For those of you who can't understand why so many of us get our knickers in a twist about formula marketing and advertising..Have a look at this and you will. Believe me,you will

[moondog]

Nestle and the way they operate on Bangladesh. From today's Guardian

Oops, cross posted with tiktok

IF Nestle et all would truely care, they could so easily provide ready made Formula free of charge to those that can't feed for whatever reason in the 3. World....but you see, that is not the part the actually care about, they care about the profits only!

OMG yes I would assume that bottle is better than malnorished breast milk. But then I am from the side that HAD to bottle feed and was made to feel like I was feeding my baby poison from lots of Pro breast feeding people, so maybe this is should not be a thread I should be on!

and as a woman in the western world, uni educated, guardian reading and all that, i can tell you that when doctors tell you that you need to give your baby formula it's hard to retain your faith in BM.
so i don't thin kthat this is an attitude that is only prevalent in the undeveloped world, funnily enough, we are all mothers and sisters in this. it's just that in the undeveloped world the ramifications of moving to formula are often fatal. and nestle et al know that and don't care.

x-posted deegward. i would have thougth your experience might make you more, not less, keen that women in developing countries get bfing support.

I'm still waiting to find out whether deegeeward thinks there should be any restrictions on the marketing and distribution of any products.

This sort of economic libertarianism is a view - it holds that there should be no restrictions on anything , and that business can go ahead and create a want anywhere in whatever way they wish, and then supply it however they wish. Let the market decide - and people who are more powerful than other people can decide for them. I think this philosophy stinks, as it happens, but there are people who share it.

What choice does a mother have, if her doctor (who has been marketed to by the companies, and given presents and rewards) advises her to give her baby formula? The mother (illiterate, possibly, and poor...certainly poorer than the doctor) is not in a good position to arguue in that relationship?

You talk of 'choice' - bah!

See i don't see it as one or the other, more as the best thing at the time.

I would not apply the same argument to a developed country where it is safe to bottle feed. You had to give formula, it's bad if you were made to feel uncomfortable about that, but you could safely give formula knowing that it wouldn't kill your baby.

In a country with poor sanitation and contaminated water, it can be quite literally like feeding poison to your baby - the poison being the many dangerous waterborne illnesses.

deegward..yes, you are right, if the governemtns in those countries would care more for their own people then there would probably be a better infrastructure, i.e. there would be clean running water, etc....but fundamentally Nestle does know that there isn't therefore they shouldn't market a product to people that basically will kill a large number of Baby's

There is somewhere a brilliant, very sad, very shocking picture...not sure if it is on the LLL website, but a mother (from a 3. word country) of Twins fed one by breast and one by bottle, the bottlefed Baby is a scrawny lil thing, the breastfed Baby is well nourished....

No, my children see adverts of cheese strings, coco pops etc, but funnily I can make my own mind up whether they get them or not.

I kinda a freedom of choice type of person.

But deegward, your assumption that formula is better than the milk of a malnourished woman is wrong. There has been masses of research on this, surely you have to change your assumption in the face of factual evidence? A lot of people who did the research in the first place, probably also assumed the same as you, did the research, then found they were wrong so changed their view. That's what happens when you find out stuff you didn't know before - it makes you adjust your viewpoint.

Boco, no sorry someone on here said formula is not a subsitute for breast milk, it is inferior, ergo I did not do the best for my baby which I did

right. but if you don't have a clean water supply, if you are poor, if you live in an environment where antibodies are even more necessary etc etc etc, then when is the time going to be best to ff?

the doctor treating the dying children every days recommends it on prescription, so that people using it could do so properly. isn't that the best way?

If formula feeding contributes to illness and death in a society with poor healthcare facilities to remedy those effects, how can it ever be the 'best thing' at the time?

And please - do get yourself informed about the quality of breastmilk.

I am sorry your experience of breastfeeding was poor - but why this should make you an apologist for formula manufacturers' unethical marketing, I don't know...

I have said I was wrong on that point.

you did YOUR best, but you still gave your baby an inferior product to bm. so did i, by the way. we just ahve to suck it up, i'm afraid.

Well done Moondog. Everybody, keep up that boycott!!

I have seen a heartbreaking poster showing a mother with her twins - one healthy looking boy, the other, a girl, painfully thin. The mother had been told that she wouldn't be able to produce enough milk for both babies so she bf her son and formula fed her daughter. Shortly after the photograph was taken, the little girl died. Brings tears to my eyes every time I think about it.

And as for the 'it's their choice' thing - women in 3rd world countries are not given the information and education that we are, an illiterate woman living in a poor area will not be questioning her doctor, who is not questioning the corporations offering him incentives for pushing formula. There's no 'choice' there.

Again leaving this thread will leave you all to agree with each other on the evils of nestle.

this article kinda fits well with the topic, I think
I have not read this all though.

"it is inferior, ergo I did not do the best for my baby which I did"

Nonsense there is no ergo about it.

Formula milk is inferior to breast milk as a food for human babies. That is simply a fact, it carries no judgement and no implication that anyone who uses it is not doing the best for their own baby. You are reading an implication that is not there.

I formula fed my dd. It was an inferior form of food than breastmilk. I have no difficulty accepting that as a matter of fact, not opinion.

deegward, you're being silly again. where have you provided evidence that nestle aren't doing wrong here?

Last post for a long time, I DID NOT GIVE MY SON AN INFERIOR PRODUCT, THIS KIND OF BREAST FEEDING sh MAKES ME MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

correct GSS. except that i did have difficulties accepting it, for a good while. it hurts. but you get up and move on. i'm sure you will too, deegward.

Goodness, shouting something doesn't make it true you know.