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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Can we have an honest discussion about combined feeding

162 replies

LavalavalavaLamp · 20/06/2014 10:21

I am currently breastfeeding my 10 week old with 2 x 100ml formula top ups a day. This was born out of necessity as she wasn't gaining very much weight at all.
I resisted formula for longer than I should have for a few reasons which seem unimportant now:
I was told that the cereals in formula would stretch her stomach, increasing the chance of her being overweight in later life.
I was told that even a small amount of formula would have a negative impact on her gut.
I had in my mind that I wouldn't mixed feed, too much effort, I would do one or the other.
Also all the usual breast is best stuff all medical professionals tell you when you're pregnant.

I am now finding the mix effective in weight gain, sterilising bottles isn't that much effort and I still have the convenience of bfing most of the day and all night. I also now realise that the above is not necessarily accurate.

I am also told (again, I've no idea how accurate this is) that a new study shows no difference in bf or ff children.

I feel that the emphasis is on the benefit of exclusively breastfeeding but I wonder if mixed feeding is actually a much more practical solution for the health of both mother and child. What are your thoughts and experiences?

OP posts:
holdthephone · 20/06/2014 11:14

I can only speak from my own experience with my baby (currently 7 months) but I have loved mixed feeding.

We started giving a bottle of formula at night at about 2 weeks old so that I could get some sleep/ rest. I despised expressing so this saved my sanity when I desperately needed more than an hours sleep at a time.

I then used bottles if we were out and about as I could never get to grips with breastfeeding in public. I really liked it as it meant I could have a little break and I wasn't stressed about trying to do it discreetly etc- I have still not got to grips with that! Wink

I probably ended up doing 80% breast 20% bottle and now that's probably about 50/50 and slowly dropping down. I have absolutely loved mixed feeding and would do it for my theoretical next baby- but then I had no supply issues and my baby had no latch issues etc. I don't feel as though formula is poison.

NickyEds · 20/06/2014 12:16

I've mix fed my son-same as you it was born of necessity. I think that might be one of he problems with it- it is often seen as more "failure" to thrive or breast feed rather than a choice. I was distraught at having to top up initially but mix feeding has been great for us. I could give you a massive list of things we've done which I wouldn't have if I'd been ebf.

Of my group of say 20 mums most are now mix/f feeding (our babies are around 6 months). Of the 3 who are ebf I know 2 feel very restricted by it. I know in theory you can bf anywhere but in practice they don't. They seem to limit themselves to babyclubs where they can comfortably bf. Their babies feed for around 45-60 mins every 2.5-3 hours and although bf is said to be more convenient we often revolve our plans around them rather than the other way round.

It upsets me that whilst ebf is the gold standard of infant feeding it's sort of seen as the gold standard of motherhood too. An old acquaintance came up to me when I was bottle feeding DS and said "I assumed you would be feeding him yourself-I had you down as one of those ever-loving supermums for whom only breast was good enough!!". The inference being that a) I'm not super -true and b) I'm not lovingSad.

I think when I have another baby I'll mix feed again.

leedy · 20/06/2014 12:24

Though, fwiw, I EBF both kids and I didn't find it restricting at all (possibly because I have NO SHAME WHATSOEVER and have fed babies, eg, on a scree slope on the side of a mountain) - I agree it's not useful to present mixed feeding as some sort of failure (if it works for you, hoorah!) or that if you're a "good" mother you EBF, but I think it's equally not ideal to emphasise how difficult and laborious and isolating EBF is, like it's some kind of hideous martyrdom for all mothers who try it and only the pig-headed/hippy/self-sacrificing/deluded by mad boob propaganda fools actually do it (while the clever "realistic" mums mixed feed). For me it wasn't just "said to be more convenient", it genuinely was.

deepbluetr · 20/06/2014 12:41

"pig-headed/hippy/self-sacrificing/deluded by mad boob propaganda fools"

Nice.

leedy · 20/06/2014 12:53

Well, I may have paraphrased, but it's definitely an attitude I've encountered a lot, including from people who EBF - how much of a sacrifice it is (but worth it for the chiiiiiiildruuuuuun), what kind of special dietary restrictions you need to engage it to avoid colic/make "high quality milk", how if you EBF you shouldn't want to be away from your child or think of your own needs or want that second bottle, er, glass of wine, how EBF somehow requires knitting your own hemp deodorant lest you poison baby with your armpits etc. etc. It's just as unhelpful as the whole "let's idealize EBF but not give anyone any help whatsoever" notion.

Personally I EBF because I'm lazy and it works for me and my family, wouldn't do it otherwise.

Imeg · 20/06/2014 12:55

I think babies generally do best on whatever type of feeding works best for the mother, so I think mixed feeding should definitely be respected. Also, people shouldn't feel they have to switch entirely to bottles if EBF isn't for them for whatever reason. My 14-wk-old had formula from time to time in the early weeks while we got the hang of bf. Since then I've personally found bf more convenient than bottles and baby seems to be thriving but I am a bit alarmed that he now seems reluctant to take a bottle at all as it's nice to have the option of someone else taking over for a bit, so I'm planning to work on this. I definitely don't restrict myself to baby groups and despite being rather a shy person I have fed in pubs, Tesco, on trains/tube etc with the help of a large scarf. The only time I had trouble was when I was sitting on sloping ground for a picnic where there weren't any chairs and I just couldn't quite get comfortable.

FromPenToPaper · 20/06/2014 12:57

I had to mix feed from birth as both DS and I were ill immediately after delivery. I wasn't in any state to express for a day or so, and my DS was initially on a drip and then a NG tube. I managed to get bfeeding going in hospital and then went home mixed feeding. I was under a bit of pressure at the start about weight gain, even though my ds was massive at birth. The HV was concerned about him dropping centiles and wanted ebm/formula top ups for a while. Eventually I managed to move to 100% breastfeeding.

I did find sterilising etc to be a massive faff and was glad when I could stop. I really wanted to get to 100% breast feeding as I did find the reasons mentioned compelling. As a side issue, off the shelf formula is not vegetarian which was a big issue for me.

SecretSpeech · 20/06/2014 13:04

I think if mixed feeding works for you that's great, but I don't know anyone who EBF and finds it restrictive at all. For me it's 100 times easier not to have to carry around bottles etc

McFox · 20/06/2014 13:09

We're mix feeding too and it's working well for our 10 day old DS. I had an emcs under a general and DS ended up in the neonatal unit for a day while I was out of it. My DH had to feed him from a syringe for the whole 2 days, and while he's now happily bfing for the majority of the day, he gets to a point where he is hungry but doesn't want to bf anymore, but happily takes a bottle. This is mainly late at night and is great because my dh can do the feed then ds will pass out for 3/4 hours.

I'm expressing too and finding it easier to use this when we're out - I have massive norks and finding discreet bfing almost impossible!

All in, it's right for us, and he's back at his birth weight as of yesterday, so I'm happy that we're doing the right thing.

NickyEds · 20/06/2014 13:29

I should really have said that out of the 3 still bf 2 find it restrictive but the third thinks it's fab. Her little one drains a boob in 5 minutes flat, she can express a bottle in 10minutes and has never had any pain. She feeds anywhere and everywhere. It would certainly be more of a hassle for her to mix.It's different for everyone.

Imeg · 20/06/2014 14:22

I was a bit annoyed when I phoned one of the breastfeeding helplines, and while the lady had lots of good suggestions which did help with breastfeeding, when I mentioned that I sometimes gave some formula she spent ages telling me that giving any formula at all would a) make my supply dry up and b) start an inevitable slippery slope towards formula only. I don't feel this was terribly helpful, and reflects the 'either or' view that seems to prevail about feeding.

cadidog · 20/06/2014 14:45

I've loved mixed feeding my 5 month old. Anyone who complains about sterilising bottles must be using complicated bottles or something because it takes no time at all. I carry an empty bottle and a bottle of instant formula with me in case I go anywhere I'm not happy feeding and that's it.

He gets one bottle of formula as his dream feed and I can leave him with DH/family as required. I've never felt any guilt about mixed feeding. I literally knew no one who kept breast feeding their baby beyond 2 weeks (rates are really low) so I'm just really chuffed to have made it this far.

tiktok · 20/06/2014 16:36

The attitudes expressed on this thread are examples of the unpleasant judgmentalism that pits mother against mother in a battle where defensive postures and name-calling really don't help anyone. and which risks undermining mothers in their ability to make a decision they feel comfortable with.

Even the phrase 'formula is not poison' is a ridiculous one...no one said it was, and if someone expresses an idea vaguely equivalent to this (ie that women giving formula are poisoning their children), then they are clearly deluded, and/or not very pleasant, and we should probably feel sorry for them.

I live in the real world, as do all of us.

People say the wrong things sometimes, or say things that are ambiguous and come out 'wrong'. NickyEds, your friend who talked about
"I had you down as one of those ever-loving supermums for whom only breast was good enough" didn't imply you were not loving, FGS. Instead, she was having a little dig at some imaginary mothers who think they are supermum for not using bottles.

Mothers who are comfortable with using breast and bottle for convenience reasons are not really making a comment about women who do breast only martyring themselves, are they? Really? If they say 'I couldn't do breast only, and don't want to sacrifice my time/body/freedom for it' how about cutting them a bit of slack, leedy and not assuming they are calling you 'pig headed' for doing something different?

It's mad to equate any feeding experience with a 'gold standard', it's mad to have a 'gold standard', and it's particularly mad to equate this with a 'gold standard of motherhood'. Who does this? For real? If they do, they are not reflecting a widespread attitude because most people couldn't care less what individual mother B and individual baby B do - as long as Baby B is loved and cared for.

The facts are pretty clear. The best health outcomes are seen in babies who are exclusively or predominantly breastfed for six months. In a first world country like the UK, the impact on an individual baby of non-exclusive breastfeeding is likely to be very small.....but guess what, the health reasons are not why women want to exclusively breastfeed. Mostly, women want to breastfeed without anything else because that's how they feel they want
to nourish their babies....by themselves with no manufacturered/commercial product. They love the idea that their bodies can do this terrific thing, and they want to experience that physical and emotional connection with their babies.

Unless they have very strange views, they don't think that everybody ought to feel the same way.

I don't think statements such as 'babies do best on what suits the mother best' are helpful, either, unless we are talking about the emotional well-being of mothers, which may plummet if she is breastfeeding and hating every minute and her baby...in which case a switch to formula may actually serve them both better. A mother with (for example) very damaged nipples may 'suit' formula feeding better, but she persists with breastfeeding, and gets treatment/help to fix the nipples. Her choice. Also her choice to switch.

Whatever - keeping attitudes 'moderate' and not exagerrating imagined or even real attitudes encountered here on in real life helps the whole thing much more than over-blown reactions to (imagined?) slights and comments from others.

Phew :)

Sillylass79 · 20/06/2014 16:50

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leedy · 20/06/2014 16:51

That's a great post, tiktok, and sorry if I fanned the flames of, er, inflammatoriness. Think I'd had a couple of recent bad experiences (and as I said, some of the worst "EBF as martyrdom" shite I've heard has been from a minority of fellow EBF mothers, keen to point out how much they've given up for the good of their offspring - apparently even my enjoying having time away from my children was somehow questionable) that makes me go all knee-jerky in response to posts that mention how inconvenient and restrictive EBF is. Agree with all the points you've made!

Cannotbelieveit · 20/06/2014 16:54

Tik tok Smile agree

Sillylass79 · 20/06/2014 17:00

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leedy · 20/06/2014 17:00

"we must at all costs say again and again that breastfeeding leads to optimum health"

Do we, though? I don't think anyone (eg health professionals, WHO) is really saying it "at all costs", eg continue to tell women to EBF even if the baby is failing to thrive or if the mother is miserable and/or too ill to BF. I think it can sometimes come across that way if it's badly worded, or we internalize it as a standard we have to live up to. At the same time, I don't think the message that BF is optimal should be somehow muted just so people who can't EBF won't feel bad about it - as you say yourself, many people can't/don't eat the recommended optimal diet, some people take "optimal eating" to an obsessive orthorexic extreme, but we don't have the health message "X diet is best for you! But it's ok if you don't always do what's best for you! And don't get obsessed with it!", I just assume the latter bits are implied.

tiktok · 20/06/2014 17:03

'S okay, leedy :)

Sillylass I am not saying that the way people feed their babies is not related to an emotional decision.....yikes! Of course it gives rise to emotions! These are our babies and we love them and we have to keep them alive and healthy!

I am saying that it is not helpful for these emotions to be directed into comments about other mothers, or for the temperature of the discussion to rise high enough to undermine other mothers.

Phrases - all of them either meaningless, or myth-based, or just not soundly-base, that I'd like never to see again:

'formula isn't poison'

'if you use formula you destroy the virgin gut'

'if you look at a classroom of 5 year olds, you can't tell who's been bf or ff'

'my sister bf/ff/mixed fed her babies, and they are always ill/never ill/in perfect health/look ill'

'I'm sick of people saying that if I ff, my baby's going to be fat/thick/criminal/ill'

Actually, I have a whole list of un-fave phrases, but I'll stop there for now :)

Sillylass79 · 20/06/2014 17:11

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leedy · 20/06/2014 17:15

Yes, PND is vile. I had the opposite problem, in that one of the few things I didn't have crazy PND obsessions about was breastfeeding and I actually felt quite good about it - yet had a couple of idiot health professionals try to give me "permission" to give up so I could "get some rest and get better", including one who told me (wrongly) that I couldn't BF on antidepressants ("but that's probably for the best, isn't it?").

Sillylass79 · 20/06/2014 18:06

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tiktok · 20/06/2014 18:45

Sensible points, sillylass. There is the biology and physiology of 'lactation' and the relationship and personal and emotional stuff of 'breast feeding' which is nuanced and individual.

holdthephone · 20/06/2014 19:24

Tiktok- I agree with your post. The reason I said 'formula is not poison' is that I have had a 'jokey' comment while out and about that it is.Hmm

tiktok · 20/06/2014 20:27

I get you, holdthephone....don't agree with you repeating the phrase, though, sorry, even in response :)

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