Breastfeeding

[Anniiee24]

Hi all,

Sorry this is a little long but need some advice. My newborn is 8 days old today.

At first I struggled to get her to latch but managed to at 6 days in! So I am currently EBF

The problem or concern I have is - I am not getting enough sleep because my baby is always feeding. She is always on my boob, like she is hungry 24/7 - this is giving me no time to sleep and I feel like a zombie.

Is this normal? For example, I have been up since 3am and she is still on my boob, it is now 08:37

She is having wet and dirty nappies so not concerned she isn't getting enough. But being on my boob for 5 hours - I am absolutely exhausted. If by any chance she does fall asleep, I will put her in her crib (swaddle sometimes) but she will just wake up and scream wanting to be fed again

I could express but due to the first few days having a bad latch, my nipples are sore and broken. feeding her is bad enough, I am almost screaming in pain every time

Please advise me.

This sounds a bit like it might be cluster feeding? We didn't have a successful breastfeeding journey so cant offer much advice on that but hopefully someone else can.
If she is cluster feeding that is normal, she's brand brand new and just trying to get into the swing of it. Highly recommended lasinoh nipple cream for your nipples also.
Expressing is even more work trust me, feeding baby for however long then pumping then repeat, affected me mentally too much.
When your midwife comes out again ask her to check for tongue tie too x

Please have the baby checked for tongue tie! My DD was tongue tied and I knew she was and I told anyone that would listen and no one listened. It stopped our bf journey before it even began and they left it 10 weeks before listening to me and separating it! It does sound like cluster feeding though! Their stomachs are the size and a cherry which slowly expands the older they get so they need lots of milk. Plus baby is sending signals to your body to produce milk so the cluster feeding will calm down and you will have longer feeds once your supply has developed

Are you making sure you are eating and drinking enough? I found when I was breastfeeding if I wasn’t well hydrated I wouldn’t have as much milk.

Breastfeeding provides the baby with milk, but also with safety and cuddles. So she may be crying because she wants to be close to you to know she's safe . Once she's latched on she knows mummy is right there.
Look up the Seven safe co-sleeping steps. You sleep and baby feeds. Look up also the fourth trimester to explain how baby's continue to develop outside the womb and why they need mummy so close

Cluster feeding is exhausting but completely biologically normal and won't last forever

She is cluster feeding to establish your supply, but your supply will be badly impacted if you're that tired. Get your partner to take her for a couple of hours to give you some sleep, bum patting, cuddling and a walk in the pram/drive in the car will distract her.
Eat and drink more than you did when pregnant, BF takes 500-700kcal per day from you in the beginning. You need to be hydrated and nourished too!
If she's falling asleep on the boob and then waking up, try a dummy, she'll be using you as a mummy-dummy because it's comforting. Put some milk on the dummy to get her to take it.
30 minutes for a feed to fill her tummy, then an hour with the dummy to give your nipples a break, you'll know if she's properly hungry!

This pattern of feeding is normal at the beginning, but it shouldn't be excruciatingly painful. Would definitely get baby checked for tongue tie (privately, not by a midwife or GP).

I really, really struggled with a latch with my first and for some reason everyone was adamant I shouldn't use nipple shields. In the end we gave up.

Second time I did, and there was no problem going back and forth between and we had a much easier ride and I don't know why I listened to other people the first time.

Do what works for you.

I'd recommend getting advice from your HV just to check everything is OK. You can also call the national breastfeeding line.

However this type of feeding early on can be normal...I remember very vaguely a day where DD was on the boob for 8hrs. I used lasinoh cream before and after every feed during those early weeks. I did express from around week 4 but DD refused bottles after a while, although by that point she would go 2hrs between feedings. If you have a partner, they could try baby wearing so baby feels secure and you get a break.

I do wish you were told about this in antenatal classes or when you've given birth as the current 'it's free and easy' narrative that is being pushed is not realistic for the majority, especially in those first few weeks.

If it's painful to that extent you need to be careful. You don't want to get infections through saliva getting into your blood stream from breaks in the nipple skin. Can you call the national breast feeding helpline.
Sounds like you're doing a great job but don't let I hurt you that much, you need to be looking after your self and treating your self extra well for the next few months. You're in recovery too.

Hi all, thank you so much for your responses.

Back to the feed at 02:24. She sleeps all the way through the day for 4/5 hours and wakes for feeds. I'm wondering if she has her day/night mixed up? (Obviously only a baby so know this is very possible) FTM if you all hadn't of guessed!

@Princesspeachee I have the cream, lifesaver at the moment! @Princesspeachee @Mamabird2022 - she has been checked for tongue tie by multiple midwives and in the hospital. Is it worth going private though so many have said she doesn't have it?

@Neodymium honestly, before your message I didn't even prioritise my eating, I was just so exhausted. I have now started eating/drinking enough to produce the milk!

@Midnightpony thank you! Happy for all the cuddles and snuggles, just wish they were at reasonable times lol

@StylishM bless my DH, he is trying his best to be as supportive as possible but a little hard when I am not expressing or allowing FF in the day. I want to EBF and don't want to give up :(

@lavenderdilly did you stop and start the nipple shields? I'm scared to use them again because I don't want her to forget my latch without them

@Lammveg I completely agree! I honestly thought breastfeeding was easy going (didn't even realise a good latch was needed???) I prepared/researched so much but honestly nothing compares to the real thing. Pregnancy was a breeze in comparison to this!

@crostini thank you! It's nice to hear that, feel like I'm a let down and struggling but that just gives the extra boost to keep on going

All - she makes it worth it! Just wish it was a little easier, no one really tells you what it's really like!

Congratulations on your baby! And well done for persevering with getting her to latch. I'm assuming you pumped to get your supply going while you persevered with latch?

5 hours seems like a really long time to be feeding for. Cluster feeding is normal but you do want to make sure she is taking enough milk, particularly if latch is painful or she seems immediately hungry after a long feed. Is it just at night she feeds like this? Whats her pattern like during the day?

I would seek some support from someone like the Breastfeeding helpline or La Leche League, or find a local support group for advice. Maybe even a lactation consultant but they are costly. Breastfeeding is hard. And nobody tells you how hard, so we go into it thinking it will just happen naturally and we're unprepared. But there is decent support out there

You poor thing. I went through this. Baby settled down eventually but it was hard at first.

Co sleeping helped. Are you sure your latch is ok? No drips as she’s feeding, has a big mouthful of breast? Can you get a local breastfeeding counsellor to check for you?

it feels like hell in this early stages but it does work out. Good luck.

Firstly congratulations on your daughter and well done, bf can be so tough! Just wanted to say agree with most pps and sounds like mega cluster feeding. Which will be harder if tired and not getting to eat enough.

sounds like she’s also sleeping very long stretches in the day. To help establish day and night make sure you’re house is nice and bright and not extra quiet in the day and then dark and quiet at night. Also 4/5 hours is a long time to let a newborn sleep in the daytime, at that point I was waking her every 2-3 hours to feed dd in the daytime to try and avoid reverse cycling. It can be tricky but usually a nappy change will wake them up! She would cluster feed for hours and hours during the day - currently 6mo and feeding her as I type, promise it gets better!

and like other pps suggest, get breaks, eat plenty, get checked for tongue tie (don’t panic if she is!) and get support from a consultant or someone like la leche league. You got this!

Day 11 and no change. Feel like giving up

Breastfeeding is so hard

It's so hard at this age. But you need to make sure she's getting the calories in during the day to allow sleep at night. At the moment she's got it the wrong way around. Feed feed feed during the day. Wake her. Every 2-3 hours max. Ideally that cluster feeding will happen in the evening. It's a pain in the butt but it will stop soon.

And if your nipples are that sore I would get a private tongue tie check. It's so often missed by the nhs

Also there is no shame in stopping. For BF to be successful it needs to be right for both you and baby. A miserable mum is good for no one. Combi feeding might be for you

Get some silver nipple shields to heal your cracked nips. Available on amazon.... Worked like magic to heal me

@Whentwobecomesthree I have kept her up every hour/ 2 hour from 10am-12am hoping in the night she will be exhausted and sleep well but still no luck.

Though all have said no tongue tie, I am getting her checked Monday privately!

I know there is no shame in stopping BF but when it's all you've planned for 9 months and imagined a breeze, it's hard to let go :(

@SophieHope7 waiting for prime day! Thank you

Hiya, my baby was like this and slept in the day because he was so tired from feeding because he wasn't latching properly because of a tongue tie. Have you had your baby weighed yet? That might tell you if they are latching properly and getting enough milk. Poor latch is usually what causes pain. My baby has a lip tie and got sucking blisters on his lips, has yours got anything like this? They do cluster feed so much to increase your milk supply at the beginning but it gets easier, mine was sleeping 8 hours by 3 months. That said it is definitely OK to give up! We introduced one bottle of formula at 9pm so I could sleep 8pm-2.30 then I would wake him for a feed. Have you got a breastfeeding clinic at your hospital, mine helped so much. To increase your supply you need to feed between 12 and 3am so if they're not feeding as much then I would wake them then to feed instead. You have more milk then too so it might fill them up more, if not it will increase your milk for the rest of the day. I've done this if my supply has dropped after sickness etc and it always works for me.

You poor thing. It sounds like you're having a difficult start.
Is there a breastfeeding support group you can attend? Few things:

1. You said multiple people checked for tongue tie, but did they do it right, do they have qualifications? Did they check mouth function? The test should take good few minutes and it's not just opening mouth and looking.
2. Having said that most issues are to do with bad latch. That's where a support group might help. There are lots of positions to try. Koala hold helps some, for example.
3. Once you have first two sorted try feeding lying down - they can show you at support group how to do it successfully and safely. You'll get much more sleep this way.

It does get better, I promise. I hope you'll get the support you need though.

Is she actually feeding for the whole 5 hours or is she very slowly suckling? If slowly suckling she is using you as a dummy.

My 3 week old has been trying this and I've been trying to give her a dummy instead but she hates it unfortunately!

Could you try expressing and feeding with a bottle for a few days? If she improves it may be her latch being inefficient. Babies get better at latching as their muscles develop and their mouths get bigger - breastfeeding is hard work for them too.

Hope things improve soon!

Babies don't use mums as their dummies, mum is comfort, love, warmth, everything they've had for 9 months, of course they want to be close. Dummy is substitute for breast, not the other way around.

It's hard, and that's why there are things and people to help, and dummies help many. But please don't spread this myth. Cluster feeding is to establish supply and telling a new mum her baby is using her as a dummy can do more harm than good.

It's perfectly normal for her to have day and night mixed up. That doesn't change until around 6 weeks. You need to sleep in the day when she sleeps.

Are you burping her during these cluster feeds? A lot of the time they want to keep feeding when they have wind to take their mind off the discomfort.

You're still early days with this and it may still get easier.

I struggled at the beginning and what helped was:

Asking for lots of help. Call the helplines, ask your health Visitor or whatever breastfeeding groups are near you.

Making sure baby was awake and feeding actively as much as possible when they were on the boob. He has a tendancy to fall asleep and sort of half suck. Feed well to sleep well and have the energy to feed well again.

I used nipple shields intermittent when it was just too painful. Perhaps for a day or overnight. Then tried to get back to nipple after. Lots of lansinoh cream too.

Drinking loads of water. I must be having about 5/6 litres a day in this heat. Pints and pints of squash! And I notice in the evening I don't have as full breasts if I haven't been drinking enough in the day.

Skin to skin time. It made everything work better for some reason. And it's too hot for anything else right now!

This is really normal, it is hard going. It will get better. The main thing I took from your post is that she is sleeping more in the day - you don’t mention whether she is sleeping 4-5hours in one block or several, but you need to prioritise sleeping during this time. Dial back the visitors/walks/laundry/whatever and sleep as much as you can during the day.