What do mumsnetters think of freebirthing?

[withorwithoutyou]

Just wondered what people on here think of freebirthing as I've never seen it discussed on here before.

My gut feeling is that it's dangerous and an unnecessary risk but I've never really heard the positives - does anyone know much about it, or have experience of it?

Ragged, how does fistula, a medical injury which is born mostly out of poverty and severe deprivation on multiple levels in Lesser developed countries translate to a big danger in the UK if a woman was to choose to give birth without a midwife or OB in attendance?

introducing fear into this topic will help no one.

All childbirth carries risks, but home birth with a qualified attendant is very safe for low risk women.

Unassisted childbirth (freebirthing) is very risky. One of the strongest proponents of UC in the States lost her baby doing this.

There are a lot of philosophies behind it - some are grounded in religious beliefs or spiritual beliefs (or personal beliefs about parental bonding). Some people are suffering from extreme birth trauma or phobia arising from medical professionals. Some people do it because home birth is illegal in their area and they have no other choice but hospital (and some American hospitals have some awful procedures. Many ban VBACs so women are forced into caesareans).

There are also women who unintentionally freebirth because of precipitous labour.

I have a midwife friend who is very, very outspoken about UC. She had one herself and it went horribly wrong. Thankfully, she and her baby survived but she spends a lot of time speaking out against it.

If you are in a position where you have the option of a UC or an assisted home birth, I think /planning/ to give birth unassisted is a very poor choice. It's just too risky.

It's more complicated if you don't have access to an assisted home birth. I can understand someone choosing freebirth over a caesarean, but it's still a risky choice and not one I would make personally.

I can't understand why anyone would want to do it TBH. Homebirth, fine, lovely idea but freebirthing - nope, no way I would consider it. We are able to have scans etc for a reason. I watched a program on freebirthing where the women weren't having any scans, antenatal appointments or anything, although one woman was worried that her placenta was low lying but she had no way of knowing.

I watched a Caesarian birth on TV once where the baby had managed to put a knot in the umbilical cord. Had the woman gone into labour the knot would have tightened starving the baby of oxygen. The doctor turned to the camera and said, "look at that! See that's why it's important that women have medical help during pregnancy."
They didn't know about the knot in the cord until the baby was delivered. Imagine if the woman had been freebirthig!

Loopy, this is where one's definition of free birth comes into consideration.

Would it still be a free birth if the midwife was asked to stay in another room in the home until or if she was requested?

What about circumstances where parents may choose to call for a midwife so late that she would almost certainly arrive too late or late enough to do anything but wait?

What about those who may choose to have only a doula there? or other birthing partners?

these are all rhetorical questions btw, not asking them to you Loopy, just trying to get people to talk sensibly rather than to throw emotive language around.

I guess the strictest definition is someone who chooses for no one else to be in the house (sometimes out of fear of prosecution in countries or US states where this can happen).

My baby was delivered with a true knot in the cord with no problems at all. A knot in the cord doesn't always necessitate cs or other interventions.

No not necessarily, of course. The woman wasn't having a CS because of the knot in the cord. I forget why she was having one but the surgeon (or whoever) was basically saying that it could have caused problems particularly I the woman had been unassisted.

I had an EMCS but I can totally understand why women freebirth. I read a great deal on it when I was pregnant. I can totally understand wanting to go through the experience of childbirth completely alone, with no-one telling you what to do, looking at you, etc. I certainly did not anyone around me when I was labouring.

I also fully understand the risks associated, however as foxytoxin has said the risks are often no different than women that 'freebirth' by 'accident'.

It is an interesting and complex issue.

Um - illegal in England? (and poss rest of UK?)

Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.

I think its nuts and selfish.

Not illegal Nonnomum.

"It is perfectly legal to give birth alone, unassisted - ie with no midwife in attendance - whether this was accidental, or deliberate."

but

"It is illegal for anyone other than a UK registered midwife or doctor to 'attend' a woman in labour except in an emergency."

from Home Birth in the UK

Nonnomum, I thought it was illegal too. I suppose it would be difficult to stop women doing it though. They can always lie about how quick their labour was etc.

Ah, x-posted. Not illegal then.

I had an accidental homebirth with my DS.

We live only a few mins from the hospital and my hubby had phoned them and a MW rushed out. She ran through the door on the last push and thank God she did. My DS was not breathing she grabbed him and rubbed him down with a towel to get his lungs going, he is now a healthy 9 month old but god knows what would have happened if she had not been there.

I would also say that it was quite a scary prospect for hubby who had to cope alone (I think I had zoned out, so for me I could have been anywhere), he did suffer with depression after the birth and I am sure it was down to the trauma.

what constitutes 'attending' a birth is also a legal grey area. the CPS lost one case I have heard of in the UK where they attempted to prosecute the father for acting as a midwife during her birthing. I don't know the full details of it but when I read it, I could see where it could be difficult to prove.

oh, in the NHS an 'accidental free birth' is called a birth before arrival so it is not given the name 'freebirth'.

oops, during his wife's birthing, not the midwife's

'One word: Fistula.'

I got one of these when DD2 arrived about 20 minutes after I got to hospital.

Was attended by a senior midwife and a student midwife about to qualify.

There's actually often no way of knowing this type of injury has occured even during a normal, straightforward, attended vaginal delivery until after the injury's been sustained.

Doulas are absolutely not qualified (as doulas) to do any medical work.

ToLabor/ALACE doulas are trained to check foetal tones and do cervical checks. but they are not medically qualified and put themselves at risk in the US or the UK if they do anything 'medical'.

Very few doulas will go near a freebirth because it's a huge legal risk.

Even having a midwife sat in the next room improves your odds considerably.

Having had 2 homebirths with lovely supportive NHS midwives, there is no way I would choose to freebirth. But can understand that there are women in US for example who feel forced into a medicalised hospital birth and don't have the option of homebirth and so want to freebirth.

Women have been giving birth with experienced birth attendants (usually female) for eons.

It's not one word, it's two words.

1. Resuscitation. The biggest risk to your baby is that he/she cannot breathe and dies.

1. Haemorrhage. The biggest risk to you is that you bleed to death before help gets to you.

Use the medical resources available to you because it's plain stoopid not to.

I had one by accident in the car and it was a pretty amazing experience. Not sure I'd have one deliberately though.

Although I do think our centralising of childbirth, closing small local MLUs for example, will lead (and is already leading) to many more accidental ones .

I had one by accident too, having not expected my 2nd labour to only last 3.5 hours. It was a lovely experience, and thankfully a straightforward birth, and the lack of internal examinations was a relief. However, despite the fact that it was a damn sight more pleasant for me than my overmedicalised experience with DS, there is no way on this earth that I would deliberately plan one if I ever had another baby. Because it was probably a damn sight less safe for my DD.