'White women can't breastfeed'

[TheDevilWearsPrimark]

Feel free to be outraged as I am fuming about this.

My best friend has been struggling with breastfeeding her PFB. Her health visitor has referred her to a breastfeeding councilor, which I am pleased and amazed at as I was never offered anything like that.

She is worried that her DD is slightly dropping on the charts and under ill advised pressure from her mum who keeps suggesting she try formula.

I have just called her and she seemed really low. I tried to do my best to help, letting her know how it can be hard at first but it may well happen that it clicks into place and becomes the naturally easy thing we are led to believe it is. But then mentioned that something she overheard on the maternity ward has been troubling her.

She went to the loo late at night and overheard two midwives talking, one of whom had been really helpful in showing her how to correctly position and latch etc. They were laughing and one said 'These white women just can't breastfeed, they have lost their mothering instinct. I bet half these babies are on formula tomorrow'

I feel so sad that this has upset her so much. Personally I would be furious and would have let them know I heard them and given them a piece of my mind, but I understand why she didn't. It seems so horribly unprofessional, and even if they were joking around it is worrying that people in that position could have such an attitude.

I'm afraid I think it's bad because of the context.
I can see why it might be more acceptable for a black person generally to say something derogatory about white people, because in general they are not making a comment from a position of power.

In this case the midwives have pretty much absolute power over the new mums on the ward, and as such I think that their remarks are racist and shows a worrying underlying prejudice.

I actually felt that some of the midwives on my post-natal ward were actively hostile, but that's another matter.

I can't believe anyone is making excuses for thses women. What nasty remarks.
I don't think they should be laughing and poking fun at someone who found breastfedding hard because they are white.
It is ignorant and racist
And all this bollocks about black women being mopre at easee with it is crap
Only a small minority of Carribbean and Asian mothers breastfeed as it happens.

Oh sorry LL, I was confused... when Trinity said "am I really a minority?" I though she was asking me, cos I had just posted that successful bfers were the minority. Blah blah, sorry My head is mush today.

meemar I don't think it was acceptable, not the way they expressed it, and not the sniggering, but I do think some of the reactions on the thread are OTT. That's all.

if they had this conversation at work, on the ward and within earshot of patients, then this is unprofessional and unacceptable in the extreme.
I would make a complaint. they need to think very hard about their own attitudes imo.
I would certainly never make this kind of comment in the workplace. and newly delivered women are more vulnerable to this kind of bigotted and crass comment.

Also I think that if they had been saying "most of these babies will end up on formula, bf rates are so low" etc, that would have been equally demoralising to a new mum who was finding it hard.

Golly, this is a minefield. I think I need my lunch.

Agree meemar- Very strnage that anyone would find these remarks acceptable on a maternity ward and in a profession that is supposed to be caring.
Many members of my family are health professionals and they let of steam by laughing about things but would never refer to the colour of someones skin!!!
It would be unacceptable

I think their remarks were racist. I'm amazed that some people feel differently, if it had been the other way round everyone would be up in arms over their comments.

The most infuriating thing is that many of the mothers on their ward will fail but not because they are white but because they have not got off to a good start because of lack of support from those midwives.

I don't think that would be equally demoralising doggie.
Do you really think that?

''can see why it might be more acceptable for a black person generally to say something derogatory about white people, because in general they are not making a comment from a position of power''

Sorry but that comment shocked me. Leaving aside the racism element it is bad for midwives to be discussing new mothers within earshot whatever the circumstances. And I do believe it is wrong for anyone of any race to give reciprocal racism for something we as a generation were never involved in. It is a sad fact that it happens and maybe I don't understand it but it is wrong.

yes, how about two midwives on the desk:
"asian women make such a fuss in labour, they can't cope with the pain, no doubt those two will be screaming for an epidural in half an hour"

I would really worry about the quality of care they are providing for the white women on their ward. They obviously hold them in contempt.
I wish your friend had complained, dwp

Oh and from a postition of power suggests that there are no black people in high level postions which is tosh. One in particular is in the line to be the most powerful man in the world and how would we take it if he saw fit to 'punish' us for the hideous wrongdoings of our ancestors?

Agree dwp- what kind of society do we want?
I don't think that racism is acceptable from anybody

hold on, do we even know anything about the race of the midwives in question?

I don't think we do harpsi.
I still think the comments were unnaccceptable whatever their race.

IT was just a disgusting and stupid racist comment (don't care who was saying it btw)..i wouldn't therefore legitimise it by giving any thought.

I am black btw...and was utterly crap at breastfeeding

I'm not sure...

I'm white, so am not fully comfortable holding forth on what's racist and what's not, but it is an argument I've heard before from people whose political views I respect.

I think that the effect of a comment does differ depending who's saying it. I didn't say that there were no black people in power. I said 'generally' speaking.

well it's nasty and unprofessional
and a rather patronising and unpleasant thing to say about women who are probably trying their best to breastfeed.

but I think the OP's friend maybe needs to put it behind her, and not dwell on it at all really. Better off focussing on herself and her baby right now.

They were Nigerian, but I agree it is unnacceptable regardless.

It reminds me of something my mum has often brought up. When she was pregnant with my sister she had had two recent miscarriages and so had frequent scans. One time she overheard a student giggling that it would be easier to scan her if there wasn't so much fat in the way.

Years later that comment, heard at a vulnerable time, still upsets her.

By the way DwP, I was pretty shocked when I first heard that idea, and thought it was 'political correctness gone mad'

When I gave it some thought I realised there might be something in it....

oh god that's horrible DWP

redadmiral imo it is 'political correctness gone mad'

Any argument that seeks to excuse or explain racism because of power imbalance/disadvantage etc is bolleaux

Saw a black American comedian on TV talking about the Big Brother 'N' word scandal.

He thought it was ridiculous because it was a young girl joking with a friend. He said 'If she's been wearing police uniform and carrying a gun it would have been different.'

Think we'll just have to agree to disagree, though as I said, I'm no expert.

Or even 'she'd'