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Childbirth

Share experiences and get support around labour, birth and recovery.

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Original poster

Man sleeping on ward

674 replies

heylottie · 05/03/2014 07:53

I am on a 4 bed maternity ward, a small ward with beds divided by curtains. 5 day old dd currently in SCBU getting help with low blood sugar.

Its been awful but I can't fault the care and kindness of the nursing staff who are great

But

Last night a woman was admitted at 11pm, I didn't see her as curtains drawn. I was aware that someone was sat in the chair next to my curtain, ie two foot from my bed. I got up at 2am and went to the loo.

Turns out her husband was asleep on the chair.

I don't know if I am coming or going at moment, but I don't think this is appropriate is it? Woman was asleep. I mentioned to staff and they said oh he's waiting for his baby to settle in the incubator. Whilst I appreciate that, could he not have waited in the family tv room down the corridor?

Or am I being over sensitive? I just think this is a vulnerable enough time without this.

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RedToothBrush · 05/03/2014 17:39

Why is it missing the point, if you make sure there is provision to ensure the needs of everyone....

... not sure where I've suggested anywhere differently.

brighteyedbusytailed · 05/03/2014 17:41

I cannot imagine many men queuing up to sexually assault post birth women who are attached to catheters sometimes, have extra gas , bleeding like shot animals and walking around in muddied shabby old nighties/pyjama's with their untamed boobs flopping about,
I think the privacy, safety of babies etc is a bigger concern.

TheXxed · 05/03/2014 17:45

RedToothBrush But its not the same as any other kind of hospital stay either is it?

Why? There are countless situations when those having to stay overnight in hospital need emotional and physical support. Why is childbirth different?

RedToothBrush · 05/03/2014 17:45

And you are missing the point that not all men are bastards and why should innocent men be penalised on the basis on their gender either, especially if its for the benefit of women and potentially for children and families in general?

I think you have to try and do the best for everyone and be aware and cautious of vulnerable women OF ALL KINDS. Its not JUST restricted to women who have problems with domestic violence.

handcream · 05/03/2014 17:45

Hunger is right. Why should ONE women who 'wants' her partner there spoil it for the rest. If you really really cannot do without them then get a private room. But no - you want to do what you like and forget about the rest of the ward.

Sorry, but I didnt want to have a baby (very rare occasion - only did it twice!) with other random men wandering around especially at night. Day time of course is different although I didnt like the family who when my DS was in hospital a few years ago bringing in curry and a huge entourage of their family to visit.

My son really wasnt well and it was a very anti social thing to do in a small ward.

expatinscotland · 05/03/2014 17:46

It's not about seeing all men as rapists and pervs but the fact that some new mums, who are patients (dads, or partners, because not every mother's partner is the father of her child, are not patients), feel very vulnerable and anxious after giving birth and do not want to share, with their babies, sleeping space with potentially 5 strange men. Some do not have a partner who can be with them overnight, either. And some partners are not nice and respectful of other patients and their babies.

In an idea world, there would be nothing but private rooms.

But again, the funding fairy hasn't even granted enough staff for the mothers themselves, much less policing things at night.

RedToothBrush · 05/03/2014 17:47

TheXxed Wed 05-Mar-14 17:45:29
RedToothBrush But its not the same as any other kind of hospital stay either is it?

NatashaBee Wed 05-Mar-14 16:57:08
As others have said, you're not allowed someone staying with you overnight during any other kind of normal hospital stay, are you?

I'm tending to veer towards the 'no men on shared wards' argument, but to your point, there's not many other surgical situations where you'd have to go through birth (in some cases, major abdominal surgery if you have a CS) and then have to take care of a baby straight away afterwards. I can see why normal rules may not apply to the postnatal ward.

expatinscotland · 05/03/2014 17:47

The men are not the patients, the women AND babies are.

TitsalinaBumSquash · 05/03/2014 17:48

No one is missing the point!

What most people are saying is that hospitals should provide a safe space for both camps.

I value my family, I value my DP and the bond he has with our son, he wouldn't in a million years do anything to make anyone else uncomfortable, all he ever wanted was to support me and meet his baby son.

He didn't snore loudly (even though the other women did!) he wasn't loud, he wasn't coming and going, he wasn't looking through curtains or stealing or starting trouble. He had a tiny chair that was no bigger than the ones you normal find next to a hospital bed. This is how I expect most men act when their wife or partner has just given birth.
Just because some people (not just men) are twats, it doesn't not mean most are.

All this bull shit about people thinking only of "the menz" (god I hate that) is ridiculous.
Most reasonable people can see why some women would value having the support of the person that she loves most in huge world next to her while she goes though something scary and fucking hard.

I'm sorry some women feel uncomfortable around men, I really am but it doesn't trump to right of the women who do not!

The simple solution is as others have said is to have it clearly stated before the birth that the hospital has whichever policy it has and in the long run, ideally have separate places for families with the men staying and ones without.

handcream · 05/03/2014 17:48

I also agree that its not about seeing all men as pervs. its about the dignity of women who have just given birth and allowing them some privacy.

honeybunny14 · 05/03/2014 17:48

It wouldnt bother me i really wish my dp could have stayed with me i remember begging the staff to let him stay.

TitsalinaBumSquash · 05/03/2014 17:49

I paid for a private room .... It wasn't available. I'm also not medically eligible for a home birth. Sorry for being awkward.

ThatBloodyWoman · 05/03/2014 17:52

brighteyed

Ah, your post brings back vivid memories......

handcream · 05/03/2014 17:53

I suspect that you ordered an amenity room (much cheaper!) They wont guarantee those. A private room at circa 300 per night is the one they will guarantee. I didnt have an issues when I ordered one. I could have gone for an amenity room at 70 but it was made clear that it was only if one was available.

TitsalinaBumSquash · 05/03/2014 17:56

Nope, I'm pretty sure I know what I ordered. I was in the hospital for 4 weeks, I was quite in the know with what was what. It is a very busy maternity unit and another lady needed it more after a very tragic loss of one of her twins. So i was moved out and her and her family came in, I of course don't begrudge that, it's more pointing out that there isn't always private rooms available.

RedToothBrush · 05/03/2014 17:57

expatinscotland Wed 05-Mar-14 17:46:31
But again, the funding fairy hasn't even granted enough staff for the mothers themselves, much less policing things at night.

The 'funding fairy' is often as shortsighted as a mole though too. There are logical and economic reasons to justify many things on maternity wards, but the 'funding fairy' is used as excuse to dismiss them. The 'funding fairy' mentality is often wrong and needs to be challenged as it has cost saving benefits to the NHS elsewhere.

I do think its an argument that is thrown around by people who want to see healthcare as a thing that happens by department rather than as something that is cross departmental and has long term effects rather than just short term ones.

This is fundamentally what is wrong with the way the NHS is budgeted and financed and why it currently has so many problems.

Hungermonkey · 05/03/2014 17:57

It is not about seeing men as rapists FGS.

I don't ANY men sleeping in a room with me post birth. And I am the patient and my needs and rights trump that off non patients. End of.

TitsalinaBumSquash · 05/03/2014 17:59

"End of ...."

Hahaha, if that was the way to end a discussion, Mumsnet wouldn't exist!

My rights as a patient was to have my supporting person with me when I needed him.

Stevie77 · 05/03/2014 18:04

But it's not 'a man' staying IMHO, it's any additional people whether they are the woman's mother, MIL, sister or friend.

It is incredibly disruptive, even more so at nighttime when you are already in a noisy environment that is not your own. It is really hard to switch off and go to sleep as it is, without the additional noise caused by another person.

And yes, I'm speaking from experience here. Some people are respectful and quiet, but others aren't. Unfortunately, I couldn't wait to escape home even though I was after an EMCS where both my and DD's life were in danger and following which I was very unwell. All because two very noisy women (and their families) were put in my bay. With DC2 I'm really hoping to be able to get, and pay for, a private room.

So to me, it's nothing to do with men, although I agree that a male presence can sometimes cause unease, it is to do with ANY additional people.

handcream · 05/03/2014 18:06

Tits - so you were going to pay 8K for your stay (you say you were there for 4 weeks)?

You could have gone to the Portland and had the whole birth for that!

handcream · 05/03/2014 18:08

Totally disagree Tits. Your rights are to have care for you and your baby. Not to have whomever you like there. Where it will stop, partner, sister and Mum. What about siblings? What about having a video of everything (all because its your right as a patient)

expatinscotland · 05/03/2014 18:08

Exactly, Stevie, and there are two patients in every day, a woman, who may have had a traumatic delivery and/or open wounds and who is bleeding, and a newborn baby.

Hungermonkey · 05/03/2014 18:08

No, they aren't in the vast majority of wards though tits and for very good reason. You may WANT your husband there but I don't. And , in the vast majority of hospitals, I trump you. Thankfully.

RedToothBrush · 05/03/2014 18:10

I don't ANY men sleeping in a room with me post birth. And I am the patient and my needs and rights trump that off non patients. End of.

My husband will be staying with me because of MY health concerns and this has been recognised and approved a midwife. It will be in a private room, but I am very conscious that this sadly is not always possible due to the lack of facilities.

In this situation, does the NEED which has been well documented and discussed trump the RIGHT of other women?

I honestly don't know the answer to that, which is why I stress its very much a balancing act and that unfortunately there are cases where this isn't being achieved adequately for both groups.

I have also said that there should be separate spaces for both groups and that we need to do more to recognise the range of needs rather than valuing one more than another.

I don't understand why this is controversial. Nor do I understand why the argument of funding is always used as a way to stop aiming to get the best care of all women when it is so obviously clear that maternity is so badly managed and understood in terms of costs being just ending up in different budgets and closing debate of the subject.

Now that really is paternalistic thinking!

handcream · 05/03/2014 18:13

There are a lot of very selfish women on this thread. They WANT their partners there, they dont care about anyone else.

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