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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

Nanny asks for day off, is refused, and calls in sick anyway

153 replies

oranges · 19/09/2011 07:51

Our nanny asked for today off to greet her boyfriend when he gets back from holiday. I did try to accomodate her request but just couldn't. But her sister has now texted me to say she's not coming in. I have no choice but to believe her but it looks fishy. Can or should I say something? She calls in sick quite often and I've never said anything before than get well soon. And we give loads annual leave- 8 weeks a year, just on the understanding that it's taken at a time that suits us. I have also always said yes before for requests for time off, even if IRS inconvenient but today is really, really tough. Am wondering if we should look at nurseries instead.

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Original poster

oranges · 20/09/2011 12:13

Well I just left her some messages (she wasn't pickikng up the phone) asking her not to come in and that I would be giving notice. She called back, apologising, saying she was sick, but didn't realise that it was better to come in anyway. I asked why she;s had essentially one sick day a month and she said its related to period and contraception problems. Having them myself I'm sympathetic, but that's hardly a reason to stay home. She asked for another chance, swore that in future she would come in even she was unwell and said she had just had a thought process that goes: "I'm sick, so I'll stay home" and not thought how it impacts us.And all the text messages are because she doesnt have credit on her phone.
I've said there are repurcussions for dh and I at work, and that if she had called us, as her contract obliges her to do, we could have found a compromise ie that she has a duvet day with the baby, I get someone else to do the school drop and come home early. She's begged for another chance but I am disinclined, as I've started looking at other options and they seem much more appealing. I've even found a potential cm whose child goes to ds's school.

OP posts:

fraktious · 20/09/2011 12:17

To be fair if she used to work in a nursery they may have had a staff sickness policy but nannying is a completely different ballgame. If other options are more appealing then get rid and go with them.

drinkyourmilk · 20/09/2011 12:19

I would probably continue to look for other options but allow her to either work her notice period or contimue to employ her until you find a better solution then serve her notice.

HattiFattner · 20/09/2011 12:20

i dont think this will be the end of her piss taking. better to get rid and get someone who appreciates the work and the benefits.

TheOriginalFAB · 20/09/2011 12:27

Definitely get rid. She only could be bothered to speak to you when you said she was sacked. And to not realise that her actions have reprocussions is just ridiculous at her age.

MarinaIvy · 20/09/2011 13:48

Sheesh! Oranges - I've read through the other string, but didnt' feel compelled ro write, because everybody else has been thorough enough.

Until I read this latest piece of crap your nanny is spouting: that she had "not thought how it impacts us". Even I (not a main player in this scenario) can remember you've told her you need to be able to rely on her, etc! So even if all else - common sense, etc - didn't convince her to do the right thing by you, the fact that you've specifically told her should have, but clearly didn't before now.

Her priorities are to her boyfriend, her clubbing, her self-indulgence and not to you. I sympathise that you're concerned about her pulling herself up from the mess that is her family - it's to your credit and you're a lovely person. But you've already done more than enough. Get rid.

I'd also, if I were in your shoes, do more research about employment law and see how little you can get away with paying her instead of notice. You've already subsidised her lifestyle long enough. For instance, perhaps there are holidays she's taken that she shouldn't (they accrue, and she's only had six months of work).

Keep us posted. And good luck.

Blondeshavemorefun · 20/09/2011 13:51

Ditto fab - she had no credit to call you to say she was ill but managed to aquire some when so ill to come to work

Total bollocks - if you have no credit then you can't listen to messages on ansa machine - so to listen to yours she must have had credit - therefore lying

Obv she must know that if she doesn't come in then either yours or dh work suffers as a result

Hope the cm you found works out

RitaMorgan · 20/09/2011 15:39

Fair enough to have the mindset of "ill - don't come to work" - which was probably the policy they had at nursery (and didn't pay for sick days). But she didn't stay home because she was ill, she stayed home to see her boyfriend after being refused a day off and got her sister to call in instead.

That's the kind of bullshit I used to pull for Saturday jobs when I was 15 - too hungover to go to work so get someone else to call in sick for you!

EightiesChick · 20/09/2011 16:05

Ditto the above. If you keep her on now you will just be waiting for it to happen again, and it probably will after a certain amount of time has passed, probably at another rotten time for you. It's a llesson learned for her I'm afraid. If she hadn't pushed it too far with this last episode she'd still have a job. She is probably better off back in a nursery with a more structured environment and more overt management.

StealthPolarBear · 20/09/2011 16:57

she is full of it! Get rid of her!

nannynick · 20/09/2011 17:04

You can simply just dismiss her with payment in lieu of notice. She can't claim unfair dismissal as she hasn't been employed for a year. She could put a claim in for Wrongful Dismissal but she isn't denying having taken the time off work at no notice, so I'm not sure how far she would get with such a claim. Keep records such as attendance record, correspondence you have had with her about time keeping and sickness (including e-mails, texts).

When you obtained a reference from her last employer, did they not make any mention of sickness record? If it was a problem in that job, did they not mention that in a reference?

MustControlFistOfDeath · 20/09/2011 17:18

Get rid - before you know it she will have been with you for 12 months, then you will have a hell's own job trying to dismiss her when she starts her nonsense again.

It sounds harsh but she is not providing the service that you are paying her for - she would have been hauled over the coals (by me) with that record if she was working in a more formal setting (i.e. my old department), why should this be any different.

confusedpixie · 20/09/2011 19:04

Please don't make her age a factor, I'm younger than your nanny and work my arse off in jobs! It's a personality thing, not age-related.

You're doing the right thing by giving her notice.

Original poster

oranges · 20/09/2011 19:37

Thank you s much for a sense of perspective and clarifying that I'm not being unreasonable.
I can't keep her. In the midst of her "apology" she complained I hadn;t given her a payrise or a bonus. None was promised and its only been 6 sodding months and we were generous with the starting salary. I think someone's bending her ear about how she could be earning a fortune somewhere, and I think she needs to go find out for herself if its possible. She also admitted in that conversation that she's worn out as she's helping her boyfriend on various projects at evenings and weekends. I just hate to see a bright, ambitious young woman being given useless directions by the men in her life but I can't take her on as a project.
Now going to have roast chicken and red wine before relaunching childcare hunt. sigh.

OP posts:

gruber · 20/09/2011 19:54

Goodness me. You are definitely NOT unreasonable. You sound very fair and your nanny is completely ruining your childcare arrangements. Feel no guilt about firing her.

As a nanny I have not yet had a day off sick this year. Had 3 days off for tummy bug/vomiting last year which I didn't want to pass on to a)the children or b)my pregnant boss! To get it in perspective I rang the night before (when I thought I was going to be off) so as to give them the most notice.

Your nanny is completely unreasonable. Hope you find a good childcare solution (either daddy days & 2 day nanny or a really good nursery).

Dozer · 20/09/2011 20:04

Get rid. Definitely.

Hope sorting out alternative childcare isn't too stressful.

ChristinedePizan · 20/09/2011 20:08

Oh oranges :( I think your nanny and/or her family see you as a liberal middle-class bleeding heart mug who can be bled dry. I've been in a similar situation (not a nanny but I've been taken for a massive ride by someone who I wanted to 'help').

It's a hard lesson, makes you feel like a right mug, but you've done her a favour really - this will be a real shock to her and she'll either realise she can't take the piss any more or do something else with her life.

Good on you for not backing down, hope you find another great childcarer v soon :)

Georgimama · 20/09/2011 20:09

You can't dismiss someone with pay in lieu of notice unless the contract you have specifically states that you reserve the right to do this (a PILON clause). Employers have ended up in employment tribunal for doing this even though the employee hadn't suffered any financial loss. HOWEVER I think this doesn't need to worry the OP as the nanny has been with her less than a year. Have a look at the ACAS website OP.

I have had less than 7 days off sick in the three years I've worked for my employer, and I work full time (not a nanny a solicitor so no possibility of duvet days taking it easy while on duty). She is monumentally taking the piss.

Original poster

oranges · 20/09/2011 20:35

Oh and nanny nick she worked for ds old nursery and got an ok reference that mentioned health issues that were now resolved. I was naive and didn't probe further. She doesn't even have a clean crb as she had been in trouble as a teenager. God knows how she will get another job. But I do hope she does.

OP posts:

nannynick · 20/09/2011 20:43

Not having a totally clean CRB check is more common than you may think (I used to check CRB forms when they came back from the CRB). Only some things prevent someone from working with children. Shoplifting I seem to recall was often something listed... something I guess people might have done as a teen and don't do now. So things listed on a CRB check won't stop them getting another job, depending on what is listed and how many years ago it happened.

Any reference that mentions health issues, resolved or not, I feel invites a phone call to follow up. You know now for the future to follow up on that sort of thing.

StealthPolarBear · 20/09/2011 20:45

mental health issues?

StealthPolarBear · 20/09/2011 20:46

ignore

was just going to mention discrimination but it's me :o

limetrees · 20/09/2011 20:47

You are doing the right thing, so stay strong. I would definitely go for a nursery instead.

nannynick · 20/09/2011 20:53

Is this the same nanny you talked about back in December last year?

My advice then was: "Use her as a babysitter, useful to have someone to call on for that... plus there may be a time in the future when you would like to try her again for daytime care. However, sounds as though currently it's not going to work well... she needs to realise the job is different to being at nursery, far more responsibility, no breaks, very lonely."

If it's the same person, then she hasn't really accepted that the job is different to being at nursery has she? Nursery may have been ok to a point about her timekeeping and amount of absence but a nanny can't be late for work, or have lots of time off at short notice - it just doesn't work.

Original poster

oranges · 20/09/2011 22:10

yes nannynick it's the same one. . You were right. I was wrong. She talks a good game when confronted - I believed her assurances in December but won't make that mistake again.

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