No wish to breastfeed - partner putting me under pressure to give breastmilk

[AuntyFlo]

Hi everyone. I'm a first time Mum and am 38 weeks pregnant. Apart from the hormones and normal first time Mum jitters I've hit a stumbling block with my partner who wants me to express.
I have no wish or desire to and will be happy to give formula milk.
He made me feel like a terrible person when he knew I didn't want to express and was questioning my decision.
I got very emotional, felt like he was trying to over shadow me and ended up having to justify my reasons amongst the tears.
I reminded him that it's my body that's going through pregnancy and the after bits and that the pressure I felt to 'be the best' and 'give the best' whether it be washing powder, travel system etc was getting too much as it was.
I said that I needed to feel supported in my decision not made to feel like an awful person because of my choices of how to feed.
I've noticed in books it's shoved down your necks that breastfeeeding can be successful if you have a supportive partner, family etc but surely that goes for any method of feeding????????? My family and friend by the way have been great
Please give me your feedback - any would be really helpful when feeling like this

Tiktok as a mother who struggled with breast feeding, I know the negatives of my stress far outweighed the positives.

I have several friends who struggled too and I think many people/professionals don't actually know the extent of the stress some of us suffer with it. I also think many professionals forget how you feel when you have the hormones surging through you making everything 10X worse. Said professionals look back at their own experiences with rose tinted glasses forgetting what the hormones make you feel saying " oh we all struggle,it's tricky to begin with but crack on dear". Sorry but many,many of us with different life experiences,situations,bodies struggle in a way that does effect baby and mum and many other mums don't experience, to ignore that because it isn't pc is so very wrong.

It is very dangerous for professionals or other mothers( who deem themselves qualified to comment)to think they can comment or pass judgement on another mothers physical or mental capabilities. The only person qualified to do that is the mother in question herself.

I had twins and then a singleton and dreaded every single feed. I eventually ended up sobbing with every feed,sometimes screaming at dp and said twins,throwing cushions in frustration. I eventually once ended up locking myself in the bathroom and refused to come out. My relationship with dp and dc began to suffer and I had serious worries about bonding as I dreaded them waking up ,had a sinking feeling every single time. These were babies I'd battled 7 long years for. I absolutely know they were picking up and being effected by my anxiety.

Having chatted about it with friends I've since discovered I was far from alone and my experience was actually worryingly quite mild.

So many people comment on the damage leaving young babies to cry for 3 mins can do(raised cortisol levels etc,etc). Well seeing,feeling,hearing,smelling their mother in deep distress time and time again at every single feed can not do any baby any good. There are far too many double standards banded about by so called baby experts. Perhaps if professionals excepted this and worked towards reducing/acknowledging the stress many of us feel instead of just saying "get on with it dear" success at breast feeding would rise.

The minute I switched to formula after 6 weeks each time it was as if a huge cloud lifted. I loved every minute of feeding them,couldn't wait for them to wake up. They became far more chilled,happier babies and I actually started becoming the mother I'd dreamt about being. I really felt the bonding process began properly then. I know what was best for my dc and battling on with breast feeding was not it. I know I was far from alone.

Hurrah for tiktok on this thread, who reminds me spookily of bf class teacher last time round and basically persuaded me to give it a try ( and thank god she did even though I only lasted 2 weeks).

Its women like you tiktok who can change opinions of women who are unsure or have other issues. What a refreshing change to know you are reading a post from someone who is very much pro-bf (if thats the right word - probably not) but can take other views on board and still offer support and understanding, this is what mumsnet is all about.

Some of you on here should be ashamed of yourself for calling the OP selfish and supporting her dh's initial bullying of the issue. You cant see past the end of your noses at anyone who might fit ouside your idea of 'normal' or 'perfect' youre the kind of women that sneer at ffeeders even when you have no idea why they might have made that choice.

Once again from someone who absolutely didnt want to with no.1, to trying it with no.2 and being absolutely determined to bf no.3, if it wasnt for the supportive nature of people like tiktok then you'd never change anything.

I'm another one whose first breastfeeding turned out unexpectedly nightmarish. It was only 11 years later that I finally found out that the reason for dd's failure to thrive was nothing to do with either me or the midwives, but simply medical. At the time, she was losing weight and sinking into lethargy, I was tied to the breastfeeding chair most hours of the day and slowly being tipped into PND. Knowing what I now know of dd's medical condition, I would have switched to formula the moment she started going downhill- and I would not have felt one bit guilty about it, any more than I now feel guilty about letting her use a wheelchair instead of taking her out running (which is known to be a much healthier thing for most young people).

Having said this, one thing that definitely kept me from tipping over the edge was the brilliant and non-judgmental support from the hospital breastfeeding counsellor. There are good people out there, even if fewer and further between than one would wish.

All right, so her support probably meant that I persevered in what with hindsight I would say was the wrong decision. Well, that can't be helped. It isn't the last wrong decision I have made regarding dd (not to mention some made by medical professionals). Some situations just are unusual and I have to live with the fact that sometimes we will get it wrong. We have muddled through and that's the main thing. The best you can ever do is to make what seems the best decision at the time.

What I meant to say was, only you, the OP, can know what your situation is really like and how serious your own difficulties would be. But regardless of what decision you do come to, there is a lot of good support out there and you will not regret making using it.

MilaMae, you say "Tiktok as a mother who struggled with breast feeding, I know the negatives of my stress far outweighed the positives. "

I believe you. You had a bad time, for sure.

What I objected to in Amanda's post was the assumption that the negatives of stress always outweigh the positives. This is dogmatic and unhelpfully assumes something that may not be true for an individual mother.

I agree with you that just telling people to 'get on with it, dear' is very unhelpful

Thanks for your kind words, mosschops.

I absolutely agree Mosschops. I read this thread through yesterday and TikTok's first post was brilliant - so understanding, intelligent and full of empathy for the OP's siuation as it is.

I very rarely venture on to teh breastfeeding boards (as a mother of a 13 year old it is all rather behind me now ) however Tiktok always seems to be there with some cracking advice.

OP - I don't think there is any need for your to be pressured either. If you really feel strongly about it, I agree thatI would speak to your midwife now, put your position across, and ask for advice and info re formula feeding.

milamae an excellent post, I could have written it myself after my horrendous experience bf dd. I personally believe having a mother who's deeply anxious, stressed, sleep deprived, unhappy, resentful and at risk of PND is far more damaging to a childs immediate and future health than ff.

I wanted to swap to ff at 3 months after not being able to go for more than an hour between feeds for 12 weeks and dd screaming constantly due to hunger. However this didn't happen until 4.5 months as she refused to take a bottle. My mental health worsened over this time, suicidal thoughts the lot. When she finally began to take a bottle our lives were collectively transformed for the better. She was a different baby, finally not hungry able to feed and sleep successfully. I stopped wanting to run away dh much happier.

Am now 40 weeks pg, will try bf again for 6 weeks or so. If it settles down will carry on with mixed feeding as now know that this CAN be done successfully despite propaganda to the contrary. Any probs however will be changing to ff, will not put myself or my family through that hell again.

OP I hope you manage to feed successfully whatever your decision and please don't be pressurised into doing something that will make you unhappy.

minx, you say "I personally believe having a mother who's deeply anxious, stressed, sleep deprived, unhappy, resentful and at risk of PND is far more damaging to a childs immediate and future health than ff."

This is a difficult thing to compare, though! I think it is clear that severe mental health problems are definitely 'bad' for the baby, sometimes very bad...but if the baby has a dad or grandma who is not suffering, the effects are nothing like as bad. With breastfeeding we are talking more about physical differences in health outcomes.

I get a bit frustrated with the notion of comparing feeding with the effects of the mental state of the mother - and using this as a reason to stop breastfeeding because it is better for the baby to have a mother who is not struggling with feeding.

We don't know, in an individual case, what is going to be better. If breastfeeding is making a mother feel suicidal, then it's pretty clear she needs to stop breastfeeding. The baby needs his mum more than he needs breastfeeding But if a mother is less acutely distressed, then she needs help with the breastfeeding as well as help with her mental and emotional state.

It should not be beyond the means of a 21st century society to ensure help and support is easily obtainable for both bf and mental health....but it seems it is

(minx - it's not 'propaganda' to warn women that mixed feeding has drawbacks and may not work well. )

Sorry to hear that Minx

I did want to add something though, for anyone who might be reading this.
I know and love a number of women who stopped breastfeeding and found that the ensuing guilt (however wrong) further contributed to their PND rather than helping matters. I think it is worth bearing that in mind.

Tiktok I wasn't suicidal but I wouldn't wish the stress my 3 endured during their early days on any baby. As you say we don't know the damage it may cause but the risk is still there. Being exposed to an anxious mother every single time a baby wakes up so every waking moment is full of stress can not surely be a good thing.

Having a non suffering dad/grandma means nothing as you're glued to said distressed baby which they can't feed every waking moment,you can't escape other than through sleep(if you're lucky).

This stress is far more widespread than I think many pro bfeeders want to believe, it was pretty average amongst the vast numbers of us 'failed' breastfeeders I've since met on the toddlers/pre-school/school run.

It angers me the way it's just brushed under the carpet,never acknowledged incase it puts other women off even trying. So so very wrong. I wonder if this brushing under the carpet has added to the increase of PND in recent years.

milamae - your experience was bad, and sadly not uncommon, but it is not especially a feature of breastfeeding.

If the mother is breastfeeding, and it is not going well and she is unsupported, then of course her PND/stress will be linked to it...the answer is to ensure the bf, and the anxiety, is dealt with. If the mother is formula feeding, and it is not going well, then she needs help with that. It is not the formula feeding that causes it.

Feeding is the 'stage' on which stress and anxiety is played out.

Exposure to an anxious mother is not good for a baby, that's for sure, but this experience has been shown to be mitigated if there is a non-suffering carer even some of the time...this is well-demonstrated in research.

Stress, anxiety, depression and other mental health issues are acknowledged and recognised by any caring, competent HCP. I simply don't recognise the picture of them being brushed under the carpet in order to stop women avoiding breastfeeding.

However you feed, you may suffer stress. Breastfeeding is no more 'guilty' of actually causing this than formula.

once again, Tiktok is being brilliant here - i heart her and want to be like her!!

Can I just add my 2p about stress/depression and bf? I had PND 3 times, once very seriously, was suicidal, spent a short time in hospital with it etc ....

And the one thing that kept me going? Breastfeeding! I felt like I was a crap mother, there were days I needed people there all the time as I literally could not move to pick a baby up. But I was still feeding. It meant my children got loads of time lying beside me or sitting on me, and I knew I was doing the best for my children in one small way.

Breastfeeding and depression are not mutually exclusive!

tiktok I'm afraid I disagree, working as a professional in child mental health I think anything whoch increases the likelihood of depression/severe and prolonged stress in the mother is likely to affect bonding and attachment between Mum and baby, this can have severe and adverse consequences for the rest of that childs life into adulthood.

The anxiety and trauma of bf my daughter caused bonding problems between us which only at the age of 3 are beginning to be resolved. And yes, I felt guilty giving up and swapping over expecially as it was a bit of a fight (bottle refusal). But why should women feel guilty for choosing a feeding method that suits them and their family? the reason they do is because, and i won't apologise for this the way SOME of the pro breastfeeding lobby promote bf is akin to propaganda IMO. And IME all of my friends who've done mixed feeding have done it with no problems. This is why I intend to go down this route this time round after first trying to establish bf for 6 weeks.

As milamae says. The type of scenario we've described is all too common and is brushed under the carpet by the bf lobby and some health professionals. Hv get slagged off a lot on here but i for one was extremely grateful when one came round on an emergency call out, initiated by my dh when I was losing it and 1; didn't try and change my mind about switching to formula 2; told the truth about bf, that's it's relentless and can be miserable for some women and 3; gave me sound sensible advice on how to switch which actually worked.

Sorry to bang on about this but it's a topic I feel particularly passionate about and I feel some (not you tiktok) of the bf lobby are quite blinkered about.

Sorry Tik Tok brest feeding is way more guilty of causing stress. I've done both. I know.

Formula feeding is pain free,easier(no obsessing about latch)enables you to sleep more at night and escape in the day(if you have supportive partners).

Breast feeding is the complete opposite. It's agony,a very hard skill to learn, far more time consuming and a huge factor in sleep deprivation you and only you can do it. You feel hemmed in by it,it's suffocating at times.If you're struggling it takes over your brain. With a bottle you pop it in and 5 blissful(for mum and baby) mins later it's job done.

Breast feeding caused me huge amounts of stress,formula feeding not a jot,not 1 iota, nothing.

Having said that if I'd far,far,far rather have breast fed my dc but hey some you win some you loose

and of course a mum can unfortunately experience pnd whatever feeding method they choose, I'm intelligent enough to know tha but based on mine and other Mums I've spoken to anecdotal evidence the stress anf anxiety of struggling with bf and feeling like a failure can be a contributing factor in some cases.

As for the dad/grandma thing to mitigate the effects of the Mums stress, my dh worked all day til 6 leaving me struggling with feeding 5 days a week at least 12 hours a day on my own and my Mum came up for a couple of hours once a fortnight!!! It's hardly going to be adequate compensatory care for the poor baby glued to her exhausted, guilt wracked, crying stressed out mother it it?! This is the reality of most mothers lives on mat leave. A lot of professional women live some distance from their families and their partners work because they have to.

Sorry Tiktok I echo Minx I don't think you're blinkered I hope my post didn't insinuate that.

I find it very refreshing the way you're handling this thread. Very measured,we obviously have diff opinions but you're not at all judgmental and I feel very open to what those of us like Minx and myself have to say ie not just dismissing it completely or posting endless quotes and stats.

I do wish others had the same approach on here and in RL.

MilaMae
I think it is important that we all understand that it is our own experiences that colour how stressful we find different situations.

I would find FF much, much more stressful than breastfeeding because every fibre of my being would want to be breastfeeding my baby instead.

milamae - "Sorry Tik Tok brest feeding is way more guilty of causing stress. I've done both. I know."

For you, this was the case. It is not true of everyone, or even the majority.

Individual mothers are different.

Some mothers feel very stressed when formula feeding - I have been in touch with mothers who became obsessive about sterilising, amounts of water, amounts taken by the baby.

Your own, personal, individual experience is your own. You cannot use it to extrapolate to others.

Ooooh tiktok, was I channelling you then??

Zippy every fibre of my being wanted to breast feed too, even so formula was way less stressful.

Tiktok I was obsessive about sterilising too (7 years of IVF makes you like that when you finally have your precious bundles),even so that stress was nothing compared to that when I breast fed.

It didn't even come close.

minx - in your case, the support and help you had from partner and mother was obviously minimal.

I am not talking about you. I was talking about the research that showed stressed/anxious mothers do not inevitably cause their babies' distress/stress, and trying (in my small way) to move away from personal experiences as a way of predicting what will happen to others.

To say, as has been said on this thread, that babies of stressed mothers will be harmed and damaged, is just as dogmatic and wrong as saying that (for instance) breastfeeding babies never get ill.

To have a grown up debate, we have to stop using our own personal experience as if it trumps everything else.

The research is clear: having a carer who is not suffering from mental health issues is a good thing and helps reduce the negative effect on a baby of having a mentally-ill mother. No, this will not work if the baby only sees this carer a couple of hours a fortnight.

I was speaking generally. If you do not fit the profile, it does not negate what I said.

OK, mila, in your case the stress was worse with bf.

I believe you.

I was not generalising out to every mother. As you surely realise.

Have to say, I agree with tiktok. Even though my problems with BFing, and the pressure I felt from all parties about carrying on, the guilt I felt because I was failing as a mum not being able to provide what is constantly pushed as this most basic of things for my children were immensely stressful, and pushed me into PND, I do see that my experiences are my own, and would never advise another mother to do what I did purely based on what worked or didn't work for me. I found FFing stressful too - by this point, my DTs were tiny, hungry and fretful, so I became obsessed with the amount they were taking, and, with twins, whether I would be in a suitable place at the correct time for their feeds and so on. Not to mention the hassle of dealing with that many feeds, that many bottles and so on. At least I knew that they WERE feeding, which I never really did when I was BFing.

It has to be the decision of the individual, though, (in the OP's case, especially, the couple) and I think it's unfair of posters on this board to push their views in the emotive way many have been doing.

I have to say also wanting to ff safely is something every mother worries about to begin with, I'd worry if they didn't. It's not really the same at all.

I would also think obsessing about sterilising to the point of distress must be very rare, far rarer than the misery many endure with bfeeding.