Ban Home Births!

[NHSsupporter]

This should be a topic that will get the "rights for women" brigade fired up!

I have listened for several years to a close friend of mine who is an NHS Community Midwife, and have decided that we should bite the bullet and BAN "NHS sponsored home births".

I make this suggestion based on, what I believe to be, several compelling arguments:

1. Child safety

2. NHS Budget

3. Parent welfare

4. In my friends experience between 33%-50% of all home births at 2 hospitals she has worked at in 2 very different areas, seem to end up in difficulties ultimately requiring the attendance of paramedics, an ambulance, and subsequent blue-light evacuation to hospital. Surely it would be better for the unborn child's safety and welfare for it to start being born in a controlled environment, where all of the necessary professionals are already at hand should the need arise, rather than having to be born in an emergency and potentially rushed situation. Surely the welfare of the unborn child should be placed ahead of a so-called "pleasant birthing experience" for the new mother.

5. The use of emergency ambulance resources in 33%-50% of cases and Community Midwives must have an additional financial implication, which is significantly greater than parents, in a controlled way, simply entering the hospital and giving birth in a building, which already exists and is already being paid for, with staff present whose salaries are also part of the fixed costs of running the hospital. In this time of austerity surely this would be a sensible cost-saving exercise.

6. Parent physical and mental welfare would be significantly improved if emergency procedures could be avoided. I would go as far as to say, that I bet that one or more of the annual maternal deaths could be avoided.

I repeat, surely the welfare of the unborn child should be placed ahead of a so-called "pleasant birthing experience" for the new mother.

Comments welcomed?!

I had two home births, only at my midwife's house, not mine. I did this because the risks to the mother and baby are lower. Hospitals are great for pathological pregnancies, not so great for normal healthy ones i.e the majority of all pregnancies.

Why would you want women to face unecessary risk [cascade of intervention] by insisting they birth at a hospital, when they'd prefer to be at home?

It's just nonsense you're spouting.

Now fuck off.

I am bloody fed up with this ridiculous image of women who homebirth as mad hippies.

I am a working class woman. Probably closer to the 'chav' desecription than the 'Taliban' one. There are no pastel birthing balls in my house. Mine was grey and cost £1.49 from sainsburys. Have you tried one BTW, the actually work rather well. I wish I had tried one with DC1 instead of waiting till DC5, but thats prejudice for you - I thought they were for hippies.

I had homebirths for selfish reasons. The same selfish reasons women choose hosptial births. I wanted to feel safe and have a good labour.

I hate hospital environments. They make me very stressed, hardly the best state to give birth. My OH is disabled, labour units are not known for their care and compassion towards the 'spare part' that is the man involved.

I admit I stuck the fairy lights on after DC5 was born but before that I had a 60watt bulb without a shade on to give the MWs a good view.

The women in my family have always given birth at home. Well not my mother's generation because in the 60s the working classes were guilted and frightened into laying in a hospital bed for 10 days after giving birth with their legs in stirrups.

But before that you would be hard pushed (scuse pun) to find a hospital birth amoung my nan and her sisters.

As for 'us' being terrorists or extremists, IME its the anti home birth brigade that use the most emotive language - selfish, careless etc. I see it all the time. Project YOUR fears on to someone else. I have had two great homebirths and if I were to have another child I would do it again.

yes, my reasons for homebirth are based in me being a cold and calculating statistics-munching type.

my statistical analysis showed it to be the best thing for me

i've just had my 3rd home birth. they have all been shorter than average, amazing, totally natural - no drugs at all apart from vitamin k for baby. all the midwives did were fill in paper work, clamp the cord and hand dh the scissors, then clean up a bit. i was in control of everything, i did everything myself, i delivered all 3 of my babies myself.

there is no reason whatsoever that i needed to be anywhere near a hospital at any point for my pregnancies and births apart from routine scans. pregnancy and bith is not something that needs or requires medical intervention or hospital treatment in the majority of cases. i cannot afford to pay £400 for an independent midwife so if my fantastic midwives did not support all 3 of my births i would have done it at home alone.

the welfare of all my children has been my priority and my mental welfare has been significantly improved by not having to go into hospital to give birth in an environment i feel uncomfortable in.

The US, which spends more money on maternity wards than any other country in the world, and where almost every woman gives birth in hospital, in a highly medicalised system, they have the second worst newborn mortality rate in the developed world

They also have a shocking maternal death rate, and one of the reasons for this is that:
"Many women are not given a say in decisions about their care and the risks of interventions such as inducing labor or cesarean sections. Cesarean sections make up nearly one-third of all deliveries in the US A ? twice as high as recommended by the World Health Organization. " Amnesty International

The US ranks 41st in maternal mortality

Then, a US study tried to say that home birth was dangerous, which was a blatant attempt to draw attention away from its inadequate birthing system and rampant c-section epidemic stemming from knife-happy doctors.

The Royal College of Midwives dismissed the US research as a load of tosh:

"Mervi Jokinen of the Royal College of Midwives, said the study was interesing, but questioned the validity of its findings for the UK.

"Comparison of the results is difficult because the study's authors are working with data collected differently in many countries.

"Here we have services delivered by midwives who are skilled and experienced at home births and resuscitating newborns.

"This is perhaps in contrast to many of the other countries this research covers." BBC

So before we attack home birth, hadn't we better focus on improving the gross inadequacies of the hospital system???

Am not wanting my 3rd HB because I want to chant and light candles whilst listening to whales. Nor have I ever wanted a waterbirth. Not that there's anything wrong with any of these things if it floats your boat. But still.

Whatever stage of pregnancy or birth, I would always trust my MW and if she said maybe not this time, I would go to hospital. Assuming I got there on time.
I am open to what ever happens which is more than can be said if I just went to hospital 'because'.

Oh it's so obviously about controlling women and nothing to do with the health of the mother and baby. IF they were concerned about maternal and infant health they would help mothers to birth at home.

Samaracand - question for ya.

If it's 'common sense' that hospital births are clearly safer for ALL mothers, how do you account for the fact that both the Royal College of Midwives and The Royal College of Obstericians and Gynaecologists support homebirth and describe it as both 'safe' and conferring 'considerable benefits' for healthy mums?

Are you privy to some information they're not aware of?

Common sense is the least common of the senses, as they say.

Well I had a hugely traumatic and intervention-filled hospital birth about a year ago, none of which would have happened if it hadn't been for the hospital staff trying to make everything go at light-speed. My NHS-appointed midwife was absolutely horrified when I described what happened and recommended that if I have another child (not bloody likely after what the bastards did to me) I should have a homebirth as it would mean far less stress for me and the baby. And, by implication, less intervention and a more positive outcome. This has since been backed up by my GP and other healthcare professionals who have been following up my case.

My local NHS trust practically pushes homebirths on pregnant women, btw. I insisted on giving birth in hospital as I was of the opinion that hospital births were far safer in the main. To my everlasting regret I've discovered that all women are medically expected to labour the same, and in my case the the cascade of intervention led to horrific consequences.

Funnily enough, out of my ante-natal class (all classed as low-risk) only two people had straightforward births they feel positive about. They were the only ones to have home births.

samarcanda

I am not an ayatollah of natural childbirth - I am very pro-intervention and make other comments on childbirth boards in defence of epidurals, episiotomies and those EVUL obstetricians.

I think everyone has the right to make their own decision based on their medical history, risk in conjunction with their healthcare team. Home births make sense for many mothers (not me unfortunately) especially in this small country with socialised medicine where you are never too far from a hospital (ok highlands and islands excepted). And HBs ARE medicalised, they are attended by medical professionals who can perform epis, provide pethidine, gas & air etc. So HB = not necessarily 'natural' whatever THAT means.

I like the comparison of women who advocate choice in childbirth with the Taliban and Ayatollahs by the way. Nice one.

BTW - I have a terror of fire so candles & fairylights are out, no cut flowers in my house because of cost and environmental reasons and as a Ben Goldacre groupie, well, you can guess my views on homeopathy.

Also aren't the awful maternal & infant mortality rates in the US related to many poor women being uninsured...

Arf at 'ayatollah of natural childbirth'

blondpinhead - which trust is this? Just so that those who are being denied homebirths can go hotfooting it there.

Islington. Loads of ayatollahs round here

It was just my experience though - all the community midwives I saw were so pro-homebirth it was almost like they were on commission.

Really? blondpinhead - I gave birth in Islington (Whittington). No-one suggested homebirth to me and the HB rate is the same as the national average (2%). They do have a V. Good Homebirth team btw Margles - I know several women who give excellent feedback and this is also reflected in the overall feedback and reviews the Trust conducts.

You might be talking about the private sector (The Active Birth Centre for example) who are hb advocates but I didn't come across any radical pro-homebirth advocates on the Community Midwives though they clearly are proud of the homebirth team.

Sorry you had a horrid birth experience btw blond

BTW there's usually about an hour's notice of a birth going wrong, it's not like on the telly, you know. That gives ample time for a carefully managed transfer for most of England's population at any rate (can't speak for the rest of the UK but I think in Wales and Scotland the population is probably a bit more dispersed - I may be wrong, however).

If your friend has a very high transfer rate she may be seeing problems where there aren't any, or perhaps her judgemental attitude towards HBs is ensuring a self-fulfilling prophecy, by frightening her patients into going along with a transfer that she has determined necessary without sufficiently good grounds. As they used to say in computers, nobody ever got fired for buying IBM, and in this case nobody ever got fired for making patients go into hospital unnecessarily, as it's the default position.

i think our area its about 11%

the community MWs very keen on it.

Worthing - brilliant service for HBs.

I had a very fast labour and a hospital birth was not an option. I am just glad that the nhs midwife got there in time.

I wonder whether the OP thinks that my planned homebirth should have been banned.

I had a homebirth with the Whittington. They are right to be proud of their team. They give excellent care and provide you with an opportunity to meet all the midwives on the team so if your midwife isn't on call as mine wasn't, no one is a stranger.

I had a straightforward labour that lasted under 12 hours plus no tearing. My midwife just let me get on with it though she was there if I needed her. I honestly believe that my straightforward birth was because I felt safe and relaxed in my own environment. And I felt many things during labour but I never felt frightened as I would have felt in hospital.

Point being, the idea of banning homebirths is ridiculous! Every woman is different and every woman should be allowed to have her baby wherever she feels most comfortable whether that's in a hospital, a birthing centre, at home, etc.

OK, first time I've ever done this, but OP, you are clearly either a pub philosopher or a troll. Probably both. Slightly heavy lunchtime session down the Dog and Bollox?

i reckon my home birth was a lot cheaper than my hospital birth (which involved lots of medical staff and 3 days stay in hospital)

BoffinMum has said everything I would have said but couldn't be bothered to type this morning when I had better things to do than engage with someone who is either (in order of descending likelihood from highly probable to extremely improbable):

• an attention-seeking stirrer,
• ignorant, in possession of an equally ignorant midwife friend, and not ashamed to spout their ignorant, evidence-poor opinions on the internet,
• privy to special, secret information not known to RCOG and RCM as well as the various MNers who have posted here.

I am indeed DrBoff. That is nuffink around here though, I know a few Doctor Doctors. But I reckon that's just SHOWING OFF!