Thinking about cutting down now (14 months) but need some help

[susanmt]

Ds is 14 months next week. I stopped feeding dd at 13 months as I was pregnant and she stopped of her own accord.
Ds is an addict. He would still feed 5 or 6 times a day given a chance. If he ever sees my nipples (in the bath, getting dressed etc) he becomes totally obsessed with getting a feed.
I want to keep on feeding him morning and evening for now but am keen to cut down the daytime feeds for a variety of reasons (mainly eating into time with both children as he will feed for half an hour at a time, which can be up to 2 hours in the course of the day).
Any tips as to how to go about this? Have tried offering a cup and a snack, which are uncerimoniously chucked accross the room. At the weekend dh takes him when he is hungry and gets the same response.

I am afraid that if you want to cut down you will have to 'shut up shop'. During the day you just must not give in. My sister had this problem but she kept her resolve and her dd soon settled to less feeds. You will need to find some sort of distraction therapy and be prepared for the old nuzzling into the boob and pleading eyes. I don't think I would offer a food substitute at the times he is looking for the breast or you will get a negative response. Offer him drinks when he is not looking for the boob. Also wear big jumpers Good luck.

Dd is 20 months old and up untill a month ago she was still very keen on my milk. Like you, I wanted to cut down daytime feeds and I have had some success. My secret? Vinegar! You need to rub some on your nipples before ds wants a feed. Put him on to feed and he'll realise that this is not nice and will back off! I know this sounds a bit drastic and maybe cruel, but from my experience, it worked. I am still happy to feed first thing in the morning and last thing at night and now my dd doesn't ask for it during the day.
Good luck!

Today has been OK. I fed him first thing, and nothing since! Every time he climbed up on my lap and lay himself down (big soppy pleading eyes and all) I just picked him up and went off and did something interesting, like looking in the mirror (one of his fave things). He's napping just now, and I will feed him when he wakes, and then do the same in the afternoon until bedtime. Then I'm not cutting it all out at once, and he does like the post-nap feed the best (doesn't need it to get to sleep).
Thanks for the support

It must help that he doesn't need bf to go to sleep. I've just cut my dd (11.5 months) down to 2 feeds a day - morning and evening and have to endure some crying whilst she settles for her nap in the day. I just hold her close and stroke her head and it is working! I still feed her to sleep at nighttime though. I take it you are not feeding through the night? I found I had to really cut the night feeds out first as otherwise if I stopped any day time feeds she fed more at night.
Your distraction method sounds a good idea. I have to say I give dd some food if it is mid-morning or mid-afternonn as I do think she needs some sort of snack. All that moving around must use up a lot of energy. I have found that dd seems much happier not bf through the day but I am pregnant at the moment and maybe my milk wasn't really satisfying her.
I tbink it is important to do these things slowly and it sounds to me like you have the right idea.
Sorry this seems a bit of a waffly message!

Susammt, my DS (16 mths) is also very keen on the breast - he doesn't bother pleading, he just yanks up my top and pulls at my bra - and when he's finished he covers me up! Does make saying no a bit difficult. Has anybody read the "What to expect" book on breastfeeding past one year - quite negative I thought. One thing struck me was the comment that by feeding when they are upset, sad, etc we are not letting them find other means of comfort - true that DS never took to a dummy or a comforter, just uses Mummy!

I try not to feed during the day, as I think it affects his eating, but find it difficult, particularly when he wakes up from naps completely miserable. Going out is a good trick, even if I have to wrestle him screaming into the buggy. I am in two minds about giving up altogether - because he wakes at 5.30am, have found the only way to get him to sleep again is to bring him into bed for a feed. Never took a bottle, so suspect if we dropped BF he would not take to milk, and as he is a poor eater I worry about that. But would like the freedom of being able to go out and not worry about feeding - even an o/night stay!!! And also he is getting harder and harder to say no to, so suspect the longer I leave it, the harder it will get. Any thoughts??

To update - we have had 2 very sucessful days of 3 feeds a day (morning, after nap and night). I have been giving him a snack (cup of cows milk and biscuit/fruit) about 1/2 an hour before he was usually looking for the breast mid morning and afternoon and this seems to have worked well today - I don't feel like I am saying 'no' to him so often.
I love feeding him and don't want to stop yet (especially as he is my last baby) but this has freed up a lot of time and it is so nice to see him and dd sitting on the sofa together with their snacks. Brought a wee tear to my eye!

florenceuk - because ds doesn't mind about feeding to sleep, we have sucessfully left him ovenight with grandparents twice, and they just gave him a cup at bedtime (he was never very keen on bottles, even with ebm). He will screech for me in the morning if dh tries to get up with him at the weekends to let me sleep, but when we left him with my parents a few weeks back he made no fuss at all - must have known we weren't there!

Having succesfully cut down to the two feeds a day I wanted to, I think my milk is drying up! Ds has started looking for a cup as soon as he is finished with me and will drink a whole beaker of milk or water after a breastfeed. He is also pulling hard at the breast as if it is a big effort to get anything.
Could it be that I have cut down 'too far' and I just can't keep up feeding him so little? I have heard of this happening to people but wasn't sure if it was an old wives tale or not. Not sure if I want to try and increase supply again - if it would all gently end of its own accord I think I wouldn't mind too much. Maybe I have just answered my own question! I think it is because he is my last baby I am loathe to stop doing something I enjoy so much and which has, through all my mental and physical illness as a mother, been the one think I was always genuinely sure I was doing the best thing with.
There you go it has turned from a 'cutting down' thread into a 'weaning depression' thread!

As long as he suckles you will have milk. Babies can be on one feed only for months. Do whatever makes you feel happier. Increase your feeds again for a few weeks and see if you feel better about it. Maybe you are not as ready as you thought.

I've stopped. I can't even express a drop to rub onto my increasingly sore nipples as he was sucking and sucking for no benefit. I don't know what has happened - I was always sure that as long as we kept on with it there would be something there but I assure you there is nothing. I haven't fed him for 48 hours and there's no engorgement, no discomfort, and even now I cant express a drop.
I'm not ill, I'm not pregnant and just a bit tired. Ds isn't very happy about it, but is already finding himself other things to do, so I'm sure he'll be fine. It the end of an era for me as I'm not having any more children, but something I was dreading so it happening of its own accord has been a bit of a releif! Thanks for all your help!

I am sorry breastfeeding has ended so abruptly for you susnmt. As you know my dd stopped suddenly at 15 months and could not be persuaded to carry on. She was also my last baby and I was so disappointed at the time. However, it is good to see them become more independent of you (although a little sad at the same time). I think at this stage we have to 'bite the bullit' and accept that this stage of our lives is past.
Try to enjoy the positive side of this new found freedom. Well done for your achievement

susanmt, your experience sounds very similar to mine (milk just dried up once I cut down to two feeds) but of course for me it happened way sooner - at 6 months. I guess some of us are just made that way - its not an old wives tale after all! I did feel somewhat cheated as I'd assumed that I could go back to work and carry on twice a day, and have often wondered if I could/should have done things differently (especially with all the tales on here about how easy it is to mix feed). I don't suppose it makes you feel any better(!) but at least you can look back on your bf days with real pride.

oh and while your there - what's it like having children with birthdays so close to each other? My second has practically the same due date as ds!!

I'm down to two feeds a day, too and I know that tug tug tugging feeling... she won't go to sleep after/ during a feed now

elliot - it wasn't planned that way with the birthdays, and the number of jokes we have had about only doing 'it' once a year (or once every 2 years I suppose!!)lol. In fact, ds wasn't actually due until a week after dd's birthday but he came 10 days early.
It's fine. Ds was born on 3rd Feb 2002, with dd turning 2 on the 6th. The one thing I was really keen to do was to be home for dd's birthday. Luckily he was born early in the morning so I had a couple of days to relax inhospital and came home in the afternoon the day before her birthday.
This year it was fun, with the 2 together. Dd had great fun getting ready for ds's 1st b'day, and it took her mind off her own a bit I think, as she was hyper! Very few people forget their birthdays (except FIL, but that another gripe) and when they are older I'm sure we'll have joint parties etc!

Sorry it happened so abruptly susanmt - but also good that it wasn't too traumatic. I am on two feeds a day when I am work and x times a day when I am at home - DH is bugging me to wean and I can't face it...

susanmt hope you are not feeling too sad about this.
Do you mind me asking, how do you know there is no milk in there?
I have always been told the inability to express a drop is NO indicator of milk not being present.( Ie you can't get it out but the baby can!) Nor is feelings or otherwise of engorgement.
Hope I am not being insensitive by asking this.
Thanks.

I think there are 2 reasons to be fairly sure there is little or no milk there. First of all I have been a champion expresser, both hand and manual pump, and all of a sudden there is nothing at all coming out of the breat at all when I pump in either way. Up until now there has always been a little. The other reason is ds. For the last few days, and only the last few days, (since I cut down to two feeds a day - maybe I did it too quickly???) he has been totally dissatisfied with the feeding which he has never been before. He was rejecting the breat at bedtime, and in the morning after feeding for over half an hour he was gulping down at least a beaker of milk and sometimes wanting more - not a boy who was satisfied with what Mummy was providing. I have also always been 'aware' of the milk flowing when I was feeding and I have lost any sense of that.
If no engorgement and expressing nothing is no sign of no milk, then what is?
I'm not totally happy with stopping (I always had 18 months in my head for some reason) but it has come to what I regard as a natural end now, and as today went on he got more and more relaxed about it. I feel I did pretty well managing to keep going until 14 months!

Thanks for the explanation Susnanmt, it does make perfect sense.
I have always been hopeless at expressing , felt no let down or engorgement and was convinced there was nothing in there for the first few weeks.
14 months is fantastic, I hope you are proud of your achievement.

I was so relieved to find this thread. Florenceuk, I was just nodding and nodding with everyhthing you wrote. My ds is a passionate and very committed breastfeeder (15 mths) and it is his favorite acitvity which can cause problems as I now mind feeding in public and he likes full access and holds my top up with one hand in between playing with my other nipple. He hates me putting my bra on in the morning and gives a laugh of such safisfaction and glee when he sees or reveals (takes him 15 seconds) my boobs that I can never see him stopping. If I say no he gets into such a fury he will not let me hold him and bangs his head against the floor. There is no consoling him. Also after a nap it is the only way of making the world a half decent place as he always wakes pretty miserable. He will drink milk but this makes no difference to his feeding much of which is for comfort and not for milk. His eating is terrible. This is one of the reasons my dh wants me to stop as well as how tired it makes me and that one nipple is raw and never has a chance to heal but the main reason he wants me to cut down (he wanted me to stop but we have comprimised on try to get it down to morning and evening)is that ds always comes to me for comfort and he finds this upsetting and I do agree that i would like ds to find other cuddles and affection than just breastfeeding. We will be having a lovely time with him on my lap but then he begins to nuzzle...anyway i am feeling confused and do want to cut down mainly because i want him to eat more and stop his dad being so marginalised but my heart sinks at the thought.....i am admiring of the vinegar trick but could not face it

Susanmt, just wanted to say well done on feeding your DS until 14 months! How much nicer it must be for feeding to come to a natural end than having to wean them off.

I have just picked up on the vinegar suggestion. Is that where the phrase 'vinegar t*ts' comes from?

Thought I would let you know that it all seems to have worked out fine. Ds was really unhappy in the morning s for about a week - (oh dear! What a blow! Dh had to get up with him!!) but seems to have settled down and is happily frinking loads froma cup - though not very keen on milk, I have to say. He is the Yoghurt King though, so I'm not stressing about it.
Thanks for all your support. Looking back, it was the right time to stop. We are all a lot happier because of it!

Erm ... have discovered why my milk dried up. Even though I have (had!) a mirena coil I am pregnant!
Bit shellshocked. But it certainly gives an explanation.

Congratulations!
Wait till I tell my best friend.
She has a mirena coil but would love to get pregnant "by accident"
So much for breastfeeding offering additional contraception

My goodness Susanmt! Congratulations!