Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Please or to access all these features

Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

hmmmm parents home late again and my son 10th birthday hmmm

135 replies

happychappy · 02/02/2012 18:54

not happy

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
happychappy · 03/02/2012 11:18

Sorry no Heswell should just go and live with her mother and then she wouldn't even have to pay. With any luck Mum would also pay the bills and everything resolving all issues.

OP posts:
BIWI · 03/02/2012 11:21

A quick search of Heswall's posts would suggest that she isn't a surgeon, and she's paying (according to he) £400 a week in childcare. So not a massive amount of pay for a nanny who is expected to work all hours under the sun.

She is raising issues about extreme employment cases just to make a specific point, I fear. Which is hardly sympathetic to the OP's particular case.

And you're right, OGP, there is no 'one size fits all' when it comes to employing a nanny in terms of day-to-day hours/role, etc.

But basic respect for an employee absolutely should be a 'one size fits all'

OlympicGoldPennies · 03/02/2012 11:23

I'm not saying that no respect is due at all.

happychappy · 03/02/2012 11:24

If you are a surgeon Haswell you would have been given alot more leaway BUT their work is not life or death. BUT Haswell I'm sure you are not late 80% of the time and if that was the case then a discussion could be made to change the finishing hours. Further you would also make it so time owed could be taken and used. By no means am I clock watching but if you knew you consistently late your nanny was owed over 2 weeks time off plus accrued hours she wasn't ever going to take off you would feel perhaps a little guilty. And perhaps give some thing back in some way particuarly when asked.

OP posts:
nicknamenotinuse · 03/02/2012 11:29

Heswell you sound like a very considerate, understanding bundle of fun.

bibbitybobbityhat · 03/02/2012 11:30

Heswall is having a right old laugh on this thread - I honestly think you should ignore her.

Happy have you spoken to the employers? I know it is extremely hard to do and you have to be assertive, but have you actually said to them "I'd like you to know how inconvenient it was for me to be kept working late again yesterday, especially as it was my ds's birthday, as you knew. I seem to be working late a lot and I'm afraid I'm not happy about that."

If you are going to leave anyway then you have nothing to lose.

MrsMicawber · 03/02/2012 11:32

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BIWI · 03/02/2012 11:36

What are your contracted working hours, MrsMicawber? You are entirely reasonable to say to anyone that you can't stay beyond those, especially if you have childcare issues.

IME, it's often those who haven't got children, or men who have wives/nannies to take care of their children, who behave like this. They need it to be pointed out to them, time and time again, that you can't just drop everything for them.

I know it's difficult, and that you feel you can't say anything, but that's why this kind of unreasonable behaviour keeps happening - it never gets challenged.

BIWI · 03/02/2012 11:37

And what would you have said if you were going to the theatre?

ElizabethDarcy · 03/02/2012 11:38

I really couldn't care less if Heswall is a tube driver or a surgeon... her attitude towards others just stinks.

A friend of mine is a heart surgeon, the most considerate man, hates to put people out - NO high 'n mighty attitude. One of my clients (whose child I look after) is an anaethetist, who has sole care most of the week of her child as DH is a TV journo and travels a lot... the child has never been picked up late... it's either her/a friend.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 11:44

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

OlympicGoldPennies · 03/02/2012 11:47

SDTG - that's a rather thinly veiled personal attack IMO.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 12:06

It's based on what Heswall herself has said here, Olympic - but maybe it is a bit harsh. However I don't think it Heswall has painted a particularly nice picture of herself as an employer.

But even ignoring the last paragraph, I believe I have made some valid points - that Heswall could get a colleague to ring home if she is scrubbed and can't get to the phone herself, so there's no excuse for not letting her nanny know she's going to be late, and also that treating her nanny with such a lack of respect and consideration is going to lead to a high turnover of nannies, which will not be good for her child. Do you disagree with either of these points, Olympic?

thebody · 03/02/2012 13:33

A parent needs only to be late in an extreme emergency which by nature are few and far between. It's just rude.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 15:12

That's not true, thebody. If, as we believe, Heswall is a surgeon/anaesthetist or operating theatre nurse, she cannot leave in the middle of an operation. It is very rare for a surgeon or scrub nurse to be relieved during an operation, for reasons of safety and continuity of care, so if a theatre list runs late - because an earlier case has complications that make it longer than its predicted length, or because an emergency case is put into the list, or because one of the surgeons is called away to deal with something else - then the list can, and often does, go on past the time it's supposed to finish - and basically the staff in that theatre have to stick with it until it is done. The surgeon then has to write up operation notes and may well have to see other patients, and the nurses have to clean up the theatre and see to the instruments. If you are lucky, someone will come in to help you or relieve you, but in my experience, you basically just had to finish on your own.

And this is by no means the only job that has unpredicatable elements to it, and many people have jobs that they cannot simply walk away from at 5pm. If the phone rings with something urgent, or a minor crisis occurs, it may mean that a parent has to stay to deal with it.

However, no-one has the right to be late without explanation or apology, or on a regular basis without prior arrangement; and communication is vital. As Happy said - had she known earlier that her employers were going to be late, she could have made alternative arrangements and not missed her son's birthday party. And if you have the sort of job where you may be detained at work past your nominal finishing time, then you make this clear to any nanny you employ, you find one who is happy to be flexible, and you remunerate her suitably for that flexibility - and crucially you don't take advantage of her flexibility - so if she has another commitment/appointment/family occasion to go to, and does need you to be home on time, you make sure that happens.

thebody · 03/02/2012 18:00

As a nursing sister, now a cm, i do actually

understand the way theatre works.

No one is suggesting a leaving a patient to die on the table!
All theatres have at least 2 non s rubbed runners who often make phone calls for those scrubbed. I have done this on many occasions.

Incidentally haswell isn't a surgeon!

It's rude to be constantly late to pick up your child from care, be that from nanny, cm or nursery.

Heswall · 03/02/2012 18:03

I didn't say I was.
But I do work within a theatre and it's not always as simple as asking somebody to make a phone call for you either, especially not a personal one.

thebody · 03/02/2012 18:09

I think to b fair it's a case of communication and understanding between the parent and carer with both respecting each others personal lives.

Which I guess we all agree on I suspect.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 18:13

Thebody - I agree that it is rude to be constantly late - I just didn't agree with you that only the direst, and most rare of emergencies are reasons for a parent to be late.

I have to say that I can't think of that many occasions when I was working in theatre, when it wouldn't have been possible for someone to make a quick call if neccessary. It might have to wait a few minutes until someone was free to do it, but it would be quite rare for it to be utterly impossible.

thebody · 03/02/2012 18:14

Yes agree with you.

Thetokengirl · 03/02/2012 18:25

I AM a surgeon. I have a Nanny who works long hours and I would NEVER be late like this. If I'm operating in the afternoon, then dh will make sure he is home. Ok, there are the odd occasions that we have been late but we will let our Nanny know as soon as we can and give her time back or pay her extra. Also, if we knew she had a special event one particular evening we would be absolutely sure to get home in time.
This has nothing to do with the expectations that people should have about their Nanny, this is just totally unacceptable and shows a total lack of respect.
This behaviour has really made me angry Angry

purits · 03/02/2012 18:33

Heswall didn't say she "worked in theatre". She said that she "worked in a theatre". Subtle difference. Are we talking dramatic theatres here?

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 18:38

Heswall also said, "There will be other days when I will be stuck in theatre..." - that sounds to me far more like she's referring to the surgical kind than the dramatic kind.

hohohoshedittant · 03/02/2012 18:38

I'm not sure it really matters!

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 03/02/2012 18:50

But it always matters that I am right, hohoho! WinkGrin