I am very scared to deliver a baby under the NHS after hearing so many horror stories.

[Nature-Thrive]

For starters, I am a mother to an 8 year old. I am originally from the USA and that is where I delivered my son. I had amazing care and my OBGYN was called when I went into labour. She saw my care from start to finish, including postpartum. I struggled a lot and needed a ton of support and I had great insurance so it was available to me.

Before I start, please understand that I am in no way trying to bash the NHS. All I am doing is trying to figure out how to get good care again.
I haven't had the best experience under the NHS and after talking to some local moms, I am very scared to have a baby here.

We are based In Birmingham and I had a horrible experience at the Queen Elizabeth Hospital to the point where even driving by the hospital causes me anxiety. It was so bad that it's been escalated to hospital heads and we will be having a sit down.

Can anyone provide any insight or advice on what I should do? Do I move to a different area to access another trust? If so, where would you recommend?
Thank you so much.

PS - I do not want an NHS debate by any means and please don't tell me to "go back to my country". I got plenty of that over on Reddit.

@Nature-Thrive it’s best to ask people in person who have actually been there.
online is a good platform for people to voice the negative and for 1 negative there will be 100 with a positive experience.
I had gestational diabetes and the prenatal care I got was brilliant.
postnatal ward wasn’t too bad- infant feeding midwife’s were brill. Induction ward was boring as hell but I felt like I was in good hands once things got going. (Granted I didn’t get the drugs I wanted because baby had different ideas and wooshed through 6cm quickly)
it was clean, and lovely ladies were available to make cups of tea.
They also have a great security system to ensure baby stays with you.

maybe your best bet is to go private as you have different expectations/experience being from the states.

Scary how?

I gave birth at The QE Womens hospital in Birmingham which is just a different building at the same site.
I found the care beforehand was excellent ( had to go 3 times a week for the last 3 mths of pregnancy)
The care whilst in active labour also excellent. My lovely midwife stayed with me for hours and hours until I had to have an emergency c section. Theatre staff were lovely too.
Where it fell down was once we were back on the ward. The nursing staff were just so busy and pulled in all directions. I really had to fight to get timely pain relief and help trying to breastfeed plus having to collect my own food was so difficult as I could barely walk. They also wrote in my medical notes that I'd had twins! I hadn't

Go private and have a c section. quicker and more controlled all round. I think our mat services are not fit for purpose

Maybe an NHS hospital in the countryside. Less rushed, more care, but we do need more midwives. A birthing pool might be a good idea. Not sure if Nuffield Hosp in Taunton does births, but they were caring for my mum.

I didn’t have a good birth with my first. I had counselling afterwards, birth reflections (I was given apologies and they changed procedures as a result), I had more counselling when I was pregnant, a PMA took me into a birthing room at the original hospital so we could discuss my options and face difficult surroundings and I look at a different trust hospital. I ended up with the support of PMA using the original hospital and I had a good birth. I would strongly suggest contacting a PMA midwife at your trust and talking to her about your concerns.

@cautionroguerobots @QuidditchThroughtheAges
If you've read the OP you will know op is American so probably just doesn't realise the Womens is a different building to the QE. But is on the same site. No need to be so pedantic

The US is a very large country and maternity services vary vastly from one State to the next. I think you may not have researched thoroughly what would be involved in giving birth back in the USA. Medicare is for the old and disabled and is a complicated and lengthy process if you are not over 65. Maybe you are thinking of Medicaid. That varies greatly from State to State and is absolutely not just given to you automatically. You have to apply and it's only available to people who are low income (and resident in the State/County they are applying in).

Having said that, both my dc's were born in London in two different NHS hospitals and the experiences were abysmal and I would go back to the USA with or without the husband if I had it to do all over again. The NHS almost killed me and my dc's both times. The hospitals were understaffed, filthy and much of the basics (like running water) were broken. (Birthing pool didn't seem to have water going to it, so never filled up.) I have seen cleaner better staffed hospitals in 3rd world countries. I got little to no pre-natal care and the post natal care was worse than useless. (I lived in a poor, high immigrant neighborhood with understaffed GPs and hospitals.)
I have been back in California for some years now and because of a set of unfortunate life situations am unemployed and on Medicaid (the insurance for low income people) and have received pretty consistently far better care than anything I received in the UK in the 7 years I lived in London.
I also had looked into a CS at the private Lindo Wing at St. Mary's and within a few weeks of conception I tried to book a room and they were already booked far beyond 9 months out. DS was born in the NHS part by emergency CS after 40 hours of labor (the last 10 of which we were waiting for an Anesthetist and Surgeon to be available). My records (which took me 2 years to get a copy of) said I had been in labor for 1.5 hours. Perhaps that's why the UK statistics look so good....they're completely inaccurate. (This is not the only medical test/procedure I had that was completely accidentally/purposely written incorrectly in my records.)

@Flopisfatteningbingforchristmas thank you so much for this info. Every little bit helps from all of you ladies. I feel like I am more prepared to get a decent birth plan in place. It's making me feel so much better. Thank you.

I have had my first baby here in France and feel the same as you about having a second if we move back to the UK.. I’ve only heard horror stories from NHS births. In your case I’d definitely go private if at all possible. Good luck! X

@SofiaAmes - yea, I was thinking Medicaid. Sorry I wrote Medicare. I am still an active resident of Arizona and I would qualify for everything. I worked and paid taxes for years there so if I ever needed to go back and get the care, I would be able to. I had a friend who was fully on state care and received the same exact care as I did with top of the line insurance.

As far as what happened to you goes, I am so, so, so very sorry. My God! You did not deserve that type of treatment.

@poppyredred thank you so much Poppy. That is great advice. I will look into it.

Obviously, different people have different experiences, and some people have definitely had terrible NHS experiences (and we know that there were institutional problems in some cases, e.g. Shrewsbury).

However, there are also plenty of people (myself included) who have had excellent experiences of giving birth in the NHS. In my case, it wasn't an easy birth, I had to have an induction, which ultimately failed, then a C-section. Not only did DD and I come through that experience safely, but I felt looked after and supported both physically and emotionally. Oh, and everything was perfectly clean.

I'm now expecting my second. There are some possible issues with growth which were picked up at the 20 week scan. I've had 2 weekly scans since then, I know how to get hold of the consultant if I need to - the consultant even told me to tell him if I felt having weekly scans would help me not to worry! I've had the opportunity to talk through everything I want to with the consultant. The midwives and sonographers have also all been excellent.

What I'm trying to say is that the horror stories aren't a reflection of everyone's experience. There's every possibility that your experience will be one of the good ones. Obviously if there are things you can do (e.g. hire a doula) that might help to make sure your experience is good, then that's not a bad idea, particularly if you're worried about it. But giving birth in the NHS is a very long way from a guaranteed nightmare. You just don't tend to hear lots from people who had good experiences!

(And I say all this as someone who's not the biggest fan of the NHS funding model and would rather we had a European style system, so this definitely isn't from a point of view of being biased towards it.)

@StarCourt tbh I don't even know why this is a thread as she isn't pregnant and doesn't appear to be even reading things properly. Not sure why the princess of wales birthing unit got a 'oh that looks scary'..

Bizarre thread

Look @Nature-Thrive get insurance, pay privately or do some actual research on births in the uk rather than listening to scare mongering or go back to Arizona for your birth if you really don't rate the nhs

@Nature-Thrive you can ask for 121 midwife care (it is called “Continuity of Carer” www.rcm.org.uk/promoting/professional-practice/continuity-of-carer/) and also self-refer to peri-natal mental health team who will support you and make a care plan for you for the midwifery team to follow.

I don’t think the fatalistic comments here about how you’ll have a bad time because you expect it are helpful at all, there is a lot of help.

Doula services are not regulated on the UK and there have been exposes on women trusting a doula who didn’t turn up or made the experience worse. The disappointment having relied on that so much had a worse impact.

Private hospitals in the UK only deal with standard births, anything unusual or emergency you will be taken to the NHS part of the hospital.

With home births, there is no guarantee you will have two midwives because there is a midwife staffing issue with covid as well and people who can retiring.

I mention the points above about doula, private and home birth because they could be good options for you, but becoming overly-focused on it as the “one and only thing” means that I know a few people who suffered the most from creating this golden view to get them through pregnancy and then it was shattered, whilst actually they had a standard birth experience

It looks like Birmingham Women’s Hospital has CoC bwc.nhs.uk/news/continuity-of-carer-midwifery-teams-to-launch-in-early-2020-2682

PNMH services can be used pre-conception www.bsmhft.nhs.uk/our-services/specialist-services/perinatal-mental-health-service/

The maternity wards give tours to get to know them, so you could engage with those, ring up if not listed.

I had huge mistrust of the service, because I know it’s over-stretched, especially when I was giving birth beginning of second lockdown Nov 2020. They let me meet with an ob-gyn surgeon who specialises in mental health, and the director of midwifery called me to have a chat.

If you really feel you need additional care, I would suggest a private midwife service for antenatal care in addition to NHS and see if the hospital will accept that private midwife attending your birth.

I’d also recommend an American app called Maven which links you to Uk based professionals similar to system you’re familiar with, that might make you feel better. www.mavenclinic.com

Just to add, a PMA came with me for every appointment I had with my consultant. I struggled to decide over VBAC (my first choice) and ELCS (consultant strong preference for me). He and the PMA even meet me on the ward outside of clinic times when they were on the ward - it meant I had to wait until he wasn’t needed but he was so helpful. In the end I argued to book and ELCS at 39 week, he booked it with him doing the surgery and when the PMA I had seen was on duty. In the end I went into labour before this and decided to have a VBAC. I did come across an unpleasant consultant in labour, I ignored him and told my midwife I wanted to see the PMA on duty. She was in meeting but said she would be there as soon as it was finished. She came and told me she wouldn’t allow him back in the room. I didn’t need a doctor for delivery but did later and they just got a different one. My consultant came to see me the next day to give his congratulations.

Doesn't America have a higher rate of babies and mothers dying in childbirth. I know where I'd rather give birth. Maybe try a home birth or a birthing centre.

I would highly recommend a doula. I hired one after my first birth and she ensured I got the best birth possible. She helped me recover from the trauma of my first birth and was able to liaise with the hospital. First one was a mismanaged mess by the nhs team. If u are still in Birmingham sorry haven’t read the full thread I can recommend u the doula I used. Or u can search on the doula website.

I had amazing care from post natal to ante natal care on the NHS. The midwife team were amazing. I was treated with kindness and respect and the facilities were immaculate. I paid for a private room so didn’t share.
I think you could probably Google giving birth in any country and get a stack of complaints and horror stories.
the NHS might be underfunded but the staff are brilliant.

@User6784097 - yes, we are still in Birmingham and will be here for a few more years giving the current economy. Please give me the name of you doula. I don't know how to direct message you, but I will keep an eye out for your response. Thank you so much.

@Holakaleidoscope I don't know to be honest. I had an amazing experience with my OBGYN and her team. Everyone I've ever known had great experiences from well off people to people needing to use state medical coverage.

@Flopisfatteningbingforchristmas - how did you go about getting this PMA? Did you hire her privately?

@greenwich23 wow! Thank you for all of these links. I am about to save all of them in my laptop and go through it with my husband. Please feel free to share anything else at any point. I will be checking this thread for the next few days.

No. PMA are professional midwife advocates. They are the most senior midwife grade in your trust, they are responsible for training/mentoring other midwives and advocating for women. I would have had one physical over see my actual vbac any way because I was so high risk but not involved otherwise. One helped me negotiate with the consultant to agree on use of birthing pool or labour but not delivering even though I was outside of trust guidelines.

• my trust!