Those of you who ff your baby -

[tasja]

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Er..these weren't.I mixed up the formula and poured them into huge bottles.

lol!
i thought you meant the cows were orphaned cos you formula fed your baby!!!!!
can you tell that the sleep deprivation is eating away at my brain........

I do have a certain sympathy with tasja's OP.

No one has to read the bf/ff threads, but they're pretty pervasive and some of them are difficult to ignore.

With the best will in the world, some of the posters are very evangelical about the subject.

And the subject is milk.

aaaah bless, sounds lovely
baby cows are sooooo cute, with their big brown eyes
canyou tell i'm veggie?!

... and why is it a silly thread?

Would you have made that comment on a pro-breast-feeding thread, baguette?

I understand your motives tasja

I ff.

"I am bewildered. Tasja wanted to breastfeed (see previous threads) and she had a hard time (baby born at 35 weeks - a really difficult age as the sucking and swallowing reflexes are not yet co-ordinated) with what sounds like very little real support. She then stopped after 3 days with the encouragement of her husband because she was getting upset about the feeding.

No one judged you, tasja. Anyone who knows anything about 'surprise' births and the pressures of a baby born a wee bit too soon for easy feeding will understand your decision, and be pleased you found it worked out well for you and your baby."

It's not very bewildering to me. I was in Tasja's position, more or less, and spent a long time being very upset about it. I don't suppose she wanted to start the thread to criticise people who are pro-breastfeeding. As someone who is still guilty and worried about having formula fed, who spent every day crying about and reading about breastfeeding for the first 6 months of my baby's life, sure - it makes me feel better to read about people who don't feel guilty about not breastfeeding and have happy, healthy babies. Maybe that was all she wanted to do. We all find different ways of feeling okay when the default position of being a mother seems to be guilt.

It's not a silly thread - maybe it's going to turn into a good chat. I too have had problems with bf ing both my girls and sometimes you need to feel that you're not the only one in the world who did!

If you aren't a pro-breastfeeder who didn't manage to bf for as long as you'd hoped, then you can't understand how much it can eat away at you.

Why not have some support for us ff feeders?

That was a good post, macneil.

macneil, maybe tasja will come on and explain herself. I contributed to the thread because she said she was 'fed up' with people 'debating' and saying how good bf was.

That to me is critical....and I am still bewildered .

I don't have any axe to grind with people talking about formula feeding and their personal reactions to it, positive or negative.

I have yet to see compelling evidence that there is any difference in the method of feeding with regard to long-term health.

For every anecdote you hear of a glowing bf baby, you hear of another who is failing to thrive, as is the case with ff babies.

I was a child of the 60s. In those days, very few women breast fed (or at least, a significant majority bottle-fed). At school in the 70's, I cannot recall a single child who suffered an allergy or associated illness).

Children seem more fragile these days, and whilst I don't think that has anything to do with milk of any source, the idea that breast milk will protect you from all manner of ailments is not proven ... not to me.

No one should be beating themselves up about their choices.

i ff both dc dont regret it and if i had another baby i would do the same, both kids are healthy, happy, thriving and clever

i ff and am happy with my choice, without it my child would not have had his feeding problem diagnosed until he had Failed to Thrive.....

i can understand wanting support from other ff mums the same as people may want support from bf mums!

I had a very similar start as Tasja, as dd1 was bron at 35 weeks and had no suck reflex.
Afetr 6 days of her not feeding and loosing what little weight she ahd, it was suggested that I ff. So I did and she gained weight and thrived. But I felt like a failure.

When I had dd2 I was dtermined to bf. She didn't suck really. And I didn't ever experience the let down that friend talk about. Or had any engorgement.
On day 3 the mw gently suugested ff.
Tis was after she'd spent 5 hours with us, trying to help establish bf.
Stiil felt like a failure though.

Perhaps the thread was not started to critise those who bf (paranoia thy name is mumsnetter!) but to make a connection with others who ff, perhaps who ff for similar reasons and people therefore she can make a connection with who have experienced any difficulties she is facing - attitudes about it etc.

Perhaps she wanted to talk about her ff feelings, and those of other people, with people who have been through the same.

I don't see how the thread is silly, to seek out people with whom you have something in common is not silly.

Was going to say pretty much what macneil said, but then my battery in my laptop ran out.

She said,

"That's just it - i'm fedup with everyone always saying to bf and how good it is. Always debating! "

You know, I just think before we all read that as fighting talk, it could just as easily be read as, she's tired of the pressure to breastfeed - which is there for a good reason, but is definitely pressure. Urgent threads saying 'how can we increase breastfeeding?' don't celebrate everyone's individual choice, even if they aim to provide a more informed choice - they state that some choices are not as good. Most of us here know a lot about the advantages of breastfeeding, and the threads - ALL GOOD THREADS! - are still a kind of pressure. So, the way I read it is, she's not criticising the pressure to breastfeed, she's maybe just tired of only being able to read that and wants a thread that makes her feel okay.

Anyway, um, I formula feed and yes, my baby has been very healthy, has had one cold (compared to my breastfeeding friend's baby's 4 colds) - so I'd like to say that being a bit of a shut-in internet reading weirdo with no friends is another excellent immune-system booster for your baby.

HOWEVER, I am paranoid as fudge that she will be overweight, is overweight, has no appetite-regulation mechanism and is a bit thick. (Actually, that last thing I'm blaming on her father's genes.) Just because of what I read, all those months I was reading obsessively about breastfeeding, and the disadvantages of ff. Well, and the fact that she is pudgy and weighs in at about the 99th centile. I think I'll only grow out of this when she's a gawky 16 year old. If I hadn't spent 6 hours a day pumping about 30mls of breastmilk to supplement the formula for the first 4 months, I might have had a nicer time in the early days. But now I sort of just laugh at myself. Mumsnetters, incidentally, when I was in the depths of my despair, told me I'd forget all about this one day, and I didn't believe them at all. I ALMOST believe them now.

Sorry, have been very gobby on this thread. But the fact that I still read the 'breast and bottle feeding' part of these boards, and not much else, sort of reveals that I still do seek some kind of reassurance.

Concur with Desiderata's last post.

I've tried to find the studies regarding the health benefits on the net but failed. I think it's fairly obvious that breastmilk is designed to give your baby everything he/she needs in the first months of life (or longer), you can't get a more natural food, but would love to read how they discovered it may prevent cancer for instance. The numbers involved, their genetic history, social group and so on. I'm told it's out there but where?

For the OP - I ff all 3 of my dc's (now in their 30's), all with no health or weight problems.

I agree with tiktok.

I stopped bf before I wanted to.

But I still want people to be encouraged to bf and be told how good it is.

To answer OP, I mix-fed from 4 months - so yes, I ff my baby.

i ff dd1+2 after 6 and 8 weeks. not proud of it.

i posted this the other day on another thread but ime, milk feeding is such a small part of the bigger picture, just wait til they are older and refuse everything you cook, and think its funny to spit it on the floor rather than eat. ds hardly eats a thing some days.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who has wasted hours thinking about breastfeeding and my lack of it, Macneil. I have tried to find support groups on the web but there is no support for ffeeders who feel so bad. I'm sure there are loads of us. Sometimes you feel like you're the only ff mother who spends 80% of her day feeling bad about it.

Two things made me feel better about it.

The first was giving up expressing breast milk, because I had to move to the UK from abroad and had to give the electric pump back and couldn't have sustained my supply through the jet lag. I'd never managed to produce more than a few drops and that constant failure, along with the latch failure, was there every day.

The second was switching to British formula. It is just SO MUCH nicer! Her poo went all babypoo coloured and nice (sorry! it had been tar black and liquid with the foreign formula) and in the bottle it looked much more like breast milk. I just felt all safe and happy and totally fine about giving it to her.

And then I chilled. ALMOST completely.