c-section a must, if refused i'll need to pay, advise on getting c-section on nhs or paying the nhs in wales, or private c-section in wales

[Ema76]

a c-section is a must for me.
i am really worried that i will be refused one on the nhs. if so i have to have options. can i pay the nhs to give me one? really want to have my baby in wales too which restricts me as it seems more private c-sections are done in London.
Does anyone know of a good private hospital in wales (south in particular) and how much it would cost?

Many thanks for your help.

Starlight - good luck with your labour

CoteDAzur - Asking for a section after a traumatic labour is entirely different to asking for one on your first pregnancy with no medical indications.

tiredlady - most health professionals i know would consider it rather unethical to try diagnose someone on an internet forum

tiredlady - You might be interested to hear that I had also done the research and wanted a c-section as a result. DD was a big baby and late scans confirmed that she would be over 4 kgs ('macrosomia').

I was patronised by the doctors/midwives in a similar fashion to this thread and refused a c-section.

Why should Ema have to go through a traumatic birth to be able to demand a c-section? Isn't the knowledge of traumatic births that happened to others quite enough?

Was definitely her attitude that annoyed me - and I've had a CS so have nothing against them, or women that want/need them.

Ema76 I haven't read all the thread (just the first page). I live in Wales (Cardiff) and did some research on the possibility of an Elective section privately. I had an emergency section with DD which was horrendous so when I fell pregnant with DS I was determined to have an elective. At that point (2006) a lot of the consultants at UHW were refusing second elective sections and making women trial VBAC first. I was adamant that I wanted an elective (had good reason as DD was an emergency section as she was stuck - small pelvis). I made a few initial enquiries and was told that there are no provate options for caesarians in Wales and would have to go to London.

Things may have changed now of course so it is worth talking to your consultant about that later on today.

In the end I didn't have to fight for an elective, they agreed straight away (due to small pelvis) and I had a lovely relaxing elective with a surgeon I trusted.

Having said that, it is a huge surgery with an awful lot more complications for the mother than a vaginal delivery. However, I hope that you get the care you need. Let us know how you get on - good luck today. Don't worry about crying in front of the consultant I was like a wailing banshee when I went it

I think that part of the reason that the OP seems irritating is her lack of appreciation of the realities of having a child.

I think that the point about this being a control issue is absolutly correct. When you are feeling really anxious it is nice to pretend that you have some sort of control over pregnancy and chilbirth. I dont think the OP really believes this though, or she wouldnt be insisting so much that she is in control.
I think that the difference for most of us is that we have been through this, come out the other side, and realised that the first thing we had to give up were our certanties.

I was like this before I had my first child(slightly - didnt want CS or to FF but was unrealistic - for some reason thought that having a normal delivery was a matter of just wanting it and trying really hard. How naive of me ).

Of course now I have children my priorities are different, they would always come first.
I was devastated to learn that the risk of death for mother and baby is higher in a section. In my ignorance I had thought that a CS was safer for the baby.
For me it is really an academic thing, as I actually had not choice but to have 2 of my children by CS, but it doesnt stop me feeling guilty that my body wasnt able to perform in the way it should to give my children the best delivery.

Tigger that is a very cool post.

It says it very well.

Jeez, Ema, some people have written som ereally unsupportive shal we say thing to you on here. I think you have made it very clear that you want a section. The only reason I can think of that that would be a bad idea is of you want to have a lot of children... say 5 or more. But if you only plan to have 2 or 3, then I see no reson why not.

I don't subscribe to the "natural is better" propoganda. I think the choice should yours.

What I would advise is that you go into the consulting knowing the nice guidelines. Highlight the points that will help your argument. And make it clear verbally and in writing (ideally on your maternity notes) that your clear preference is for an elective section. MAke is clear that any consequenses of being forced to have a vaginal birth will be a direct result of their decision and not yours. I think you'll get the section, to be honest, if you are prepared and determined in your argument.

Feel free to CAT me if you want to talk more.

Ema's 'attitude' has been admirably calm and civil on this thread, given that she has been attacked by strangers and even insulted for choosing c-section over vaginal birth, which is essentially a personal choice that is nobody else's business.

There are plenty of obstetricians out there who do think a planned section delivery is the safest for the baby.

The problem with the statistics is that wehn a vaginal birth goes wrong, and an emergency section is performed, any resulting complications are put into the caesarean category when actually it was the vaginal part of the birth that went wrong and the caesarean probably saved that baby from being a mortality statistic. So, it is very misleading to report the positive correlation between caesarean and birth defect.

I hardly think a c section is avoiding pain! Far from it.

Tiredlady..

I fail to see that wanting to have a say in how you give birth (control) and choosing an elective c-section is any different to wanting more control so opting for a home birth. Home birth fans do not get the slating on MN that ladies who make it clear they prefer an elective c-section do and no-one hinst that home birthers are control frwaks who will have a hard time adjusting to life with a new-born because of their preference for being in control.

My first pregnancy and quick return to work mirror Ema76's plan exactly and I never had the remotest hint of PND with either baby.

I did wonder what the hell I had done in the many small hours wakings with a colic suffering first baby and want to cry at times but that was sleep deprivation and limited assistance from dh/family.

3 sections isn't that advisable (I've had 3 - my third had a partial rupture - probably before labour began). In fact if there's any chance you will want more than one (and lets face it in 99% of cases you don't know until you have one) then I'd advise avoiding a section if possible. This comes from the experience of having problems from my first (completely straightforward) section that affected my 2nd and 3rd pregnancies.

My main concern with the posts is the idea that "I will be in total control of the birth process'. That's unrealistic. Having compared sections and labours I had a lot less control in a section. My advice to get counseling was to give a chance to go through that really. I think going into any form of childbirth with the idea that you will be in total control is mentally risky.

Women who birth at home are generally a self selected, motivated, low risk group, so difficult to compare them with women who deliver in hospital, but as far as I am aware home birth does not increase risk. CS does increase risk.
Home birth is cheaper than hospital birth, and CS is more expensive than a traditional hospital birth.

These might be some reasons why people are less in favour of non-medically indicated CS than of home birth.

Oh and my natenatal class leader clearly thought I was in for a big shock and not being realistic. I admit that things went well for me despite ds suffering from colic and screaming for hours most nights each week in the first 3 months.

The lady who suffered very badly with PND from our ante natal group was the one who wanted minimum intervention, no pain relief if possible, took own birthing ball, cd player and choice of music, own pillows etc etc into hospital. She endured a long drawn out labour with a cascade of intervention and a long wait for the c-section which was finally decided on. She had a little cry when we all met up again for the first time as she felt she'd failed and quizzed me big time on how I felt about my c-section which I had not previously made common knowledge as being medically unecessary. She said that people responded with "what a shame" etc when they found out her ds had been born by c-section and she didn't feel like talking about the birth like other new mums did so she felt isolated. I pointed out that she'd been through more physically to give birth to her ds than most other mothers, having laboured for a long time and then having a c-section when knackered at the end of the long labour but I don't think she could see that. It wasn't what she had planned/hoped for and some people commiserated with her over the birth method, factors in the PND, maybe?

Well it sounds as if her ideas around birth were rather unrealistic. DS1 was born by c-section after an 18 hour labour and no sleep for 48 hours and it was straightforward, easy (at the time- the problems came later) and nope I didn't feel shame at all.

But I think anyone saying "I will have exactly the birth I want and that is my right' (whatever form of childbirth) should have counseling pre childbirth really. Because if they do it's from luck.

sorry but how well your birth goes generally has little impact on whether you'll end up with PND. I had 3 TOTALLY different birth experiences, and had PND with all of them (and one of those births was the most amazing birth I could ever have dreamt of)

I agree FAQ. I had some bloody awful births and some truly dreadful times in the weeks post birth (physically and mentally). Never had a hint of PND. Suspect a lot is hormonal.

Do think that being realistic about how out of control you are in any form of childbirth is helpful though.

I posted on this thread yesterday more than 6 times.
I resent people saying , oh what nasty things were said to Op. And quoting me.
I resent people saying, oh the posters were nast justy becasue Op wanted a CS.
That was not what caused my exasperation. Let me state again. I have had an elcs, and am due to have another soon. So how could i possibly be critical of Op. I can not.

But Op wa so adamant. She said the equivalent of :
I want one. I will have one. I pay taxes and am entitled. I will only have therapy, so that I get my CS.

I just thought that she should atleast be open minded. It IS POSSIBLE that she may end having a vaginal birth. And she needs to prepare for that emotionally. But she refuses to. It was that that caused my exasperation.

For those being critical, thinking everyone was nasty to her just becasue she wants a elcs. Read again.
Read the thread properly. Becasue that is NOT what happened on this thread.

I agree Oblomov. I certainly wasn't criticising the OP's decisions either - I think she does need to address the phobia that she clearly has though. I've had 2 em CS myself so would never dream of judging a woman on the type of birth she chooses.

And jimjam, and others who point out that you are out of control whatever form of birth you choose/end up with are quite right. With a CS you are completely in the hands of the medics - if anything I'd suggest that you are more out of control than with a VB. The OP would do well to realise this, but seems to be ignoring the worthwhile advice that she is being offered by posters on that side of the argument.

I have to agree with Oblomov on the point about atleast appreciating that a vaginal birth might happen...

My Doula made me at least consider that and we discussed what would happen.

And, from the moment I found out I was PG, I wanted an El CS. I went private to get it, but you do still have to consider VB because there is an outside chance that the baby might have to be born that way.