Am I being unreasonable? Dad to be...please help

[simba86]

My wife and I, married for 3 years, together for 10, in our late 20s are expecting our first child at the end of May.

My wife has never really got on with my parents, particularly my mum, and whilst they live 2 hours away we see them ever couple of months.

I am obviously very excited about becoming a dad. I love my wife more than anyone in the world and so much looking forward to having our own family. I am also looking forward to being a proud dad and introducing our baby to my parents shortly after the birth, when everything has calmed down and my wife is well enough to see not visitors, but our immediate family.

However because of the break down in the relationship between my wife and my parents, my wife does not want me to let them know if she goes into labour, so that they are not hanging around the hospital or nearby, nor does she want them to visit after the birth until she is ready, which she has indicated could be many hours after the birth, or when we go home, or even a week or so after the birth. She is so stressed out about this she has driven off tonight after writing me a letter saying she doesnt want me at the birth, nor does she want me to be her husband.

I can assure you I have been as supportive of her and her family over the past 10 years more than most people could ever imagine, and as someone who has a rare medical condition with no known cure and an uncertain future, an only child, I don't want to miss out on a special moment for me.

I dont want my parents hanging around or interfering and have made that clear to my wife, I just want to share a moment with my parents, my wife and our baby shortly after they are born when my wife ia well enough.

Surely this isn't me being unreasonable....or is it?

Please share your opinion on this

I missed that about the illnesses, sorry. Being a child's primary carer is tough work! I speak as a disabled parent who is a primary carer btw. It's fab in lots of ways but I certainly can't say it's improved my health (does lack of sleep ever improve health...?)

In fairness, unless simba's parents are going to put the baby in danger, neglect it, or deliberately ignore and flout the parents' parenting decisions, then saying they can't babysit does seem unfair.

Not at all! I have a rather higher standard of who babysits my child than simply "not going to do any harm". And if one parent has an acrimonious relationship with the grandparents, I think actually that is reason enough to say no.
Grandparents have no automatic right to a child.

Families differ. Ours were hundreds of miles away and none came when all the 9 cousins were born. It was not what any of us wanted or needed, whether wife's or husband's parents. A visit from them in the first 6 weeks might have happened.

other families where everyone lives neary by and are in and out of each other's houses every day might expect them there in the birth room even.

You just cannot generalise.

I loved it that both sets of parents were hundreds of miles away. I was the adult. I was forming my own family and doing things my way and the last thing I wanted was noise and disturbance. Not all women are like that of course. I would ban all visitors for at least a week after a baby is born unless they come solely to clean the house and cook, don't speak and don't go into the room where mother and baby is.

This is so personal an issue it really has to be down to your wife.

(Ours just about never babysat unfortunately even though we both worked full time)

I am happy for my mum to babysit several times a week but my MIL never has. My mum understands and supports me, my MIL not so much. I'm the one that is there most of the time so it's my choice. Nothing wrong with that.

Your wife and your mother have some serious issues. You cannot resolve them on your own. If you want things to improve then speak to your mother and your wife about how you feel. Having a baby has the potential to make the situation 10 times worse. Both the women in your life will be desperately trying to exert their authority even more and you will be stuck in the middle.

My question was always about if she is ready for visitors to see the new baby is it unreasonable for my parents to miss out on seeing the baby as early as they could just because my wife doesn't get on with them?

If she is not ready to see them then she is not ready to see them Simba.

Since contact with your mother caused her to have some sort of breakdown even while not pregnant or recovering from childbirth, I think you should assume she will not be ready for some time after giving birth, if ever.

(And of course 'just because my wife doesn't get on with them' flatly contradicts what you said about the breakdown.)

The health condition I have requires my wife to help ne in daily life at times because of severe muscle weaknesses and as a result tiredness. My parents could have handled by condition better but only in hindsight....They always took the advice of doctors whoacactually saved my life but overtime we have learnt there are better ways of managing my condition. I am independent although dont drive so rely on her for that but do work full time

My parents do not know anything about the concerns about them meeting the baby and have not had any conversion about this with me so absolutely no pressure from them.

Learnt tonight in our class that apparently you burn as many calories as you would in a marathon during labour! ! Things l lile that help a man gain perspective.

Btw anyone who wishes to advise we should split up over a matter like this when its clear we must love each other and have been through so much over our relationship and at the same time preach about doing the best for the child and not just what I want, need tto think about what they are saying.

We just have a difference of opinion which I am debating.

All is well between my dw and me, we are excited about our baby and I will support her every step of the way and with better understanding of what she will be going through thanks to the examples given on here.

Do I wish things were more simple. Yes of course. Do I wish my wife had a more calm and happy outlook on life. Absolutely. Does my wife wish I didn't di the things that annoy her. Big yes. Is life perfect. Rarely.

Do we want to spend the rest of our lifes together as a familt. More than anything else in the world...and that will never change no matter hw much we annoy each other....and thats why we both feel so blessed

And yet that 'debate' made your wife leave her home.

Simba, will you need additional personal assistance around late pregnancy/early newborn days, with your DW potentially unavailable?

And will you be able to care for the baby, single-handed, when your dw goes back to work? What if you have a spell of severe muscle weakness whilst you are solely responsible for the baby?

That line has been crossed a few times already and it has been my choice to tolerate this for my love of her and our relationship. But now we have a baby involved I want to know aibu to be firmer about my wishes

For the umpteenth time -- now that you are about to have a baby it is absolutely not the time to be firmer about your blasted wishes. Since you keep on asking this question, it is clear that you are missing the point, spectacularly, about how your wife is going to feel both during but most importantly after the delivery.

You are not taking in at all the fact that your wife is going to turn into a tiger the instant that baby is placed in her arms and nobody is going to hold the baby without stressing her out. Perhaps not even you. Certainly not the doctors and nurses and midwives. If you think a tactless MIL who has already caused her to break down will add one iota of positivity to your relationship with your wife by handling the baby at the point of hormone and exhaustion and pain-fueled turmoil you and she are about to experience, then by all means invite your parents to visit.

OTOH, if you read what real women have to say about seeing someone else hold the baby, take the baby out of their sight, how well remarks from 'well intentioned' boors have gone down in the post partum period, etc., (i.e. like a lead balloon) then I think you will be sensible.

And that word 'firmer' is absolutely horrible. Every time you open your mouth here you put your foot further and further in. Worse, you are presumably trying to make a decent impression here to a potentially supportive audience? Your apparent deafness to how you are coming across is stunning.

You cannot sort out issues between your wife and your mother by becoming 'firmer'.
You cannot sort out issues between them at all except by making it clear to your wife that she is your number one priority, that none of her feelings about your mother are 'simply' this, or 'just' that, and that you understand completely why she can't get past stupid or mean or thoughtless or tactless or critical things your mother has said. And you need to accept that sometimes people are not 'well intentioned' and you need to admit this to your wife.
You cannot make your wife respect your mother. You cannot make your wife like her.
You can cut the apron strings and grow up enough that it doesn't matter how your wife feels about mummy, which is what 99% of other men manage to do. (Or whatever number of men understand what is meant by marriage, to a wife.)
You have to choose your wife over your mother, in other words. You can't have them both at Number One.

And furthermore --
I can't help noticing that while you describe your mother's tactless remarks as 'well intentioned' your wife's inability to get over the hurt she has caused is not apparently excusable at all -- so I continue to predict an unhappy end to all this.

It is very clear to me who is the more important woman in your life. (And that your marriage is a slow moving train wreck)

If you need support caring for yourself in day in and day out living then how are you going to be able to manage caring for the baby?

I presume you and your wife have some understanding of the needs of a baby but since you seemed very unaware of what goes on in labour or the physical realty of the post partum period, I wonder if either of you appreciate how much sheer physical labour is involved in baby care?

And since you have put your wife through so much already (and have contemplated making the doctors gang up on her to force her to let your parents see her or the baby whether she wanted a visit or not) without ever having heard a peep from your parents about visiting I am now really aghast at the scale of the issues you have wrt your mother.

Could you quote the poster who is advising you to split up now while advising you to put the child first? I haven't read that.

Personally I'm confused by the paradox that you've stayed together so long without her attitudes and behaviours on some issues that upset you changing, yet you think you can change her now, when she'll be most preoccupied and least interested in your preferences because the baby will be her priority.

When she'll also be at her most sensitive, vulnerable and dependent upon you - and you apparently haven't spotted that taking advantage of her vulnerability to impose your 'changed terms' sounds a lot like calculated bullying, or, that it's possible she might not bend to your demands but might snap - either becoming ill, or reacting against you, damaging or possibly ending your marriage.

By pointing out these possibilities we're giving you some, very well thought through, ideas about how to avoid causing upset to your wife and a possible rift in your marriage.

I'm amazed you keep coming back btw. It's unusual for such a contentious thread. Most OPs would have run in horror early on.

It's really noticeable the way you just keep trying to hammer home the same point, while flitting, apparently blindly, between contradictory positions (I'll support her and love her utterly / I am determined to change her and consider her a blackmailer) and blithely ignoring the majority of what's been said too you.

One might almost think you were someone who couldn't bear to be wrong (rather, to accept that you'd got something wrong) and who must have the last word. Not especially sympathetic or supportive traits.

Bloke here. Diagrams below.

Relative importance within relationship:

M.........W

Relative importances in the immediate aftermath of the birth:

B.........W

Relative importances for a good while after the birth:

B.........
W........
M........

Anyone who says it's easy to deal with that change is a better person than I am. It does help to recognise and prepare for it though. There can never be a worse time to try and assert yourself than in those second two timeframes. You must understand why your wife might have reservations about your parents. Mine does. I think it's normal.
I would actively expect 'unreasonable' behaviour and remember that your wife is probably feeling incredibly vulnerable and insecure. An absolute maelstrom of emotional and physical change has passed through. It seems to me that the only reasonable response is to be unpredictable.

I admit I haven't read the whole thread, hopefully I have the jist of it.

Simba, if you put the amount of energy you are devoting to this thread trying to prove that you are 'right' into trying to show your wife that she is first with you, you might be surprised at how she might start to meet you part way. If you were to tell her that you will support her decision regarding your parents, maybe that will give her the confidence to let them see the baby sooner rather than later. Because she will know that if things go south, you will be there to escort your parents out, or to take your wife and child away from them.

It doesn't matter if the things your mother said were truly unintentional or just down right nasty. They upset your wife, period. As her husband, your first responsibility was to go to your mother and say 'I love you, Mom, but please don't say XXX to Mrs Simba. Maybe you didn't mean it, but it hurt her'.

This whole debacle really has nothing to do with you, your 'pride', or 'disrespect'. (God I hate that term. Respect is earned! Have you earned hers in this situation?) This has to do with knowing where your priorities lie. And I just don't think you do know that.

I would suggest putting W first, above B and certainly above M.

The best thing a H can do imo in the post partum period is be the best H he has it in him to be and then some. Husbands who can manage this have never regretted it ime.

This means backing her up against his parents or even her parents (though this can be tricky), taking the reins and not bothering her about what needs to be done around the house -- just doing it and being cheerful about it and not expecting some sort of pat on the back for it. The W is recovering from a huge physical /medical stress and is not getting any sleep while recovering. She needs complete support.

Plus no telling her she is doing breastfeeding wrong/should drop breastfeeding and bottlefeed instead, or telling her she is doing bottle feeding wrong and should be breastfeeding.

simba, as I said on this page above many of us see neither parent for a week or two after birth. It is just up to the couple and in my view should be up to the mother. Not all relatives can rush down. Some of us have parents who are working for example or realise we want to be alone as a 3 person family. Different people have different views. Go with what your wife says. No visitors for a week or two is perfectly normal for many couples. My mother came down about 2 or 3 weeks after the last was born and the other grandparents about the same time on a different day and only for a day, not to stay here as that would be a burden.

Simba, after an awful lot of replies one thing remains - you started this thread to ask if you were being unreasonable. The response has been a resounding, staggering, overwhelming 'yes, you are being very unreasonable'. In fact I don't think I've ever seen as much consensus on an AIBU. You keep trying to defend your position despite this when it seems obvious the only decent thing for you to do here and, more importantly, in real life, would be to humbly accept that your entire philosophy on this matter needs a serious rethink.

For the love of whatever voices in your head you hold dear (Mummy's, by the sound of it), do the right thing.

Interesting comment from mathanxiety....how many of you agree that a partner should put wife above baby and mother (not questioning wife above mother btw!)

My last few posts have asked less if nothing about my own personal situation which I keep stating has been resolved based on me taking advice from you all where I admitted I was wrong to assume the post birth period would be alot easier on my wife than I understood. My questions have been more focused on general, and what I percieve rightly or wrongly to be feminist views whereby mother has earnt the right to call the shots because of going through labour, or whether a dads wishes after birth should equally be considered.

Interestingly at the antenatal class last night, for 5 minutes or so we talked amongst the 9 couples about how important and life changing the birth is for the father, and how its important to not forget about the impact it has on him. This topic was startesd by a woman abd I deliberately kept relatively quiet to see how the conversation went. Almost all of the wonen contributed to the conversation by at least agreeing with this, no one challenged it and some joked about the partners now making it all about them (my wife didn't make a comment then but did give me a stare then a smile).

So...if other women can recognise on here and face to face that its an important time for the partner and therefore considering things that might be important to them (respecting their wish to cut or not cut the cord, be in the delivery suite etc), then clearly i am not being unreasonable, im just in a minority.

I am being unreasonable though by taking actions that will increase my wifes adrenaline which could infact unnecessarily slow down or even stop the pregnancy by letting my parents know when she is going into labour etc so I certainly understand why I shouldn't do anything like that now. Facts like this would have been a useful comment at the start.

Being firmer now is I know not the best timing, but we have never had a baby before. As I have tried to explain it has always been just about us as adults who can make their own decisions and are responsible solely forthe coconsequences of this. On the occasions my wife has acted unreasonably she has always said sorry sometime after...which she doesn't have to but it self recognition that what she did was unreasonable. So by me being firmer (agree horrible word but one I cant find a better word for right now) I hope that stress caused by her actions for both of us can be nipped in the bud, as that stress will undoubtedly be felt by the baby which ia cruel, unnecessary and what I want to.avoid at all.cost. if I simply agree to everything she says, the feeling of resentment will surely just fester without a channel to express it (my poor friends have had to deal with it ao far!) and that can only be a bad thing for the longevity of our relationship.

This thread is full of women who have been through labour. I think almost all comments have been from that perspective.

Separately, some identify as feminists, some don't.

Hope that helps.

It's not about 'being firmer' or 'simply agreeing to everything' - it's going to have to be about fixing whatever problems there are in the relationship, and building a way for you both to communicate your needs and feelings, and for you both, then, to find a way forward, in each instance, that you are both happy with.

I don't think it is useful to think of this in a fixed way, to try to set parameters and rules that will apply in every situation - because every situation will be different and every family is different.

It's also not good to think of the decisions in terms of win or lose - ie. I gave in on X subject and Y subject, so she should give in on Z subject and another subject later on - to keep the scorecard even. I'm not saying that you are doing this, simba - but it is an easy trap to fall into.

The only win or lose is for the family - if whatever decisions are made are good for the family, and overall, the decisions made make everyone happy - bearing in mind that some decisions may make you happier and some might make your wife happier - it's fluid, there's ebb and flow, but, looking at the bigger picture, you both feel happy overall.

I am not sure I am expressing this as well as I could - ds3 got me up early this morning, because it was too wet and windy for him to do his paper round safely, so I had to drive him - and I haven't had any coffee yet, so my brain may not be functioning as well as it can, when fully caffeinated!

Yy SDTG.

Also, Simba, it's a little disingenuous to say:

"So...if other women can recognise on here and face to face that its an important time for the partner and therefore considering things that might be important to them (respecting their wish to cut or not cut the cord, be in the delivery suite etc), then clearly i am not being unreasonable, im just in a minority."

Not a woman on here has said there is no impact on you. The impact on you in the days after birth is much less though because you and your DW are both coping with being parents but only one of you has given birth.

So your parents don't even know and you are anticipating this and causing a drive-off row in advance based on you second guessing your mum's likely reaction?

Everything I've said about the unhealthy saviour/saved cycle. EVERYTHING.

I would hope your mum would be far more reasonable than you anticipate her to be (although you're blinkered to the fact you're describing overbearing/unreasonable behaviour, you are). If she isn't and you just know what she'll say ... there is an issue with her emotionally controlling you and it needs to stop.