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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Why can't we just all breatsfeed?

600 replies

pupuce · 15/11/2004 21:57

Seeing the recent debates on breastfeeding, I didn't want to take part in the discussion as I didn't feel I could add to the debate but I was reading this and thought.... why is it that so many women who ended up bottlefeeding have stories of "not enough milk", "baby not thriving", etc.... so we have a BF rate in this country of barely 1 in 2 babies breastfed after 1 week (that's not impressive if you do know that breast is best)... why is it that the Swedes have 98%....
I am sure it's a combination of factors.... but it does mean that too many people in this country have a "wrong reason" for not BF.... surely many women have not enough information about milk production to feel that they truly didn't have enough milk....

OK - am I starting world war 3 ??? hope not

OP posts:
kbaby · 16/11/2004 22:00

This thread is so emotive.
I bf DD whose 25 weeks. Ive been lucky in that I have never experienced any problems. But and heres the but. I started back to work at 21 weeks and expressed while at work. The problem is that I really do not have the time in work to express. The use of bottles during the day also mean that DD is not interested in bfeeding at home and instead preferes to look at the TV. I feel incredibly guilty that I have not made it to 26 weeks breasfeeding. However this is not created by pressure placed on me by other people. I myself am making myself feel guilty. I know all the facts about breast being best. But what do I do, do I give formula or struggle and get stressed out because i'm too busy in work to express and then feeling disapointed because DD turns her head away when I try to feed her.
I think the reason breastfeeding is not so popular is the need to return to work. I know that if I was a SAHM I would still be breasfeeding all day not just overnight.

madgirl · 16/11/2004 22:01

Dinny's ds is gorgeous

colditzmum · 16/11/2004 22:02

Nonono no foot, I am in 20's too, but I hold that I can just say 20's and let everyone assume I mean 21

mummytummy · 16/11/2004 22:05

kbaby, my best friend had this problem. Her DS has just turned one, and she is still feeding, and when she returned to work two months ago, he rejected her breast. What she found in the end, was that her DS really liked the last b/feed at night and first feed in the morning, because he was all sleepy and cuddly, so she just gives those two per day. Don't know if it will work for you, but it might be worth a try.

dinny · 16/11/2004 22:05

God, Kbaby, I'm going back to work at 26 weeks and want to keep on feeding ds. Sounds hard though. You've done really well. Please don't feel guilty.

Aw, bless, Madgirl. And so is your little smiler. And we are perfect multi-tasking mothers who manage two children perfectly, thank you very much. ps he actually goes to bed at 7pm! sans boob in mouth!

JoolsToo · 16/11/2004 22:08

well I 've posted on the other thread so I might as well do it here. Custardo's post could have been written by me - I just didn't want to - end of story.

There seems to be a lot of pomposity and people taking the moral high ground here - I can think of plenty of other more dangerous or damaging things mothers could do to or around their kids than not breastfeeding them! I would never argue that mothers milk is not the best but I am offended by the argument - vehemently argued all over this forum - that I have endangered my kids by bottle feeding or at least put them at risk. There's a lot of quoting of statistics - I prefer to get on with the job of mothering real little people to the best of my ability and fortunately I seem to have been successful - thus far anyway.

CarrieG · 16/11/2004 22:18

I haven't read all the posts but I feel very lucky that ds got the hang of bf straight away (I was completely clueless, but he took one look at the first nipple waved in his face at c. 30 minutes old, dived on it like something out of a Dracula movie & hasn't let up since).

So I'm supposedly doing exactly what you're supposed to do - & it's purely by luck, if I'd been faced with cracked nipples/bloodstained milk/screaming unhappy child etc I'd've had those bottles going IMMEDIATELY - & yet I still feel vaguely uncomfortable publically bf-ing in some circumstances: old friends &/or total strangers, fine. Male work colleagues, no. And if I take a bottle of expressed bm out with us, I sometimes feel this mad urge to explain to people (who probably couldn't care less) that it IS bm & not formula!

It never occurred to me before ds was born that the whole thing would be so fraught. I was bottle fed & I'm robustly healthy! Maybe a little LESS pressure to bf might have more productive results - I can recall feeling like a mutinous teenager at antenatal classes as yet another bf fanatic banged on endlessly & patronizingly...

Original poster
pupuce · 16/11/2004 22:20

Mumytosteven... yes but on the UK at 6 weeks it's 42% and 28% at 4 months.

If we look at statistics we could say that 2% of Swedish women never initiate BF whilst 31% do not attempt here.

OP posts:
ScummyMummy · 16/11/2004 22:20

Thanks Pagan

moondog · 16/11/2004 22:31

I don't understand the head in the sand aspect.
We know that breast is best, yet some of you seem to feel that because some people are neither able nor willing to breastfeeding, then it is unacceptable and unkind for others to point out the superiority of breastmilk over formula.

There are many things that are difficult to accept but are a fact. For example, I travel on planes at least 20 times a year for reasons beyond my control. I know that this is one of the most environmentally dstructive things that you can do, and as someone who tries very hard to live as 'green' a life as possible, it bothers me a great deal.
However I don't expect anyone to pat me on the head and say 'Well, it's not so bad, at least you recycle your bottles and have a compost heap'
I expect people to point out the discrepancies in my lifestyle and to point out the damage that i am causing.Living with that knowledge and dealing with it is the direct consequence of my actions.!

Many of you say you're fed up with breastfeeding mothers taking the high ground. Well I'm fed up with having to constantly worry about 'upsetting' a bottlefeeder because I've chosen to feed my kid in the way that nature intended.

leglebegle · 16/11/2004 22:33

To all the bottle feeders out there, and you know who you are I bf for 8 weeks and it didn't go well and for many reasons I gave up. I had a fabulous health visitor and she told me to cheer up and stop beating myself up about it. She said some women who bf do get a little evangelical about it (not all but some) and I have certainly met some like that myself. She said, many of those children would go on to feed on nothing but chicken nuggets and pizza's (oh to live in a world where we all had the time to make organic home made food!), so I had a life time of feeding my child good healthy organic food made my me to look forward to. This has always made me feel better about it, and I really make the effort to cook good food for ds1. No-one should feel bad for the choices they made, and I can tell you from experience I have a very good friend who was positively psychotic about how I should bf longer, and who now feeds her child nothing but chips. so there you go.

acer · 16/11/2004 22:34

Nature may have intended that once, but I feel bottle is best, less frustration, more sleep and a happier baby.

mummytummy · 16/11/2004 22:38

Moondog, you said that it isn't unkind to point out to somebody who can't breastfeed that they are giving their baby inferior milk? I think that is extremely unkind.

Gobbledigook · 16/11/2004 22:40

leglebegle and acer,

I love you.

x

acer · 16/11/2004 22:43

well thankyou gobbledigook, i love u 2!

cardigan · 16/11/2004 22:45

Got to agree with you moondog. I got some unkind remarks made to me on the other bf thread when I made comments bf being the best start in life. Don't want to drag you into this though.

MummyToSteven · 16/11/2004 22:46

absolutely agree leglebegle. there is more to our kids health and responsible parenting than bfing

acer · 16/11/2004 22:49

I really do not agree with the 'bf is the best start in life' absolute crap - I bf my ds2 for 4mths and he has terrible asthma, but once \i stopped he slept well and we were both a hell of alot happier. If bf doesn't work for you, what ever the reason, then give them a bottle, what is the point ofyou both suffering?!

cardigan · 16/11/2004 22:49

I also respect that some mums can't bf - as countess Dracula describes. If you can't bf for medical reasons then formula is the only way. I've experience of medication & bf so understand how difficult this can be.

CountessDracula · 16/11/2004 22:51

Oh I completely agree I think bf is the best start you can give a child. I do think that not everyone can do it. I agree it is odd that swedish mothers seem to be able to do it more as probably do most other nations. I don't know why. I just know I get sick of it being rammed down my throat.

cardigan · 16/11/2004 22:51

acer - it isn't "crap" - check out WHO, UNICEF, NHS , American college of pediatrics etc. If you know more than these people then please tell us!!

harrassedmum · 16/11/2004 22:51

Wasnt going to post, but was strangly drawn... With dd i was on my own, and the friends i had who had recently had babies and breastfed were happy but drained. I couldnt get the hang of it and thought i was more logical to use bottles not stress and drain myself cos that wouldnt be good for either of us.

Original poster
pupuce · 16/11/2004 22:52

Moondog

Now I am going to get some backlash....
These arguments that some BF are fed crap food later but "I" fed organic to my bottle fed child (now who's the better mother - do we have to be competitive ????) - or that my bottlefed child doesn't have any of these "diseases" that bottlefed babies are more likely to have but yet my niece is riddle with eczema and she was exclusively breastfed..... I mean what are these trying to prove ?

These are "make me feel good" personal stories but the facts on the positive effects of breastmilk versus formula for society as a whole and not on an individual basis.

OP posts:
paolosgirl · 16/11/2004 22:52

Well said, cardigan.

moondog · 16/11/2004 22:53

Well mummytummy, when people call me a destructive thoughtless idiot for travelling so much, it may be unkind but its true.

You are proving my point. Are we meant to lie to the bottlefeeders and tell them that formula is as good as or better than breastmilk when it is not?

This chicken nuggets and pizza thing. Crap food right? So is it unkind to point this out, or do we say nothing so as not to hurt the feelings of the people who choose to feed their kids this stuff?

Do we avoid the truth for fear of being perceived as unkind? It is precisely this thinking which has led to many instances of important information being witheld from people who have a right to know.

Sometimes th truth hurts, but as grown-ups, one would assume that we get over it.