why are people so against epidurals

[porcamiseria]

I am just curious, as the general vibe here (MN) and with the NCT and some midwifes is they are a bad thing.

I had one as was induced and literally could not cope with pain. I wont go into the whole story but its the usual ventouse, stitches etc. But baby was healthy and fine

My point is for me the epi was a godsend and the intense pains were not bearable.

If it happens again, I will have an epi if I can't cope. am due August, so its pertinent for me

It upsets me rather this attitude that they are to be avoided, as if you DO have one some people might feel like a failure?

I am 36 weeks pregnant with DS and not too scared about the birth but only because I had an epidural with DD (who is now 2.3).

She was back to back and it was agonising, after 26 hours I was sobbing for the epidural and it was brilliant, it completely eased the pains, she was born without me even having to push and about 3 hours after the epidural.

The entire birth process went from stressful, upsetting, terrifying etc to calm and happy, and expectant. I was able to drink a cup of tea, put tv on and a slice of toast (not meant to but I hadn't eaten in 24 hours and suddenly became starving to midwife allowed it).

However, I feel I failed somehow, whilst recognising that that is silly? I will try to have DS in 4 weeks without an epidural to prove to myself that I can do it. However, if its get too much for me, I will "give in" again. DH really wants me to have an epidural as he says it became a much more pleasant environment

"Maybe people are barking up the wrong tree then, if they are paying to attend classes which have a very heavy focus on natural childbirth, if they want something different?"

wow! you really don't take anything said to you on board do you?

"if they want something different".... to natural childbirth?
THIS is exactly the attitude that people are battling with
Most people I know who had interventions WANTED a natural birth (if at all possible). And as I've already described to you, going down the intervention route is not necessarily by choice

My hospital bag was full of massage oil, tens etc. I was dosed up with PMA. I didn't choose to not have a natural birth, it was simply no longer an option. And as natural was no longer an option I was SOO grateful that there were interventions available. If we'd not have had interventions we'd both be dead.

I WANTED to hear all about how best to ensure a natural birth, I WANTED to hear about positions and tens and massage. BUT that can (and should) be done without putting a negative spin on the safety nets there to catch you if natural birth fails.

Lots of people choose NCT because they want to give natural the best shot they can and do whats best for their baby. BUT if that doesn't work, the negative spin put on by a lot of NCT people can make them think they FAILED because of language like the language you've been using - i.e. that they CHOSE to NOT go natural

I've had 3 births (1 induction/epi/drip/section, 1 gas & air, 1 epi/'natural' labour with twins). Only reason I didn't have 3 epis was because I was convinced it was the path to another section which was very much on the cards. Wanted to retain control. When dr strongly recommended 1 with subsequent twins, I begged for it within minutes of arriving at hospital and relaxed the moment it went in as I was so panicked about pain of delivering 2.

All I would say is that I think any parenting class would be helping mothers/father to be if they showed what happens with an epi. I did know as they showed me the whole procedure in parenting class and so I coped with it a lot better. It was the only point in my first labour where I did feel I was coping. It's bloody scary esp if you never wanted one in the first place. Being more informed IMO helps a woman in labour to be more in control & make good choices/cope with difficult situations.

Salbysea - Exactly.

I didn't choose to have epilepsy and have a birthing pool, G&A, pethedine, aromatherapy and home birth all rules out in one fell swoop. I didn't choose to have my waters breat 36 hours before my son was born so that when i dropped out of labour overnight they had to induce me to get him out because of the infection risk. I didn't choose for the cord to be round his neck (fortunately not too tightly as it turned out) so that his heartbeat dropped with every contraction, meaning they had to do what they could to get him out as fast as they could once they had induced me.

All of those things just happened to me, and because of them, I needed an epidural. I have absolutely no resentment towards people who have had intervention free births, and I have no regrets about my own experience. I'm not bitter at all. But that's probably because I learnt what I knew from books which were completely neutral, spelling out pros and cons in tables, and I knew going in that it was 'epidural or bust'.

I have nothing but sympathy for women who go into birth thinking they will have literally 'failed' in some way if they have pain relief, or that they will be judged to have failed by other women. And sadly, until the prevailing attitude is that a birth is a birth, whatever the means, that feeling of failure will accompany an awful lot more women, haunting some of them for the rest of their lives. That anyone could go into labour having been put off the idea of interventions on the advice of anyone is, to me, abhorrent.

I was one of the few in my class that said they wanted an epidural if they needed it but I was induced and went from 2cm to 8cm in the space of 5 mins whilst waiting for the anesthetist to arrive so there was no time (they were going to do a cs). The mv had not heard of a TENS machine (disclaimer this was not in the UK) so was surprised to see it, and I had to have oxygen as DDs heart rate kept dropping every contraction so couldn't even have gas and air (just air I guess!). I didn't have nightmares about it but a least for a few days every time I closed my eyes I was reliving the agony. I had friends who loved their epidurals and I was quite jealous! (I also have other friends who were in labour for 5+ days and who are jealous of my 4 hour labour!)

The only thing that disappointed me about my epidural is that they refused to top it up more than once.

I went in thinking I was going to get total pain relief - which I did, for about 6 hours. Then they refused to top it up and I had nothing for pushing/episiotomy/forceps.

I was pissed off. Still am, how freaking dare that bitch from the NCT not prepare me for the fact that they often let it wear off for 2nd stage? Too busy spouting bollocks about how epidurals shouldn;'t be given in the first place.

they let it wear off?!! Seriously I would be very annoyed about that, is that normal? I was told once its in it can be topped up.

I had an epi with dc1 as my MW decided I wouldn't be able to cope without one. Yes I was in pain but it would of been nice to try and get through it. I couldn't move my legs and could not feel when to push so MW had to tell me when, DC got stuck as I was pushing against the contractions and she wouldn't crown. I didn't tear or need forceps, just the threat was enough to squeeze her out.
DC2 was as natural as could be, apart from a tens, couldn't use gas and air as asthmatic and had no inhaler.
All in all it was a much easier 'mother earth' birth, didn't feel him crowning and was over pretty quickly.
DC3 had an epi but only for an hour and only due to being started off. It wore off before I started pushing so a much nicer birth then DC1.
I hated the constant monitoring you get with an epi and threw mine across the room with DC1, With DC3 if she hadn't of been monitored MW wouldn't of noticed her heartrate dipping, cord wrapped round neck.
When I do it again I would prefer not to have an epi but it hasn't caused me any problems so it would just be a case of if the pain was too bad I would have one.

I'm not sure that's normal TBH, mine was topped up twice

I was just thinking that. They topped mine up several times - to the point where the side which was getting it all was still rather numb the next day!

I'd have complained to the delivery suite. (Not that it would have done anything but still, having a good rant can make you feel at least a little better...)

Pamelat, yes they did, I was so pissed off.

They let it wear off before the pushing stage and even though I was begging them to top it up they wouldn't.

The m/w was under the impression that the epidural was responsible for my failure to progress (or 'rubbish pushing' as she accidentally referred to it).

It was actually down to nearly 10 pounds of baby being jammed into an even more stuck fast position by my fruitless pushing.

A sr m/w eventually let me have a top up when I begged her for it she said yes because the instruments were coming out at that point.

Sadly the needle had been dislodged so it did bugger all.

I've been told it is quite common to let it wear off, I wish someone had told me that before I had one.

And the marvellous thing is that I get all the judgey 'oh you had an epidural' comments and none of the respect for actually going through an episiotomy and forceps delivery without pain relief.

NO wonder I'm going for an ELCS this time.

I did not go to NCT classes - I felt the money was better spent on a relaxing day of pampering - which was great , as no one ever tells you that you really do not get a break when you exclusively breast feed, so I look back in fondness on my pampering.

I found my birth experience to be incredibly positive and wonderful experience.

I had flashbacks about the birth and thankfully they were all positive .. but I can so imagine how different my mood would have been if it had been a scary experience, or if I or my baby had been unwell.

I am forever grateful to my Dh and the hospital staff for treating me so well but ... I don't tend to talk about it as so many other women seem so traumatised by their births or traumatised by the hospital environment.

the only downside I have found is that I do get aches at the site of the epidural, especially pre menstrual. Am pregnant at mo so not an issue but it gets quite sore for a few days each month otherwise.

Really pamelat? That's interesting.

My episiotomy always ached at time of the month (but not at mo as also pregnant).

I was induced. I had an epidural and lots of topups (can I have more pleeeeaaaaseeee )I can't explain how helpful it was! I slept and slept and slept until they told me I was ready to push!

I pushed my baby for a long time so MWs had to call the doctor. He literally walked in with scissors etc! I shouted at him and told him that I won't let him to touch me! He didn't. My MWs were amazing and very supportive.

I pushed my baby myself and didn't need any stitches.

Epidural was fantastic! I'd have it again if I needed to. I don't care what others think.

yeah they let mine wear off as well for the pushing stage - not something I was prepared for at all!!! I tried to think of an excuse or something so they'd top me up but didn't want to look like a complete wuss so I said ok (thinking I'll give it a go and then beg them for a top-up). But it was fine, I managed to push DD out in 16 mins flat. It must have helped that I was so rested as I'd had a long nap once they put the epidural in. Compared to the horrendous birth I had with my son, I'd go for the epidural/painful final stage every time.

i'd always thought a lot of the info I read about epidurals seemed to be based on old-stylee full-on epidurals, and I could never work out whether mobile/less stonking versions were now universally available in the UK. I wonder if Harri the anaesthetist is still here.

There was no chance for me to have an epidural because it all happened so fast - I'd always understood that epidurals can slow early labour down so nobody gets one until they are at least 3cm, but is that a UK thing? Would love to know.

I remember a doula I was interviewing coming out with some study about sheep not bonding with their lambs after epidurals which at least was a quick way to establish that we weren't soulmates. Reminded me of Anne of the Island where Anne had to have her 'baptism of pain' and be 'flushed with the holy fire of' yeah, whatever.

I'm not in the least proud of giving birth, have never quite understood that, any more than I understood why people said 'well done' to me afterwards, it always appeared to me to have very little to do with me at all, it was all down to my uterus which did the job, just a shame it has so many nerve endings involved. But I guess those who have to push deserve more congratulations, rather than those like me who spent 40 minutes with their legs crossed trying to hold the bugger in.

Possibly if I'd been able to have an epidural I might have considered having another child... probably not though. The six weeks of flashbacks was not nice though.

I had 2 epidurals...brilliant things. (better than birthing candles any day!)x

I had an Epi with DD. I was induced and had the hormone drip which was a killer.
After hours of back to back labour and painfully slow dilation and going through gas and air then pethadine I had the Epi.
It wasnt the natural birth i had wanted at all but was desperately needed at the time. My contractions were double peaking and lasting 2.5 mins each.
I was topped up 4 times! My labour ended in theater after 27 hours by turning DD with vontouse and the forceps.

Yes I agree that Epi's can lead to more interventions, But with DD being back to back and stuck, I doubt it would of added much difference to my labour.

Im currently 35 weeks with DC2 and again would prefer a natural birth but if an epi is needed again then ill def have one.
I do feel envious of the mums able to birth naturally with no pain relief but at the end of the day we all end up with a lovely newborn so theres no difference

Its a shame that some people look down on others who have had epi's during thier labours.

my mum spent most of my first pregnancy telling me all about one of her neighbours who'd been paralysed for life after an epidural - nice and encouraging story - so I was pretty not keen on having one after that. shame I then had to have a spinal for an em c section . I've not since heard anything about this as a side effect - is it really possible?

very interesting, and suprisingly "pro epi" which from a selfish point of view, I like to read...

NCT, well I am clearly not alone. TBH I think people do it once, also partly to meet people, are maybe not 100% pleased but put it down to experience. I met some lovely people, so thats good. But I would not piss on them if they were on fire TBH

I think there also is a definate brit bias to being a hard core natural birther too

MUM OF TWOS comment summed it up for me "I think I'll be more proud of myself if I get through it without
I think its sad some of us feel this way

I used to feel like a failure for having had an epidural, I dont anymore.

Bucharest thanks for the best wishes

San- I had plenty of those stories from my mum too. It did go through my mind briefly before having mine but then another contraction came which sealed the deal!

Really don't understand what the fuss is about. Had a terrible 27 hour labour with dd1 and insisted on an epidural when I needed a drip to speed up things (dd1 very stubborn - even now at nearly 3 ). At that point I slightly panicked and suddenly because of my fear the contractions were much much more painful. Still managed to push her out fine and had no side effects eg headaches of the epidural.
DD2 was much quicker (9 weeks ago) and born within 3 hours of waters breaking and I was fine with gas&air... There were only about two contractions I thought were somewhat painful, and I didn't much fancy the crowning bit which I obviously missed the first time round. But I would not have hesitated to have another epidural if necessary.
Honestly, I think it's perfectly safe and quite acceptable to have.
Good luck pigleychez yours might be as easy as my second
PS. I already want a third, so can't have been bad..

To be honest if you have a natural birth that is great that you achieved that and I'm sure it quite rightly makes you feel incredibly proud. However, it's not exactly the sort of thing you put on your CV and isn't really going to help you achieve much else in life. If you feel the need for an epidural have one.
Do you ever hear people talking about how they have had "natural migraines" or the "natural flu" as they did not want to take medication due to the possible negative effect on their livers !?
No ... exactly.