked what kind, she said Muslim. We talked about religion, I mentioned we were Jewish, surely that didn't hit a nerve?? I don't know. Honestly it felt like such a lovely, general chat that it’s hard to pick out what was questioning and what was just conversation. You know how a conversation flows, especially between women and ESPECIALLY between mothers. You just chat, don’t you? Support each other a bit? Try and get a grip on this absolute mind field of who to leave your baby with. My baby is nine months old! I just found this nanny from googling a bit, no agency! Aren't I allowed to ask whatever I like? I’m definitely moving on and got more interviews lined up – though I am completely baffled - shall I call and ask??? Or leave it?? Bit scared. But then really intrigued. Maybe I’ll get drunk and call.
*I didn’t ask if she liked anal sex.

If she is a Muslim then it is possibly the fact you are Jewish that is the problem.

I asked what her boyfriend was like. - OVER THE LINE

I asked if she liked to socialize (if you meant outside of work, which it sounds like you did) - OVER THE LINE

Aren't I allowed to ask whatever I like? - No, you're not. You are an employer and your nanny will be your employee. That is a legally defined relationship and you need to operate within that. If you don't understand that or can't cope with it then you can't have a nanny, use a nursery or a childminder instead.

And I don't know a single family or nanny where the nannies boyfriend has become part of the family! Older kids may ask to meet the nannies boyfriend/siblings/parents/friends and some families may allow this, but part of the family?! No.

Quite possibly the fact that you were asking about her boyfriend and her religion. That's out of order tbh. If you want to know about her religion, ask her. If you want to get to know her boyfriend in order to employ her, ask her if you can meet him - if you don't feel you should do that, then don't ask referees. How happy would you be if your perspective employer was asking your referees about your DH, your kids, your religion??

A good rule of thumb - don't ask a referee something about your perspective nanny you wouldn't want someone to as your referee about you.

Agree with Outraged.

No you are not allowed to ask whatever you like! If you become sn employer you have to abide by employment law. In your line of work, would you expect to be asked about your personal life in a job interview? Or your religion? Absolutely not. And a nanny also deserves to be treated as a professional. Your questions should have been limited to the subject of childcare and reliability. You are under no obligation to have anything to do with her boyfriends in any case. I imagine most families wouldn't be allowing random boyfriends in their house.

I agree with outraged too.

I can't believe that after the nanny told you she thought you had asked inappropriate questions of her referee that you didn't think it might have been because you asked about her (non existent) boyfriend and her religion!

Asking about a candidate's personal life is inappropriate. If you have a genuine reason to believe her boyfriend/religion/social life will affect her ability to do her job then you should have asked her.

In future ask referees about how the candidate did their job - punctuality, reliability, childcare abilities, tidiness, did the children like her, how did she react to criticism, would they employ her again.

Your questions were inappropriate
You should have just asked about her ability to do the job
Her private life is no concern of yours
If you wanted to know about her boyfriend and her religion then you should have asked her directly
Asking the referee was intrusive and you have crossed a line