If you have an arsey comment about breastfeeding

[SunglassesPolarBear]

come and say it here please, let's get them all out in the open and in one place.
So far today I have seen a comment along the lines of "don't know why you bothered" to someone who was please to have reached 6 months of excl bf, and an incredibly rude and unhelpful comment on a thread started by a woman who was worried that her supply would be affected by her DH giving their 10 day old a bottle of formula. Snotty comments (whether to bfers or ffers) are NOT WELCOME on those sorts of threads, so go on, offload here.

Oh, before we start, some myths I'd like to bust:

• Improved health outcomes of bf babies are not down to social class - that has been accounted for
• People bfing past 3 weeks / 6 months / a year are not doing it just for their own sakes
• It's not only OK to bf in public "if it's done discreetly"

erm..sure more will come up

I thought you'd written librarian there and was trying to work out why that gave you diplomacy skills.

Particularly as my Mum is a librarian and she's the judgiest liberal I've ever met.

Is she!? Librans take ages looking at evidence then decide. Maybe she has decided on everythng!

I never make it to the decision point - I feel it's important in my job to never know whats best for someone, but to help them find it out themselves.

Glad not flanmed for even mentioning smoking and feeding in same post, hopefully people will take it as it is - a comparison between health promotion exercises. It could equally be exercise oralcohol consumption

Ok Chulita!

Tiktok, I find it really odd that while the majority of people are completely convinced by the logic of 'you are what you eat' in relation to older children and adults, there's still so much skepticism about the research showing different health outcomes for populations of ff and bf babies.

I can only think it's got something to do with the way formula is marketed to stress its 'nutritional completeness' and 'closer than ever to breastmilkness'.... people must think that there really isn't much of a difference between breastmilk and formula.

Have to say - I do have a problem with formula being marketed as a 'nutritionally complete' food for babies. How can it be considered nutritionally complete if it's missing half the things that are in breastmilk? Unless someone is going to come along and suggest that the additional constituents in breastmilk are nutritionally redundant.....

Mothers used to be advised to smoke and bf at the same time - to help them relax. Happy days.

SJG - I could do with some research [I wouldn't care if it was double blind or not] that 'proves' having a cold pint of larger at 11:30 whilst feeding encourages....well, whatever really!

Your post is why prescriptive health promotion never works, ever. Something gets discredited or outdated and the whole message is lost. imo completely unbacked so please don't ask!

I'd like research that shows it is beneficial to have a margarita rather than hang out the washing. I suspect it is but no proof so far.

The message about having a fag in your feeding baby's face is probably best lost. But it is an interesting point. I was advised NOT to eat peanuts while pregnant to lessen the baby's chance of developing an allergy (family history of nut allergy) with my first two. With the last one the advice had changed to it being beneficial to eat peanuts for the same reason.

It seems to be common sense that the milk produced by the species drinking it must be the optimum quality but I think we get so much information, which is frequently contradictory in all areas of life, that many people are cynical about any sort of promotion, bf included, however sound the science.

I have to be smug about BF, as I am so monumentally crap at every aspect of parenting...from discipline, to toilet training, to food, every ideal I ever had has long since been abandoned...so the fact I BF for 18 mmonths is silver lining of smugness around massive black cloud of maternal shame

"I find it really odd that while the majority of people are completely convinced by the logic of 'you are what you eat' in relation to older children and adults, there's still so much skepticism about the research showing different health outcomes for populations of ff and bf babies."
I completely agree and it seems to me (although I may be wrong) as I've said further down that bf and ff are virtually the only areas where the research and recommendations are so widely likely to be discredited. Give people a link between smoking and lung cancer or exercise and a health weight and they are happy to accept it. Talk about the risks of ff and suddenly everyone leaps on it with statements talking about social factors, general diet and lifestyle, and the old faithful "you can't walk into a class of children and pick out who has been bf and who has been ff". It's amazing!

when I say discredited I mean people saying they don't believe it or aren't convinced, or assuming the research was flawed. Not what I would consider properly discredited iyswim.

Riven: I think a lot of mothers take some comfort in the thought that later eating habits have more impact on health than whether the same kid was bf as an infant or not.

There is no evidence for this, of course. Unless you know of some

this is a complete hijack alert ... but i am looking for riven ( i think) ... i think you had a thread a while back about being pissed off with doctors who referred to you as "mum" when talking to you about your dd ? am i right so far ? well wanted to say i had always done htis thinking it was nice for aparents, good for the children i was seeing etc, but your thread really opened my eyes to how it maybe seen to be patronising, so i polled afew patients nad overall everyone wanted me to call theem Mrs Smith or by htier first name so i am now trying hard to do o that - thought you would like to know.

Have to say, I feel the exact opposite of Riven. Like most mums, I find it a struggle to get my children to eat a balanced diet. It's not that my kids are at all fussy - they like good food, but they also hoover up junk whenever they have access to it as well. I think today's food environment is absolutely toxic - as a parent you have to put quite a lot of thought and effort (and discipline) into the whole food side of family life. I'm so grateful that they all had a year of breastfeeding to start out with, at a time when their bodies and brains were undergoing the most rapid development. The fact that the cognitive and circulatory benefits of bf can be measured years later makes me wonder if bf sort of sets some of the body's systems for life.

Could have clouted my mum this weekend. We were visiting my aunt's week old baby, baby's mum has just finished bf her. Now, I was bowled over with admiration as she had a monster pregnancy (SPD, pneumonia and shingles the poor thing), had a caesarian and mastitis, and was feeding the baby even though she was in so much pain. Yet she was very upbeat and is so lovely.

My mum - how do you know how much milk the baby has had
Aunt - well, you don't, it's not measured, she just stops when she wants
My mum - well, I don't think I would have liked that, I liked to know how many ounces they had
Aunt - well, she seems happy and content
My mum - (doom laden voice) but you're never sure, are you. She could end up with malnutrition.
Me - (high pitched and mortified) Come on mum off we go!

I gave her such a mouthful when we left. Christ, I had to listen to that crap when dd was a baby (I was 'selfish' because I fed bf, which meant mum couldn't give her a bottle). Mum is a lovely woman but is absolutely ignorant and stupid about breastfeeding.

fabsmum - it does appear that breastfeeding has this long-term 'calibrating' effect, yes.

I have ff both of mine, could not bf because of medication I take, but never liked the idea of bf anyway. All the forums regarding bad sleep pattern, loss of routine and co-sleeping which i think is dangerous are mainly from bf babies. I think its more important to wean on homecooked food rather than jars than whether you bf of ff.

dabbsy - so breastfeeding leads to a 'bad sleep pattern', a loss of routine (presumably also 'bad') and co-sleeping? And co-sleeping (and breastfeeding) is 'dangerous', you think? You have no evidence to say this whatsoever.

And giving homecooked food is more important than breastfeeding? What is your evidence for this?

dabbsy, I am sorry - I sound more irritated than I feel!

It's just that the discussion is generally more rewarding when people can back up what they say, and don't use spurious arguments...

hi tiktok, sorry to digress but can you point me in the direction of some cosleeping research or info? i am continually falling asleep with lo and its concerning me somewhat

TREEDELIVERY, FULLTIMEWORKINGMUMMMY, THUMBWITCH, and any other health care professionals: this thread's for you.

sorry didnt mean it to sound like that. I was just giving an opinion on friends experiences in relation to mine. I'm not saying bf leads to bad sleep pattern, but it does seem that most people who bf have a much harder time. Not meaning to upset anyone just adding a different argument based on my experiences. Guess things come over different when typed out rather than spoken.

newbayjustarrived: co-sleeping can be risky if you co-sleep on a sofa or in an armchair. But of itself it is not dangerous:

www.babyfriendly.org.uk/items/item_detail.asp?item=577 will lead you to other links and research to help you develop safe bed-sharing.

thanks tiktok thats fab