How old is 'too old' to breastfeed? (long sorry)

[NaturalMama]

My first post on here after lurking for a very long time. I'm also planning to post in AIBU (I'm made of strong stuff!)

I've started to get quite a few snarky comments and dirty looks while breastfeeding my eldest. These are not from mere strangers but from dear close friends and immediate family.

My eldest is 4.2, going into reception and he has had access to 'minty' ( his word) whenever he likes since birth. At the moment he currently has it after breakfast (and after I've fed his sister), in place of and/or just before or after his afternoon kip around 2pm, and just after tea. Sometimes more, sometimes just once. He is very excited about going to school but he's always been a very very shy boy and we've had talks about him not having minty during the day but he seems okay with it. I've never tried to get him to stop as I think if he asks for it, he obviously needs the comfort. He's never had a dummy/comforter and shows no interest in bartering minty time for toys, sweets, etc.

I had a baby when he was 2 who passed away at 4 months old. I do admit that feeding my eldest was just as comforting for me as it was for him during that time, and I felt it wasn't fair on him to go cold turkey when he was having an emotional time as well.

My youngest is just gone 7 months and she feeds about 5 times a day, obviously between when DS has a go.

Family is starting to tease DS about it saying he's not a big boy and his school friends will think he's silly. It's a private thing and we are always alone when we do it (apart from DD and DH) but family/friends ask me if I've stopped yet and I feel a bit huffy about it.

I know he's not getting anything nutritionally out of it, but can I ask the Mumsnet jury what you think? Is it harmless/comforting for him especially at a time of upheaval (i.e. sister being born, loss of second, starting school) or is it time to give it up and if so - how on earth do I go about doing this? It's not about me babying him as I have another baby I can happily feed for at least another two years!

oh ok

'And your reasoning behind that pices? '

They do not need it nutritionally. I wouldn't let them have a dummy at that age (not that mine had one)and I certainly wouldn't give them a drink in a bottle. You can have a very close relationship and lots of laughs, cuddles and chat. They have moved on-the mother has to accept that they are not a baby. They don't need her milk, to be pushed around in a bugGy or to be with her all the time. They have exciting new things to explore-they are getting much more independant-they are no longer an appendage of the mother-they get their own ideas and views, which might be different.They can discuss abstract subjects like 'the meaning of life',giving them a boob to comfort isn't age appropriate and longer. They can make relationships away from you, e.g. have a close relationship with a grandparent without you being around. Parenting is a gradual letting go so that by the time they are 18 they are a fully fledged, emotionally secure adult. Clinging to an outworn stage isn't healthy IMO.
I think the mother needs to make sure that it is coming from the DC and the DC isn't picking up vibes that the mother still wants it. The one programme that I saw on TV about it, was a woman who was very militant about bf and still feeding her 4 yr old. The 4 yr old waited until the camera was full on her, spoke directly into it to say 'I don't know why you keep going on about it mummy'. She had moved on, it was the mother who hadn't.

Where did I say minimal needs?!!
A child picks up a lot of unspoken vibes from the mother-if he/she senses she is needy, she is going to go along with it. It isn't conscious thought. The one on the TV programme was still being bf but she was knowing enough to put in the killer comment at the right moment! She was going along with the needs of the mother.

I love wine and chocolate but I limit myself very strictly-I don't have it when I want it!
If you are happy that is all that matters-in RL I wouldn't say a word, so no one would know my views! I like mumsnet because I can be honest instead of diplomatic. We must just agree to differ.

piscesmoon said "Once they can walk and talk they are too old IMO."

Your opinion but in many cases you will be wrong. My children both started cruising at 8 months and were walking independantly at 10 months(DD) and 11 months (DS) respectively.

At under one they could not move onto cow's milk, so you think the right thing to do would be to wean them off breastmilk and cut down on our food budget in order to buy formula

Ou of interest at what age did you stop nursing your three sons ?

Mine were 10months, 13months and 11months.They are boys-life was much too exciting to be kept a baby!! They self weaned.
Of course you can't feed a DC who doesn't want to be fed, but you can feed one who senses that the mother wants it-DC like to please.

But why isn't it age appropriate?
In other cultures children are breastfed at older ages than is the norm here.
Having an occasional breastfeed doesn't stop a child spending time away from mum, or developing their own ideas and personality.

I realise you're talking about children of around 4, but you said that once they can walk and talk it's not appropriate.
DS is 15 months, he walks over, says boob and has a feed.
Why should I stop now?
He is asserting his own personality and independence by asking for what he wants and getting it. He has control over that aspect of his life now. When he doesn't ask for it anymore he won't get it anymore.
I trust him to guide his development more than some arbitrary cultural bias we suffer in this country.

Not a lot-it was a bit silly reading it through! Time I stopped posting!

My oldest child is nearly 3 years old and still nurses (as does her one year old brother)

She is on the whole a happy bright child, who hugs me and tells me she loves me (and my milk)

She has a close relationship with her grandparents and enjoys days and nights away from me (and my breasts) for a couple of days with no negativity.

She walks a good deal outside the house and has done so since she was 12 months old. We never used a pram with her, we had slings or she walked since birth.

She is very independant friendly and non clingy child.

"They do not need it nutritionally."
Milk is still required to be part of a young child's diet. If they do not have breastmilk, we are told to give them formula/follow on formula/cow milk in it's place. So I would say it is needed nutritionally.

Plus you are ignoring the importance of a working nursing relationship for the child. I have yet to met a mother who is nursing an older child who is not doing it because the child at some level needs the comfort/milk/whatever they get from nursing. Something that people outside the nursing relationship struggle to understand.

"The 4 yr old waited until the camera was full on her, spoke directly into it to say 'I don't know why you keep going on about it mummy'."
LOL. Out of the mouth of babes
You have decided on one translation, I'll give you two other possibilities.

1. She might be wondering why her mother was discussing something so everyday and boring. She is likely to have reacted the same way if her mother talking about how much she wees in a day.

1. She might have been bored and fedup of the cameras and wanted her mother to stop talking (going on) and take her home/park etc.

Who knows, what going in her head. I certainly don't, I am just guessing. But one thing is certain, she would not be nursing unless she wanted to. You can not force a child to latch and nurse it is the ultimate in child led activity. You can hold a child to your breast but can not make them nurse.

HTH

Not even sure about "you can feed one who senses that the mother wants it"...if only that was generally true how much easier parenting would be - I want my DCs to do all sorts of things,some they do and some they don't! As an late BFer there were times when I definately did not want to do it - didn't stop the DC's though!
What I find difficult is the assumption that a child being BF beyond the age normal in our society is being "kept a baby" .I didn't want my DC's to stay babies,I wanted them to grow and learn and become independant,which they have,and the nursing did't seem to be relevant to that one way or the other - it was just part of what we did.
I'm not perfect(obviously!),and so there are probably ways I've not got the balance between encouraging independence,and pushing too hard for my DCs to do things they weren't ready for,wrong,but that would be true regardless of whether they were still nursing.
Now I have to go and see DS(age 9)who wants a cuddle

Sorry - should say "not got the balance blah blah right",not wrong!

Pisces, following your argument logically then, your DC may have self-weaned because they sensed that was what you wanted.

I understand that Mumsnet is a pro and extended breastfeeding formum, but there will be mums or dads sometimes who do not agree with all that is said and will have different opinions does not make it wrong IMO. I would be boring if there was just one side and not different views its what makes threads interesting. Wastingmy not necessarily, Picesmoons sons might have just got to the stage where they did not want it anymore and self weaned early, its like potty training, walking, talking some do it earlier than others, some may need encouragement to do so.

No i dont understand as I did not nurse for long at all only those who have done it for a considerable time will, I am just on the outside looking in and its just the way I see it. I do miss that special closeness, and had a funny dream last night that i had another dc and was had loads of milk and was bf really well, you never know eh.

"They can discuss abstract subjects like 'the meaning of life". Bloody hell, pisces - dd was walking at 14 mo, but hasn't yet mentioned the meaning of life to me. And she's nearly 3!! I feel like I've failed as a parent.

Piglet, you'll note I said 'may' have.

hi naturalmama,

I have read your original post but not the responses (am at work.

It is absolutely natural for a child to be breastfeeding at this age. If you wanted to wean him, fine, but don't do that to you or him just because of what other might think.

As a child-psychologist I firmly believe that self-weaning IS the only emotionaly harmless way for a child to stop breastfeeding. That's not to say that I believe everyone should carry on bfing until child self-weans, there are a million factors that can determine a mother's decision in the matter. I'm only saying that if you have the option and obviously the willingness to let him carry on for as long as he needs to, then do it.

And when people ask you can simply say "yes he does still bf. how are you with your thrush/ how's your divorce going/ I CAN'T believe you're forcing your poor baby to wean at such a young age". Please, DON'T get bullied, you don't have to defend your parenting decisions.

I am VERY pro-breastfeeding for as long as possible but I have to say, in answer to the OP that BF as far as reception is too far. I suppose logically there is no problem with lifelong BF (until the mother dies) but realistically it has to stop sometime.

I would be worried about my child talking about it in school and it becoming common knowledge. Whatever you think about it you have to accept that in out culture this is a very marginal activity and the reaction from most people will be a mixture of disbelief/distaste/hilarity. This is the kind of information which children do not forget and will lead to nicknames which will follow throughout school.

Not a good time to wean him now, though, in the run-up to starting school, so I guess you'll have to run that risk.

there cannot be such a thing as life-long bf, as humans lose with age the ability to suckle (the jaw shape changes, the children start to suck and milk supply reduces until it stops.

The age this happens is different for every child, and depends on the child's nutritional needs. It's is usually between the age of 3 and 5, but some children are still able to suckle at 7. They self wean at the age that they don't need dairy anymore, as we're not designed to consume other mamals' milk. I know we do, I have had an exclusively ff baby who now loves cow's milk and yoghurts. I'm merely saying how nature intended things to be -for good reasons.

Hi mummygirl can i ask some advice from you. please, can i message you from here at all

let me check, if not I'll sort it out when I get a sec